Injury Report: Mitchell Marner ankle injury (will miss at least 4 weeks)

[ACC1224]

Why so much talk about Hyman, did he injure Marner?

He's held back the top players long enough.

 

[Morbo]

we will see.
you my be disappointed .

disappointed how?

 

[saltming]

well, the other logical reason is that Mikheyev looks a lot better than hyman on that line right now.

Right now, but as my post said, let's look at the line with marner.
I'm all for moving Mikheyev up to the 1st line.

 

[hector morrison]

Regardless of the system, you'll always need puck retrievers.
IMO, everything is done to help the Team succeed, not just individuals.

Isn't it possible to find a 'retriever' that is more offensively gifted?

 

[ACC1224]

Isn't it possible to find a 'retriever' that is more offensively gifted?

I would think so. Is the cost worth the return though?

 

[zeke]

Right now, but as my post said, let's look at the line with marner.
I'm all for moving Mikheyev up to the 1st line.

don't look now but AJ might be on the verge of an explosion too.

 

[zeke]

Isn't it possible to find a 'retriever' that is more offensively gifted?

not hard, really.

here's some: Matthews, Nylander, Johnsson, Mikheyev, Tavares, Marner, Spezza, Kapanen, Kerfoot, Moore, Engvall.

 

[hector morrison]

Zach can play a lot of ways. Goat and Lindholm are just not fast enough Zach is.

Looks like he has lost a half step. Hasn't been as effective on the PK .Maybe he gets it back in time,maybe not. Tough injury to bounce back from. Ray Ferraro commenting said recovery is really a good 9 months if you don't re-tweek it. Other athletes I know have said ,you never get it back.

 

[JT AM da real deal]

Looks like he has lost a half step. Hasn't been as effective on the PK .Maybe he gets it back in time,maybe not. Tough injury to bounce back from. Ray Ferraro commenting said recovery is really a good 9 months if you don't re-tweek it. Other athletes I know have said ,you never get it back.

Maybe but deserves his shot in mid December when Mitch gets back to see how it goes. Never bet against Zach he has pushed limits against all odds since he was a kid.

 

[hector morrison]

I would think so. Is the cost worth the return though?

Not sure he is as valued league wide as some here think! So ,likely ,the answer is no! For me,I would hope to try someone in house. Micky might be able to capitalize on some Marner set-ups more often. The recent 'style' of play might allow Zach to be used elsewhere. Personally,I think he could help Spezza with Engvall on the other side. But ,it will be interesting either way when Marner returns. Keefe has many combinations to choose from.

 

[saltming]

don't look now but AJ might be on the verge of an explosion too.

Agreed. Fun problem to have.
Imo AJ will still produce with kerfoot and spezza. Mich might need a bit more skill around him to get more points

 

[hector morrison]

not hard, really.

here's some: Matthews, Nylander, Johnsson, Mikheyev, Tavares, Marner, Spezza, Kapanen, Kerfoot, Moore, Engvall.

The thing that always bothered me is that although Zack will be one of the few to go and try to get the puck(a much needed aspect on this team),but he wasn't all that successful when you consider that he didn't always win a battle and more importantly,he didn't do much with the puck when he did win.I learned to expect a lousy shot ,blind pass. Also,if the play was not a 'dump in' he was usually ignored.

That other coach put him in front of the net,which I originally laughed at,because he doesn't have JVR hands or Andreychuck type ability. However,he does seem to hang in there and take the punishment that comes with that. He can block the goalies view and keep a Dman or two concerned,so even if it goes in off his arse ,it might be of use. I just don't see that opportunity for him to use it all that often. Guys who can tip those shots in and scramble for loose pucks in front are valuable...maybe he can get good at it. Tough job though.

 

[hector morrison]

Maybe but deserves his shot in mid December when Mitch gets back to see how it goes. Never bet against Zach he has pushed limits against all odds since he was a kid.

I agree that a player should not lose his job to injury. Not really fair. So ,I believe that line will be re-united. So be it...I hope they rock! However,reality might be that Micky is better suited and if the new coach is curious about that ,then Zack could be on a different line for a bit . Can always put him back there if it doesn't work out!

 

[zeke]

Agreed. Fun problem to have.
Imo AJ will still produce with kerfoot and spezza. Mich might need a bit more skill around him to get more points

remember that AJ was a super elite 23yr old gamechanging stud MVP for Keefe when he won his Calder.

 

[ACC1224]

Not sure he is as valued league wide as some here think! So ,likely ,the answer is no! For me,I would hope to try someone in house. Micky might be able to capitalize on some Marner set-ups more often. The recent 'style' of play might allow Zach to be used elsewhere. Personally,I think he could help Spezza with Engvall on the other side. But ,it will be interesting either way when Marner returns. Keefe has many combinations to choose from.

Yeah, I don't think it is set in stone he will play there for the season but I imagine they will reunite the line and run with it until it shows it doesn't work. Adding a more offensively skilled player doesn't necessarily mean the line will be better. Contrary to popular thought, Babcock wouldn't be the leagues only Coach who would value Hyman.

They have to be careful with Mikheyev until he is re-signed.

 

[saltming]

remember that AJ was a super elite 23yr old gamechanging stud MVP for Keefe when he won his Calder.

Yup! Always loved the player and that's why he would have success on the 3rd line whereas soup may need some help, being his first year and all

 

[LeafGrief]

ES p/60/p1/60

18/19 2.01 (marner 2.94, tavares 2.86)
17/18 1.82 (matthews 2.94, nylander 2.40)
16/17 1.31 (matthews 2.24, nylander 1.83)

As we all know well, he has always been a distant 3rd wheel on any line he has played on.

If we have 9 better forwards, there is no need to give hyman a spot ahead of them just because Babcock loved him.

We don't have nine better forwards than Hyman. Hyman's 2.5 year ES p/60 is 2.05 and his p/60 over last season was 2.29 (5th on the team). Both of those numbers obliterate Kerfoot's current 1.3 and are comparable to Kapanen and Johnsson (who have 2.06 and 2.25 since the start of last season). Hyman has obviously been the third wheel on his lines, but he's a productive third wheel and it is utterly incorrect to assume that he's in his current position only because Babcock loved him.

By all means, we should be playing him about 3-4 minutes less per night at ES, but the numbers do not actually make the case that we have nine better forwards than him. They put him about 8th'ish.

 

[zeke]

Yup! Always loved the player and that's why he would have success on the 3rd line whereas soup may need some help, being his first year and all

Remember that 23yr old AJ was a far better player for Keefe than 23yr old Hyman was.

So was 23yr old engvall, 20yr old kappy, and 22yr old timashov.

 

[zeke]

We don't have nine better forwards than Hyman. Hyman's 2.5 year ES p/60 is 2.05 and his p/60 over last season was 2.29 (5th on the team). Both of those numbers obliterate Kerfoot's current 1.3 and are comparable to Kapanen and Johnsson (who have 2.06 and 2.25 since the start of last season). Hyman has obviously been the third wheel on his lines, but he's a productive third wheel and it is utterly incorrect to assume that he's in his current position only because Babcock loved him.

By all means, we should be playing him about 3-4 minutes less per night at ES, but the numbers do not actually make the case that we have nine better forwards than him. They put him about 8th'ish.

Eh, depends on how much you consider linemates.

I.e most of the time, kerfoot was putting up those numbers as the best offensive player on his line, not as by far the worst, like hyman did.

 

[MyBudJT]

remember that AJ was a super elite 23yr old gamechanging stud MVP for Keefe when he won his Calder.

Super elite 23 yr olds don't play in the AHL...

 

[Vaive50]

Isn't this supposed to be a Marner injury thread. I came here to see if anybody had any recent updates since it has already been 3 weeks but all I'm reading about is Hyman and AJ.

 

[Fonzieleaf]

Isn't this supposed to be a Marner injury thread. I came here to see if anybody had any recent updates since it has already been 3 weeks but all I'm reading about is Hyman and AJ.

Agreed, people need to stop derailing the thread.

 

[tmlms13]

The thing that always bothered me is that although Zack will be one of the few to go and try to get the puck(a much needed aspect on this team),but he wasn't all that successful when you consider that he didn't always win a battle and more importantly,he didn't do much with the puck when he did win.I learned to expect a lousy shot ,blind pass. Also,if the play was not a 'dump in' he was usually ignored.

That other coach put him in front of the net,which I originally laughed at,because he doesn't have JVR hands or Andreychuck type ability. However,he does seem to hang in there and take the punishment that comes with that. He can block the goalies view and keep a Dman or two concerned,so even if it goes in off his arse ,it might be of use. I just don't see that opportunity for him to use it all that often. Guys who can tip those shots in and scramble for loose pucks in front are valuable...maybe he can get good at it. Tough job though.

You know who that sounds like? Tomas Holmstrom.

 

[saltming]

Remember that 23yr old AJ was a far better player for Keefe than 23yr old Hyman was.

So was 23yr old engvall, 20yr old kappy, and 22yr old timashov.

Better at scoring, yes but that does not necessarily mean a better player.
Hyman has his use and the chemistry with marner and Tavares is good, no denying that

 

[LeafGrief]

Eh, depends on how much you consider linemates.

I.e most of the time, kerfoot was putting up those numbers as the best offensive player on his line, not as by far the worst, like hyman did.

If you're going to consider linemates for Hyman then you need to consider linemates for Johnsson and Kapanen as well. Hyman has third wheel numbers, but Johnsson's are also primarily third wheel. And frankly, I don't think that linemates merits giving Kerfoot over a 50% boost in production. Johnsson is undoubtedly a better player than Hyman, but I don't think you're giving Hyman nearly enough credit despite him having good production numbers. He's a productive player.