Player Discussion Mitch Marner

[hotpaws]

Ok, so you wanna extend Marner and give him another NMC (which is a given these days) so we're stuck with first round exits for the next 8 years and without an opportunity to make change?

how does re-signing MM guarantee us first rd exists for the life of his deal ? do you actually believe he's the sole reason we've been getting knocked out early every year ?

it's much better to get change from letting JT walk if he doesn't waive his nmc and use his 11m cap hit to significantly change the roster

 

[Nineteen67]

He probably hates that the media is driving this narrative that he must trade his most productive playoff performer.

One of the media driving this is a former nhl player with over 1200 games played and was at ice level broadcasting the series and he used the word “disinterested” when describing Mariner’s play.


Any honest person that watched the series has to report what they saw. The boy dishonesty I see comes from those that try rewrite history.

 

[rumman]

After the first few games, he stops producing.

He's not "the scapegoat", plenty of blame to go around but he's supposed to be an elite point producer and if he keeps fading into nothingness when the pressure is on, he deserves his share of blame and it's a pretty big share. For an 11 million cap hit, he needs to do more than kill penalties and as far as him being on those special teams, how much praise do you want to heap on him for that when those special teams suck and blow in the playoffs as they've been doing.

Yes JT has also been a massive disappointment but I think everyone agrees that we're not paying him big money after his contract is up. What baffles me is why would we want to commit to Marner for another long term deal at top dollar?

Change may or may not produce better results, that's obvious. But isn't it even more obvious by now that rolling it back isn't going to work? 1-8 in playoff series, we could be 1-11 three years from now with Marner still disappearing when the pressure is on and locked up for another 6 years at top dollar, how does that picture look?

Moving on from Marner is risky. But giving him another sweetheart of a contract at this point seems more risky, a lot more!

Heavy lies the crown, or in Mitch’s case crown of thorns. More appropriate for a “God………”

Status quo is keeping the core together. We're already committed to 3 of the 4 so Marner is the only part we can still move on from.

If you think changing a few Dmen and signing Murray and whatever else we've done is going to make us serious contenders instead of 1st round fodder, you're dreaming. The core is the same, shuffling around the spare parts around them and expecting different results makes no sense, even if "7 players are no longer leafs on July 2".

They’ve done the same thing for years, and it hasn’t translated into success because they keep ignoring the real problem, and that’s the core players……..

 

[supermann_98]

My guess is Mitch won’t waive, which is certainly within his rights. It was never going to be easy.

100% within his rights.

Just like when a certain segment of fans decide to boo Mitch. As a paying ticket customer that is also certainly within their rights.

 

[GoonieFace]

100% within his rights.

Just like when a certain segment of fans decide to boo Mitch. As a paying ticket customer that is also certainly within their rights.

Boo-ing people is just weird. Based on Marners regular season career, there will not be too many chances to boo him.

 

[supermann_98]

Boo-ing people is just weird. Based on Marners regular season career, there will not be too many chances to boo him.

Considering he takes the first month to get into game shape (based on his historically slow starts in both the NHL and OHL) I'd say there will be plenty of opportunity

 

[VanW27]

Boo-ing people is just weird. Based on Marners regular season career, there will not be too many chances to boo him.

I think Marner should be traded, and have for a while. That said, if he's here in October, which it looks like he will be, I'll fully support and hope that he figures it out in the playoffs, even if I think that's unlikely.

The "hate" is just so bizarre to me. Even if you believe he is the number 1 issue holding this team back, it's the organization that gave him the contract, didnt trade him while they could, gave him a NMC, and wont pressure him to waive it now.

If there's "hate" to have for anyone it should be the team.

 

[conFABulator]

I don't know how likely this is, but the best thing that could happen now would be for Mitch to sign an eight-year extension for $80M.

If he is wants to be a Leaf (and therefore would waive his NMC) then he can show that for signing up long term for less than he was making before. We give him fill NMC again and if he continues to under deliver come playoffs then we try to trade him in the future. He has more value locked in at that number and he gets to pick his spot. It could be a win/win for this situation, possibly the only one. I don't like the idea of him walking for nothing or playing for a contract this year.

Also, JT should signed a four year extension at $3M per year. He should also offer to give up his C for Matthews (or trade it for an A).

We want a culture change? New GM (last year), new Coach, new Captain, players taking less to be Leafs (or remain Leafs), re-built D, a wave of young players stepping in and contributing on ELCs or second deals, and $9M more to spend next year just because MM and JT took less.

This all starts with Marner being an easy re-sign a year early.

 

[Kazparov]

I think Marner should be traded, and have for a while. That said, if he's here in October, which it looks like he will be, I'll fully support and hope that he figures it out in the playoffs, even if I think that's unlikely.

The "hate" is just so bizarre to me. Even if you believe he is the number 1 issue holding this team back, it's the organization that gave him the contract, didnt trade him while they could, gave him a NMC, and wont pressure him to waive it now.

If there's "hate" to have for anyone it should be the team.

Agree with all of this. I don't hate him , I saw what I needed to after the Montreal series

 

[Gary Nylund]

One of the media driving this is a former nhl player with over 1200 games played and was at ice level broadcasting the series and he used the word “disinterested” when describing Mariner’s play.

Any honest person that watched the series has to report what they saw. The boy dishonesty I see comes from those that try rewrite history.

Yeah that's the thing about Marner, when the chips are down, it's like he goes and hides in the corner or something. It's weird how some people still seem to worship this guy, post a bunch of numbers that are supposed to impress us and make forget how useless he is in the biggest moments. I just don't understand how people can be happy with a guy who's one of the highest paid players in the league, plays like a star for 86 games and then ... it's like a switch is flipped and he goes from being a star to being a non-factor in the blink of an eye.

I can't say I've seen anything like it in 50+ years of following NA pro pro sports and the thought of being subjected to another 9 years of this disappearing act is not a pleasant one.

 

[GoonieFace]

I think Marner should be traded, and have for a while. That said, if he's here in October, which it looks like he will be, I'll fully support and hope that he figures it out in the playoffs, even if I think that's unlikely.

The "hate" is just so bizarre to me. Even if you believe he is the number 1 issue holding this team back, it's the organization that gave him the contract, didnt trade him while they could, gave him a NMC, and wont pressure him to waive it now.

If there's "hate" to have for anyone it should be the team.

Well said. I don’t like Marner as a player, he is talented no doubt, just don’t think he has that extra gear. I think they should trade him, but if they can’t, it’s on the team for handing out the NMC on top of the overpay.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I don't know how likely this is, but the best thing that could happen now would be for Mitch to sign an eight-year extension for $80M.

If he is wants to be a Leaf (and therefore would waive his NMC) then he can show that for signing up long term for less than he was making before. We give him fill NMC again and if he continues to under deliver come playoffs then we try to trade him in the future. He has more value locked in at that number and he gets to pick his spot. It could be a win/win for this situation, possibly the only one. I don't like the idea of him walking for nothing or playing for a contract this year.

Also, JT should signed a four year extension at $3M per year. He should also offer to give up his C for Matthews (or trade it for an A).

We want a culture change? New GM (last year), new Coach, new Captain, players taking less to be Leafs (or remain Leafs), re-built D, a wave of young players stepping in and contributing on ELCs or second deals, and $9M more to spend next year just because MM and JT took less.

This all starts with Marner being an easy re-sign a year early.

The best thing that could happen now IMO is that Marner agrees to waive his NMC and then we move his whiny ass out of town ASAP.

JT signing for that amount would be amazing but I wouldn't count on it considering he's probably worth twice that, if not more.

An extra $9m won't make that much of a difference, not as much as people think anyway. There's always players who will be getting raises, next year it'll be McCabe and Knies to start with. Hell we'll probably be paying more for Marner too, smh.

Agree with all of this. I don't hate him , I saw what I needed to after the Montreal series

I don't hate him either, I just hate the way he disappears when the pressure is on.

 

[notbias]

One of the media driving this is a former nhl player with over 1200 games played and was at ice level broadcasting the series and he used the word “disinterested” when describing Mariner’s play.


Any honest person that watched the series has to report what they saw. The boy dishonesty I see comes from those that try rewrite history.

I am sure you can find NHLers that speak well about him too, I know Oates did, but I am not sure who else I could find.

My post wasn't referencing a single series either.

He produces the most of our players, that's a fact, and that's all I said.

The media is pushing that Marner must be traded, maybe Treliving doesn't like it.

Never said he should or shouldn't be traded, just there are other ways to interpret how he answers a question that he gets asked daily other than frustration that he can't trade the player.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Then trade Nylander. You don’t need 2 wingers making 12 million dollars.
And you can’t win with a core who all have the same struggles with playoff style.
In the end it’s going to be very difficult. Management has made so many bad decisions it’s hard to fight against that and playoffs.

Nylander can play centre, has nowhere near the "struggles with playoff style", and is making less than $12 while Mitch likely will be making more than $12. Plus he's already signed.

And I do agree about all the bad decisions by Dubas that have put us in this position.

 

[notbias]

Nylander can play centre, has nowhere near the "struggles with playoff style", and is making less than $12 while Mitch likely will be making more than $12. Plus he's already signed.

And I do agree about all the bad decisions by Dubas that have put us in this position.

Nylander has outscored Marner in one playoff.

They tied 3 times.

Marner outscored Nylander 4 times.

2/3 of the most recent years Marner produced more, they tied this year.

Nylander is not struggling anywhere close to how Marner is.

 

[DarkKnight]

Sorry if this has already been posted, even with my ignore list I can't be bothered to read most of the garbage here. Interesting.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1808225909188841814

 

[egd27]

Leave it to the NHL to implement a hard cap but ignore that teams that play in no tax states have an unfair advantage.

aren't those the states where they are trying to "grow the game"?

Meanwhile the higher tax teams get to revenue share with them

 

[conFABulator]

The best thing that could happen now IMO is that Marner agrees to waive his NMC and then we move his whiny ass out of town ASAP.

JT signing for that amount would be amazing but I wouldn't count on it considering he's probably worth twice that, if not more.

An extra $9m won't make that much of a difference, not as much as people think anyway. There's always players who will be getting raises, next year it'll be McCabe and Knies to start with. Hell we'll probably be paying more for Marner too, smh

I wanted him to waive too. The only way we were getting any fair value for him was if we waived and we got some pieces along with cap space we could use on free agents that could make us better this year. Those guys are signed now. There is not getting better this year by trading him.

I am not a MM hater and I don't believe ai have ever hear Mitch whine, so I am not sure how we call him a whiner. The best way to get value IMO is a to extend him (at a discount), hope that he grows under Berube and if not, trade him with an extension next year. He will eventually waive, we don't even know if he was asked to this year.

What's your plan on exactly? Trade him wher? For what? How do we get better now or in the future with this plan?

 

[notDatsyuk]

I don’t see Matthews goalscoring as being dependent on Marner tbh, but I agree with the sentiment. Matthews played a lot of last season without Marner

Most goals and points in the season he spent the least time with Marner?

 

[rumman]

Nylander can play centre, has nowhere near the "struggles with playoff style", and is making less than $12 while Mitch likely will be making more than $12. Plus he's already signed.

And I do agree about all the bad decisions by Dubas that have put us in this position.

Neither player is worth their respective contracts, in fact Mathews isn’t worth what he’s paid and will move on to a real contender the minute his deal expires……..

 

[Stephen]

Then trade Nylander. You don’t need 2 wingers making 12 million dollars.
And you can’t win with a core who all have the same struggles with playoff style.
In the end it’s going to be very difficult. Management has made so many bad decisions it’s hard to fight against that and playoffs.

At the end of the day we don’t need any of them.

We don’t need Shanahan’s ultra conservative fear based management. We don’t need Auston Matthews. Or Mitch Marner. Or John Tavares. Or William Nylander. Or Morgan Rielly.

These guys aren’t setting a particular high bar that needs to be cleared. And if they were any good it wouldn’t be this hard. In a typical year, 8 teams get farther than Toronto in the playoffs, and winning a Game 7 in the playoffs doesn’t normally look like a 70s club team squeaking past an all-star team from the Soviet Union.

There’s nothing particular special about this group and I don’t see why we need to be so married to them any more than a Minnesota Wild fan might be to their roster.

 

[rumman]

At the end of the day we don’t need any of them.

We don’t need Shanahan’s ultra conservative fear based management. We don’t need Auston Matthews. Or Mitch Marner. Or John Tavares. Or William Nylander. Or Morgan Rielly.

These guys aren’t setting a particular high bar that needs to be cleared. And if they were any good it wouldn’t be this hard. In a typical year, 8 teams get farther than Toronto in the playoffs, and winning a Game 7 in the playoffs doesn’t normally look like a 70s club team squeaking past an all-star team from the Soviet Union.

There’s nothing particular special about this group and I don’t see why we need to be so married to them any more than a Minnesota Wild fan might be to their roster.

Best “state of the nation” I’ve read in a long time………..

 

[Zero1]

Sorry if this has already been posted, even with my ignore list I can't be bothered to read most of the garbage here. Interesting.

https://x.com/i/web/status/1808225909188841814

Well I guess this is confirmation that he’s staying then.

 

[DarkKnight]

Well I guess this is confirmation that he’s staying then.

At least to start the year, should his contract not get resolved, I still think the drum banging intensifies and he’s gone at deadline.

 

[Canadian Finn]

Marner is already getting booed.

My wife showed me some social media video (i hate the shit, and am not on anything) of some cottagers boo'ing him while he's out on the boat with his wife.

I'm sure you could find it if you search enough.

Marner pretended he didn't notice but his wife wasn't happy about it.

It has only just begun. When he steps out in public he will be reminded what a bitch he is.

He'll be Gravano'd in no time.