Player Discussion Mitch Marner Part Infinity

[thewave]

With Rantanen we would still lose to FLA.

Stolarz and Rantanen. Not sure. I liked this team could have done it. Took them to 7games

 

[Craig Button]

Stolarz and Rantanen. Not sure. I liked this team could have done it. Took them to 7games

Rantanen is softer than Marner doesn’t penalty kill and would probably fail hard in Berube’s dump and chase game.

We would probably be out in Round 1

 

[Craig Button]

Stolarz and Rantanen. Not sure. I liked this team could have done it. Took them to 7games

Healthy Stolarz and we would have won the series

 

[Nineteen67]

Healthy Stolarz and we would have won the series

That and a first line center, a number 1 D to run the PP and….

 

[Mess]

Leafs were a Mikko Rantanen away from still competing in the final 4.

An opportunity at a Cup torn away by and unwanted player with only his own interests at heart.

 

[mikeyz]

If Marner signs in Florida I don't want to see a single person on this board defend him no matter how big a fan of his they are. That would make it clear to me that those posters are Marner first, Leafs second. Not acceptable.

That would pretty much be the apex of cowardice on Mitch's part and would completely validate absolutely everything the anti-Marner posters have been parroting for years. I don't expect it to happen. If he thinks he's hated now he wouldn't believe how persona non grata he'd be in the entire province if he does something like that.

Have you seen the way Florida plays in the playoffs? Marner is literally the exact contrast of that.

Zito isn’t that stupid. Trust me. They won’t sign him.

 

[Gabriel426]

It's also pure, unadulterated greed. Like it's totally within Marner's remit to go get what's his - but it's also totally fair to call him out on putting his own personal well-being above the team's.

If there was no salary cap or a luxury taxed based system, I don't think anyone would really care if he was haggling over $12M vs. $14M and just focus on his on ice suitability.

If there is no cap. People will still give a crap for their playoffs disappearance act. But Leafs could also offer MacKinnon, Drai, Hyman, McD, Makar, Bennett, Rantanen, Ekblad and whoever twice the salary of the next team and sign those guys. Which then our core 5 would most likely be playing their true roles which is the Beta or Charlie role and be good at it.

Like AM would literally be 3C behind McD and MacKinnon. Hyman with McD and Drai but won’t be on PP1(McD, Drai, Mack, Rantanen and Makar). Knies will probably be 2LW with Mack and Rantanen, MM might be a better fit on the 3D line with JT and AM. The forth line would be Laughton-Bennett and Willie.
Reilly will be bottom pairing, as Makar, Ekblad, Tanev and Carlo will be on the right side while McCabe, OEL, Reilly and Benoit on the left side.

 

[Sundinisagod]

Naa, its all about money for money Mitch. Uncle Marleau taught him and Matthews. Marleau signed a 2 year contract between 30 and 31 years, Matthews is a UFA at 30 Marner wants the same. He wouldve signed for 13.5x2 but Tree wanted long term. Same $%^& as last contract negotiations.

View attachment 1041901

I agree he wants a short term deal. He can sign his long term deal when the cap jumps up significantly more, like Matthews is planning to. He will get paid as if in his prime, around ages 30-38, won’t have to take a pay cut in his mid 30s like Tavares. The downside to this strategy is risk of injury, but for Marner, he’s got more chance of getting hurt playing water sports at the cottage than hockey.

 

[Gabriel426]

Suppose the Leafs could retain Marner for around $13 million and acquire Bjugstad for about $3 million, totalling $16 million.

Would you prefer Marner and Bjugstad for $16 million, or a different pair like Boeser and Duchene for the same amount?

I’d take Marner and Bjugstad any day—and keep in mind, it’s not even guaranteed the Leafs could land players as skilled as Duchene or Boeser who probably look elsewhere. The Leafs alternative is probably worse than guys like Boeser and Duchene.

The Leafs winning percentage over the last 2 years without Marner is under .500. Yet they are 18-2-1 without Rielly. I'm down for change, but keep Marner, and boot Rielly... and let each of the big 3 run their own line. That's how we achieve balance and maintain regular season dominance, while continuing to give our selves a chance to break thorough. With Carolina getting dominated by Florida, it's clear the Leafs are the 2nd best team in the Eastern conference. They might be the 2nd best team in the world, having takin Florida to 7 games. It's basically 1. Florida and 2. Edmonton/Toronto/Dallas. Why would we downgrade our team just because we're 2nd out of 32 teams. It's a huge risk and likely to fail.


Knies – Matthews – Domi
Laughton – Tavares – Marner
McMann – Bjugstad – Nylander

Can this lineup beat the Panthers?

This is essentially the same lineup that got blown out 6-1 in the last two home games.

I don’t think Bjugstad is the difference between winning and losing those two games against the Panthers.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[Sundinisagod]

At Marner’s current cap percentage, I think he’d be at 12.78 million on next years cap.

It’s pretty crazy to think, that 6 years later and now as UFA, and he’s still not worth his cap hit percentage.

I know it’s just my opinion, but it doesn’t look like he’s worth it to any contenders either, if the rumoured suitors are true.

 

[Confucius]

At Marner’s current cap percentage, I think he’d be at 12.78 million on next years cap.

It’s pretty crazy to think, that 6 years later and now as UFA, and he’s still not worth his cap hit percentage.

I know it’s just my opinion, but it doesn’t look like he’s worth it to any contenders either, if the rumoured suitors are true.

Oh it’s not just your opinion. lol! I’ve been saying all year long the only fair deal is 11. He may get an overpayment from somebody but it shouldn’t be us.

 

[fahad203]

Carolina will offer him the money they were offered Rantanen
Apparently Carolina offered Rantanen 8 year 100 million. They'll have no problem offering that to Marner

 

[Racer88]

Carolina will offer him the money they were offered Rantanen
Apparently Carolina offered Rantanen 8 year 100 million. They'll have no problem offering that to Marner

Or maybe Carolina is looking for a proven playoff performer and would have no interest in a playoff failure

 

[Sundinisagod]

Oh it’s not just your opinion. lol! I’ve been saying all year long the only fair deal is 11. He may get an overpayment from somebody but it shouldn’t be us.

I wouldn’t take him back at 11 but that probably is the right number.

 

[fahad203]

Or maybe Carolina is looking for a proven playoff performer and would have no interest in a playoff failure

Sure it's possible. They may go after someone like Bennett as well.
Slim picking this year.

 

[Confucius]

Carolina will offer him the money they were offered Rantanen
Apparently Carolina offered Rantanen 8 year 100 million. They'll have no problem offering that to Marner

I’d think not after all Rantanen 43 goals in 97 playoff games, Marner 13 goals in 70 games. I wouldn’t think Canes see them as equals

 

[fahad203]

I’d think not after all Rantanen 43 goals in 97 playoff games, Marner 13 goals in 70 games. I wouldn’t think Canes see them as equals

No doubt. But they do have a fill a key spot. Marner can still get you 100 points if he plays with Aho and Schev. They both need a passer
Marner was a point per game player in playoffs and kills penalties

Considering how much trouble they are having putting the pucks in net, he's the only player I can think of Hurricanes going after

 

[Maple Leaf]

low ball him

 

[WilliamInLondon]

If there is no cap. People will still give a crap for their playoffs disappearance act. But Leafs could also offer MacKinnon, Drai, Hyman, McD, Makar, Bennett, Rantanen, Ekblad and whoever twice the salary of the next team and sign those guys. Which then our core 5 would most likely be playing their true roles which is the Beta or Charlie role and be good at it.

Like AM would literally be 3C behind McD and MacKinnon. Hyman with McD and Drai but won’t be on PP1(McD, Drai, Mack, Rantanen and Makar). Knies will probably be 2LW with Mack and Rantanen, MM might be a better fit on the 3D line with JT and AM. The forth line would be Laughton-Bennett and Willie.
Reilly will be bottom pairing, as Makar, Ekblad, Tanev and Carlo will be on the right side while McCabe, OEL, Reilly and Benoit on the left side.

yep. It'd be like watching the Premier League in which you either support 1 of 4-5 competitive teams, or you support a feeder team which loses its best homegrown players to one of these 4-5 teams. In addition to being a Leafs fan, I'm also an Arsenal fan, so I've dealt with a lot of pain over the years.

 

[Gabriel426]

yep. It'd be like watching the Premier League in which you either support 1 of 4-5 competitive teams, or you support a feeder team which loses its best homegrown players to one of these 4-5 teams. In addition to being a Leafs fan, I'm also an Arsenal fan, so I've dealt with a lot of pain over the years.

I am a Gunners fan too. Started back in the day with Bergkamp as I am a Dutch fan

 

[Racer88]

I’d think not after all Rantanen 43 goals in 97 playoff games, Marner 13 goals in 70 games. I wouldn’t think Canes see them as equals

I can’t think anyone would see them as equals

 

[Gabriel426]

I can’t think anyone would see them as equals

Yep bc MM fans think MM is much better than Rantanen

 

[WilliamInLondon]

Alluded to this in another thread, but below is a summary of Marner's equivalent ask for each NHL city when factoring in 1) cost of living between Toronto and NHL city X; and 2) Net Salary in Toronto vs. NHL city Y.

This is a pure like-for-like tax and purchasing power parity comparison. Assume that the 8th year is a red herring in this model (but is a potential factor in actual negotiations). Assume that Marner's asking price from Toronto is $14M USD given that he turned down $13.5M X 8 earlier.

Conclusions

1) Unless he has a complete change of heart after "talking to his family (and agent)", he gone bro lol. The effective tax rate that he'd pay in Toronto at his income is 53.53%

2) It is no surprise that the teams that have no state tax are able to field much more competitive teams due to a 25-30% PPP advantage (Dallas, Tampa, Florida).

3) So just for some perspective, Rantanen's $12M AAV in Dallas is $13.3M AAV in Toronto lol. So even had that trade gone through with Carolina, I don't think the Leafs would have got Rantanen on $12M AAV. Probably closer to $13.3M - is everyone cool with that? lol

Table

The bolded capitalized teams below are the ones in which I think there would be mutual interest.

NHL Team	Required Gross Salary (USD, millions)
Anaheim Ducks	17.11
Boston Bruins	15.40
Buffalo Sabres	11.20
Calgary Flames	11.90
Carolina Hurricanes	11.90
CHICAGO BLACKHAWKS	13.30
Colorado Avalanche	11.90
Columbus Blue Jackets	10.18
Dallas Stars	10.98 (* previous calculation error)
Detroit Red Wings	11.90
Edmonton Oilers	11.90
FLORIDA PANTHERS	10.55 (* previous calculation error)
Los Angeles Kings	17.11
Minnesota Wild	11.90
Montreal Canadiens	11.90
NASHVILLE PREDATORS	11.90
New Jersey Devils	15.40
New York Islanders	18.58
New York Rangers	18.58
Ottawa Senators	14.00
Philadelphia Flyers	11.45
Pittsburgh Penguins	11.45
San Jose Sharks	17.11
Seattle Kraken	11.45
St. Louis Blues	11.90
TAMPA BAY LIGHTNING	11.70 (* previous calculation error)
TORONTO MAPLE LEAFS	14.00
Utah Mammoth	12.72
Vancouver Canucks	14.98
VEGAS GOLDEN KNIGHTS	11.85
Washington Capitals	11.45
Winnipeg Jets	11.90

 

[centipede2233]

No wonder Gaudreau went to Columbus, they have the lowest number