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NHL Talk Miscellaneous NHL Discussion CIX: Processing a Tremendous Amount of Insane Information

deadhead said:
If the Flyers had traded for Jiricek, I'm sure I'd be reading 20 pages of posts declaring that they overpaid, that Jiricek was overdrafted and really not that good . . .

Jiricek is certainly not worth a #5, anymore than Drysdale was worth a #6.
Jiricek just turned 21 and is in the AHL. That's not the profile of an elite prospect.
Doesn't mean he won't turn out to be a good D-man, but we're not talking a murder's row here:
Werenski
Provorov
Severson
Christiansen
Fabbro (waived by Tenn)
Jordan Harris
Jack Johnson (38)

Even Minnesota ain't rolling out an allstar team on defense:
Middleton
Faber
Chisholm
Spurgeon (34)
Merrill (32)
Bogosian (34)
Brodin (31)

Yet both teams sent him to the AHL.
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I thought a longer stint in the AHL has never hurt anyone

Surrounded By Ahos said:
I've got over 500 users on ignore and it's made hf so much more tolerable.
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How the hell did I survive?
 
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Hollywood Cannon said:
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I read the study. My biggest thoughts:

1a. The interquartile range for these brains was 51 with an age range of 33-71. There was no brain by brain breakdown. IQR in this case is pretty....weird. I'm not discrediting the study, but they should be breaking down the brain groups by age, because then it would show us the more relevant (read also: more recent) data. It shouldn't take a neurologist to figure out people who played in the 70s and 80s (the older brains) would show a tremendously higher rate of CTE vs more recent brains, what with the rules changes, helmet tech changes, the fact that more players actually wear helmets and mouthguards as time passes, etc. In other words, 42 brains out of 77 exhibited signs of CTE; is this data skewed by a bunch of dudes who played in an era where head injuries were not taken seriously? I would lean yes, but we don't know. Big weakness to the study imo

1b. I understand this is an inherent issue with CTE. To my knowledge you can't find out if a person has CTE without an autopsy. That means any data is going to lag behind by 2 generations since you have to wait for people to die; it doesn't show what's happening now. Which is unfortunate, but you can reasonably conclude the steps taken by the sport have significantly reduced CTE prevalance as it has already been shown better and more frequently worn helmets/mouth guards and rules changed have decreased the incidents of concussions, who's frequency serves as a surrogate market for CTE development

2. Looks like every single brain that died by suicide had CTE. Additionally, it was the most common cause of death. First off, sheesh. Second off, this sample is heavily, heavily skewed, and this shows exactly why. Let me explain

These brains were donated by loving family members. People would be more inclined to "investigate" the brain of someone who exhibited symptoms of CTE vs not. In other words, wouldn't we all like to know what's going on with Antonio Brown? Perhaps Eric Lindros, who suffered a thousand concussions? Nolan Patrick, with his headache issues? How about Evander Kane, considering his erractic gambling and how he treated his ex wife? Now, what about Claude Giroux? Just your everyday, normal hockey player who's has a few concussions at the NHL level? You can see how the brain submission process can be biased toward CTE vs not. And as stated, with the leading cause of death in the CTE brains being suicide, it kind of makes sense.

This is not me discrediting the study. But it is healthy to critically think about these things because it helps not only with context but also how to improve the methods of future studies to reduce bias, which I think we all agree are needed. Doctors are literally taught how to read and analyze studies in school for this reason
 
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DancingPanther said:
This is not me discrediting the study. But it is healthy to critically think about these things because it helps not only with context but also how to improve the methods of future studies to reduce bias, which I think we all agree are needed. Doctors are literally taught how to read and analyze studies in school for this reason
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Good breakdown.
Selection bias is a big problem in these kinds of studies.
Ideally you'd do a random sample of each cohort but obviously that would be kinda difficult.

I'd be curious if anyone had numbers on the incidence in the general population.
 
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deadhead said:
Good breakdown.
Selection bias is a big problem in these kinds of studies.
Ideally you'd do a random sample of each cohort but obviously that would be kinda difficult.

I'd be curious if anyone had numbers on the incidence in the general population.
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Likely similar issues here but...

Researchers Find CTE in 345 of 376 Former NFL Players Studied | Chobanian & Avedisian School of Medicine

www.bumc.bu.edu www.bumc.bu.edu

For comparison, a 2018 Boston University study of 164 brains of men and women donated to the Framingham Heart Study found that only 1 of 164 (0.6 percent) had CTE. The lone CTE case was a former college football player. The extremely low population rate of CTE is in line with similar studies from brain banks in Austria, Australia and Brazil.
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What we really need is the ability to test before the person dies. I understand it's caused by a buildup of a certain protein in the brain that effects the function of neurons. Hopefully some brilliant scientist develops a test.
 
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Curufinwe said:
Looking forward to a future where helmets have some kind of super gel in them that actually prevents head injuries.
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I was in pure hockey a few weeks again and I think it was Bauer that has a helmet out that cost over $600 and had some very interesting padding in there. Wasn't in the market for a helmet so didn't pay much attention but the price of the helmet made me take a look at it. Now, it might be a great helmet, but how many people are going to drop $600+ on a helmet?
 
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Cody Webster said:
I was in pure hockey a few weeks again and I think it was Bauer that has a helmet out that cost over $600 and had some very interesting padding in there. Wasn't in the market for a helmet so didn't pay much attention but the price of the helmet made me take a look at it. Now, it might be a great helmet, but how many people are going to drop $600+ on a helmet?
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If i bought a 600 dollar goalie helmet that would be my way of telling my fiance "I hope to forget you in the next 15 years"
 
I guess that Richardson deserved to get the axe but he had little to work with for a roster. It didn’t help that Michkov and Cellebrini are off to the kind of starts that they have. It makes Bedard pale in comparison a bit.
 
renberg said:
I guess that Richardson deserved to get the axe but he had little to work with for a roster. It didn’t help that Michkov and Cellebrini are off to the kind of starts that they have. It makes Bedard pale in comparison a bit.
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Not sure about Bedard situation, but flyers not being able to communicate with michkov is some 90s shit. Meanwhile Celebrini lives with Thornton.
 
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