Minnesota Wild General Discussion - 2023-24
- Thread starter TaLoN
- Start date
He let in some ranged shots that shouldn’t go in, and was inconsistent at times, but I thought he finished out the season well after he was called out. He gave up a few too many early goals that then snowballed into more while our team was playing loose trying to catch up, and the bottom two pairs were a complete mess for a large chunk of the season which did not help provide any support. I can still see him outplaying that contract in the coming seasons and as mentioned, the term and amount are not at all an issue holding us back for a guy that is essentially our starter.
- Dec 10, 2012
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Middleton is a run of the mill bottom pair defenseman. Maybe I'm off base here on what those guys tend to earn, but 4x4 is a lot for what he is. It's probably not a lot for the role he's been playing, but that's the same issue that led to Foligno getting 4x4 too, guys getting paid for a role they filled rather than what they are.
That said, I wouldn't have as much of an issue with Middleton getting the 4x4 as I do with Foligno because Middleton is still relatively young without the injury history Foligno has, and he does seem to click well with both Spurgeon and Faber. But still, LD is one of the spots we need to upgrade if we want to be a real team, and that would result in Middleton being pushed down to the bottom pair.
- Dec 10, 2012
- 39,878
- 18,225
- Dec 10, 2012
- 39,878
- 18,225
In my heart, I agree with you. In my head, it's only one year and it'll be fine.
Yes they do. I'm not saying MAF was good last year either. Trying to say Gus was better than MAF is just false and neither of them were worth their contracts. The team goaltending cost MN making the Playoffs.
The PK was terrible last year outside of goaltending too. So I can't lay that all on the goalie's feet. I also weigh the ~2k even strength mins a bit heavier than the ~200 PK mins that the goalies each see over the course of a season.
Skaters need to show up for special teams too. So that makes Zucc a steal at $4m/yr, right?
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
- Dec 10, 2012
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I mean I get it. I said it would be mostly neutral and only maybe a little bad. But it's not worth getting excited about. It's not a good deal for Wild.
- Dec 10, 2012
- 39,878
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If Goalie A lets in 3 5v5 goals and 1 in all other situations, and Goalie B lets in 1 5v5 goal and 4 in all other situations, Goalie B let in more goals.
If you value sample size, let's also include the year before last when we compare them.
Even all strengths MAF had slightly better GAA.
TBH I'd say their all situations stats are a relative tie. There isn't one that was definitivly better than the other by any means.
It's not 1 goalie gave up 2g and the other gave up 5. They were both giving up 3 goals per game.
I'll for sure take the 10x larger sample size of even strength play compared to PK time. As for things that are more easily correctible. Everything with the team PK was an abnormality compared to years past. The even strength d-zone play was the same quality for the team as the same years past though.
When you have a goalie tandem that was worse than the Dub/Stalock combo things need to change at that position. Not just run it again and hope for the best.
Gus is one year removed from being a top 5 goaltender. The goaltender that needed to be swapped out was Fleury for Wallstedt.
- Dec 10, 2012
- 39,878
- 18,225
If all situations stats are a relative tie, you look at the year before
If you like bigger sample sizes, you look at the year before
No matter how you approach it, Gus comes out on top. Gus has been the better goaltender since coming to Minnesota. His contract was easily justifiable when it was signed. If you feel something needed to change, you should be way more upset about the Fleury extension.
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
- Dec 10, 2012
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I would do a different prospect, which probably works out anyway, because Ottawa already has Sanderson, Chabot, Kleven and Brannstrom at LD.
Where is he going to fit??
Brock faber: extending also
Jonas brodin
Spurgeon
Jacob Middleton: getting extended on July 1st
Not worth having money committed to 5Dman
Conceptually it’s fine with a reasonable contract, but I am personally not a big fan of the player, just from assorted viewings. If it happened I wouldn’t be upset. If the Middleton rumor is true, I don’t see this happening though.
Dr Jan Itor
Registered User
I'm not super into +/- for reasons that are pretty commonly known, but I think there might be something with:
Sanderson +8
Chabot -3
Zub +5
Bernard-Docker -7
Hamonic -10
Chychrun -30!!!!
Sanderson +8
Chabot -3
Zub +5
Bernard-Docker -7
Hamonic -10
Chychrun -30!!!!
In theory, he would "fit" by pushing Middleton down to the 3rd pair.
- Dec 10, 2012
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In theory, he easily pushes Middleton down. I would put him on a pair with Faber and call that the top pair.
If Guerin's plan is to keep Middleton as a top four D and not try to find an upgrade there, we're not going very far. Spurgeon is getting worse and more injured, Brodin is Nick Schultz with better marketing. You can't have those two playing prominent roles and also have Middleton as your 4D for much longer, and expect to win much of anything.
He's a flawed player, definitely more offensive than defensive, but he's still a good #3, and he just turned 26
That’s a great question.
I saw that too. I just think it’s about time we start trading LD prospects for players that will actually impact the roster.
Brodin-Faber
Chychrun-Spurgeon
Middleton-Bogosian
Don’t re-sign Middleton.
Russo has already basically on last podcast said the extension will be announced on July 1st as 4 by 4 with him. Basically it’s happening
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