Confirmed Buy-Out [MIN] Zach Parise and Ryan Suter

[mattihp]

Both should find new teams quite quickly. Depending on what role they would demand..

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

I get Parise but I don’t get Suter. I probably woulda just waited both of them out though. Definitely Suters

The problem is, and i think a lot of people forget or don't realize, is that Suter (and Parise) only make 2M-1M-1M the last 3 years in their contracts.

Suter has made over 100M in his career. There's a good chance he'd retire early and when that would be is completely up to the player, and their feelings on it can change. Basically, you can't really plan ahead. He could've come up to you after next season at a random time and tell you oh by the way, i don't want to do this anymore.

Normally cap wise this wouldn't be an issue, but in this case there was going to be cap recapture penalties. Basically, the Wild were doomed for a couple years of dead cap no matter what.

Buying Suter out now at least comes with some benefits. ED suddenly became a non-issue + lots of cap space this year to do something. Later on there would've been no benefits whatsoever.

Obviously, it's not a typical buyout in a sense that, the Wild im sure aren't happy about losing a good player. But in the long-term, it's probably the right move.

 

[TS Quint]

That's because you don't want to see the path. You want to talk shit before the offseason has even really started.

Next year Rask comes off the books. That's $4M. Zuccarello's NMC becomes a 10 team no-trade. There is $10M. Parise and Suter's cap hits go up $8M. There you go. There is the way to keep the players they get this offseason.

im not talking shit. You’re just a little sensitive because you can’t make sense out of it either. I’m trying to understand why this dead cap space makes sense. You try to blindly defend it (for some reason)but your reasoning has zero logic. Then you fall back to wanting me to trust Guerin that 14m in dead space is a great way to go. The only reasoning that has made sense was the poster who told me they are wanting to do some retooling. You telling me Guerin wants to get younger (cheaper) and better (somehow) and I should just trust that doesn’t fly. Everyone would do that if that was so easy. No one is trying to be old, overpaid and bad.

 

[MuckOG]

im not talking shit. You’re just a little sensitive because you can’t make sense out of it either. I’m trying to understand why this dead cap space makes sense. You try to blindly defend it (for some reason)but your reasoning has zero logic. Then you fall back to wanting me to trust Guerin that 14m in dead space is a great way to go. The only reasoning that has made sense was the poster who told me they are wanting to do some retooling. You telling me Guerin wants to get younger (cheaper) and better (somehow) and I should just trust that doesn’t fly. Everyone would do that if that was so easy. No one is trying to be old, overpaid and bad.

How difficult is it for you to grasp that the 14m in dead cap space would exist if they were on the roster or not? Would you not agree that two guys counting $7.5m each against the cap while sitting in the press box all season as healthy scratches is, in fact, "dead space"?

 

[Sota Popinski]

im not talking shit. You’re just a little sensitive because you can’t make sense out of it either. I’m trying to understand why this dead cap space makes sense. You try to blindly defend it (for some reason)but your reasoning has zero logic. Then you fall back to wanting me to trust Guerin that 14m in dead space is a great way to go. The only reasoning that has made sense was the poster who told me they are wanting to do some retooling. You telling me Guerin wants to get younger (cheaper) and better (somehow) and I should just trust that doesn’t fly. Everyone would do that if that was so easy. No one is trying to be old, overpaid and bad.

Now you're trying to project your inability to comprehend a fairly simple concept onto me. Nice. Maybe if I put it in a math equation you'll get it.

$5M in cap space this year + $1M in cap space in 2022 > Having Zach Parise on the roster for any of the next 4 seasons

$5M in cap space this year > Having Suter on the roster this year

The only way these buyouts end up being a bad decision is if Parise and Suter provide more value on the ice than the players we use the cap space on. If Suter plays like a top 4 D in years 2-4 of the buyout, this could look pretty stupid, but Guerin said Suter was going to face a drastic reduction in ice time next season. These guys are going to be 37. So let's see the contracts these guys get this offseason and if they can live up to them. Or you can just continue your current flamingo routine of sticking your head in the sand and acting like there is zero possibility that these buyouts could actually prove to be a smart move.

 

[TS Quint]

Now you're trying to project your inability to comprehend a fairly simple concept onto me. Nice. Maybe if I put it in a math equation you'll get it.

$5M in cap space this year + $1M in cap space in 2022 > Having Zach Parise on the roster for any of the next 4 seasons

$5M in cap space this year > Having Suter on the roster this year

The only way these buyouts end up being a bad decision is if Parise and Suter provide more value on the ice than the players we use the cap space on. If Suter plays like a top 4 D in years 2-4 of the buyout, this could look pretty stupid, but Guerin said Suter was going to face a drastic reduction in ice time next season. These guys are going to be 37. So let's see the contracts these guys get this offseason and if they can live up to them. Or you can just continue your current flamingo routine of sticking your head in the sand and acting like there is zero possibility that these buyouts could actually prove to be a smart move.

No need to get upset.

The Wild are going paying for Suter either way. He would still be in the running for top mins with the Wild next year. He has value and the Wild could still make part of that contract useful for at least 2 years. Why not wait if the Wild are paying full freight any how?

With the track record of players retiring before the end of their long contracts and Parise’s trajectory I doubt he lasts longer than 2 years before LTIR.

this just seems personal.

 

[MuckOG]

No need to get upset.

The Wild ogre paying for Suter either way. He would still be in the running for top mins with the Wild next year. He has value and the Wild could still make part of that contract useful for at least 2 years. Why not wait if the Wild are paying full freight any how?

With the track record of players retiring before the end of their long contracts and Parise’s trajectory I doubt he lasts longer than 2 years before LTIR.

this just seems personal.

You act as if its easy for a team to just assign a player to LTIR. For that to happen you need two things:

1) The player has to have verifiable injury. Can't just be worn down or no tread left on the tires. And since Parise is no longer playing, it would be difficult for him to get injured to go on LTIR
2) The player has to agree to go on LTIR. If they feel like they can still play, they aren't going on LTIR.

Both Suter and Parise want to play and I don't blame them. While I was caught off guard with the Suter buy out, I also understand the reasons for it and time will tell if it was the right move.

 

[Kristopher Letang]

I’m not defending the 14M deadcap but it’s cool to see a GM who doesn’t get caught up in the success hype and stick to the original plan.


Last season was an anomaly, the plan was always to rebuild and 4 years is enough to get the prospect pool you need.

 

[Al Lagoon]

After a couple days of reflection, I'm pretty happy with Guerin's decision. I've alway wanted the Wild to be a draft and develop kind of team, and it looks like I'll get my wish for the next several years. They've drafted well the last couple years, and have 2 1sts this year. Instead of the usual bare cupboard of the Fletcher years, they have NHL-ready prospects, and the promise of a steady stream if the drafts continue to go well.

 

[48g90a138pts]

Was buying out Suter a better option than making a trade at 50% retained?

I'm a little confused

 

[MuckOG]

Was buying out Suter a better option than making a trade at 50% retained?

I'm a little confused

Trading Suter would create the risk of triggering the cap recapture penalty, should Suter retire or get bought out by the team he was traded to.

 

[MNRube]

Was buying out Suter a better option than making a trade at 50% retained?

I'm a little confused

Yes because the cap recapture if he retires elsewhere would be much much worse.

 

[48g90a138pts]

Yes because the cap recapture if he retires elsewhere would be much much worse.

Trading Suter would create the risk of triggering the cap recapture penalty, should Suter retire or get bought out by the team he was traded to.

Is there any reason to believe Suter is going to retire early? He's been fairly reliable his whole career.

If he was planning on retiring the Wild could have traded for him to come back and figure a LTIR situation out or something.

Idk this is a crazy buyout lol

 

[MuckOG]

Is there any reason to believe Suter is going to retire early? He's been fairly reliable his whole career.

If he was planning on retiring the Wild could have traded for him to come back and figure a LTIR situation out or something.

Idk this is a crazy buyout lol

With the risk of recapture hanging over Guerin's head, how could he possible allocate that money to other players? And players who are planning on retiring just can't go on LTIR, they need to have an actual verifiable injury.

It's a crazy buyout because the NHL screwed over the Wild by retroactively punishing them for contracts they they had to approve. It doesn't really make any sense.

 

[GuerinUp]

With the risk of recapture hanging over Guerin's head, how could he possible allocate that money to other players? And players who are planning on retiring just can't go on LTIR, they need to have an actual verifiable injury.

It's a crazy buyout because the NHL screwed over the Wild by retroactively punishing them for contracts they they had to approve. It doesn't really make any sense.

ya we wouldve had to talk him into an ATV trip with james sheppard

 

[Uncle Scrooge]

Is there any reason to believe Suter is going to retire early? He's been fairly reliable his whole career.

If he was planning on retiring the Wild could have traded for him to come back and figure a LTIR situation out or something.

Idk this is a crazy buyout lol

His actual salary for the last 3 years combined was 4M. That's 3.8% of his career earnings total for playing 3 seasons. This upcoming season was the only season left where he was making fair money (6M).

I mean you never know but Zetterberg and Hossa LTIRed the minute their salary dropped.

And unlike those guys, Suter doesn't have any health problems as of yet at least.

 

[48g90a138pts]

His actual salary for the last 3 years combined was 4M. That's 3.8% of his career earnings. This upcoming season was the only season left where he was making fair money (6M).

I mean you never know but Zetterberg and Hossa LTIRed the minute their salary dropped.

And unlike those guys, Suter doesn't have any health problems as of yet at least.

With the financial pain teams have endured, it's surprising neither one of these contacts were movable besides the NMC's they had. It would be interesting to know if Bill Guerin even tried to move either one or both of them.

Guerin must be speculating with great confidence one or both are going to retire early.

What a gut punch for the Wild

 

[MuckOG]

With the financial pain teams have endured, it's surprising neither one of these contacts were movable besides the NMC's they had. It would be interesting to know if Bill Guerin even tried to move either one or both of them.

Guerin must be speculating with great confidence one or both are going to retire early.

What a gut punch for the Wild

Even if they don't plan to retire early, Guerin would still need to keep open the cap space in case they did.

 

[grimmel95]

With the financial pain teams have endured, it's surprising neither one of these contacts were movable besides the NMC's they had. It would be interesting to know if Bill Guerin even tried to move either one or both of them.

Guerin must be speculating with great confidence one or both are going to retire early.

What a gut punch for the Wild

why is this a gut punch for the Wild? We as fans were hoping Parise was off this team this coming year whether via trade or buyout and some of us could already see Suter slowing down. This just sped up the process of removing 2 older players with 1 not contributing at all and another where the GM said his ice-time would significantly reduced this upcoming season. Seems like a win for the Wild with all things considered.

 

[islesfan186]

Both will be Islanders.

I’m fine with that. Suter can take Leddy’s spot and Parise can play with JGP and Wahlstrom on the 3rd line

 

[Goose312]

The problem is, and i think a lot of people forget or don't realize, is that Suter (and Parise) only make 2M-1M-1M the last 3 years in their contracts.

Suter has made over 100M in his career. There's a good chance he'd retire early and when that would be is completely up to the player, and their feelings on it can change. Basically, you can't really plan ahead. He could've come up to you after next season at a random time and tell you oh by the way, i don't want to do this anymore.

Normally cap wise this wouldn't be an issue, but in this case there was going to be cap recapture penalties. Basically, the Wild were doomed for a couple years of dead cap no matter what.

Buying Suter out now at least comes with some benefits. ED suddenly became a non-issue + lots of cap space this year to do something. Later on there would've been no benefits whatsoever.

Obviously, it's not a typical buyout in a sense that, the Wild im sure aren't happy about losing a good player. But in the long-term, it's probably the right move.

Either retiring would have been less dead cap per year than they are paying now after buying them out. If one retired after next season with the Wild the dead cap would be 6.2 million for 3 years. The actual dead cap from the buyout is 6.4 million, 7.4 million and 7.4 million over those same 3 years, and then 833,333 for the next 4 years. If either retired after 2 seasons the dead cap would be 6.5 million for 2 years vs the 7.4 million dead cap they have thanks to the buyout.

Plus now the Wild have to replace them. Even if they were both riding the bench as 13th forward and 7th defender you now need a 700k+ contract instead.

They do get to protect Dumba now, but he's not the player he was before the peck injury. He's been a 30 point defender who doesn't defend well. RHD is also the only position where the Wild have 2 seemingly NHL ready prospects making him pretty much the easiest to replace player on the roster.

 

[GuerinUp]

Either retiring would have been less dead cap per year than they are paying now after buying them out. If one retired after next season with the Wild the dead cap would be 6.2 million for 3 years. The actual dead cap from the buyout is 6.4 million, 7.4 million and 7.4 million over those same 3 years, and then 833,333 for the next 4 years. If either retired after 2 seasons the dead cap would be 6.5 million for 2 years vs the 7.4 million dead cap they have thanks to the buyout.

Plus now the Wild have to replace them. Even if they were both riding the bench as 13th forward and 7th defender you now need a 700k+ contract instead.

They do get to protect Dumba now, but he's not the player he was before the peck injury. He's been a 30 point defender who doesn't defend well. RHD is also the only position where the Wild have 2 seemingly NHL ready prospects making him pretty much the easiest to replace player on the roster.

He actually has improved significantly there the past couple years and was one of if not our best defender in the playoffs this year.

 

[Coffey]

I remember buying the THN when these two got signed. Lol hilarious then and funnier now

 

[Mass]

That’s a dang shame

 

[Langdon Alger]

How good are both players at this stage?