i feel i have to point out that I said I'd understand a RNH for Dumba swap. I wouldn't do it myself but I'd understand it and it wouldn't be devastating. But adding anything significant like a good roster player is not at all reasonable if the return is only RNH. It'd have to be complicated and the complication is compounded by our cap. Thus the inclusion of guys like Pommer going back.
Proposal: Min - Edm
- Thread starter Hally BlackWood
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Don't try so hard.
I'm not insulting RNH, nor am I being unrealistic in calling him a 2C.
Calling Dumba a #5 at this point in his career when you're obviously still years off from his potential is flat out nonsense.
I can understand why nobody is impressed with Zucker or Haula though, outside of Minnesota fans.
I'm shocked a certain person in this thread isn't gm. He sure seems to know everything. I mean just ask him he will tell you so.
PuckInTheNards
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Sarge58
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I'm higher on Dumba than most people and think he'll become a dynamic goal scoring Dman in time. For those thinking he's reached his peak at 22yrs it's an opinion for sure but player development especially for Dman doesn't often occur at such a young age and there's plenty of proof out there that it doesn't.
I have much less experience watching RNH but what I come away with is a player who has the potential to be a true wizard with the puck. I do think he's a bit of an overkill as a 3rd line C if that's where they decide to play him.
Thing is Minn can't really afford a 6m cap hit. The Oil picked up their top 4 Dman in Larrson with potential to be top pairing and Minn has enough C's to hopefully find something that works until one of their draft choices is capable of taking over the #1 slot.
But who knows it's all a crap shoot.
I have much less experience watching RNH but what I come away with is a player who has the potential to be a true wizard with the puck. I do think he's a bit of an overkill as a 3rd line C if that's where they decide to play him.
Thing is Minn can't really afford a 6m cap hit. The Oil picked up their top 4 Dman in Larrson with potential to be top pairing and Minn has enough C's to hopefully find something that works until one of their draft choices is capable of taking over the #1 slot.
But who knows it's all a crap shoot.
The funny thing that so many people seem to overlook is that, if RNH, Yakupov, and even Eberle were anywhere nearly as highly valued as they are by HFBoards posters, Taylor Hall would still be an Oiler. He's not, and that's also why the best defenseman they could bring home (with all due respect) was Adam Larsson. It's also similar to how several actual NHL teams were calling about Jonas Brodin last trade deadline, but those last MIN/EDM trade proposal threads seemed to relegate him to the role of a bottom pairing defenseman that couldn't get out of his own way.
Dumba and Coyle for RNH. That's hilarious.
Dumba and Coyle for RNH. That's hilarious.
Bryanbryoil
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There is not a trade to be made between these 2 teams involving RNH IMO. If you think that the Oilers should simply move RNH because center is a clear position of strength for us and it will be a position that costs us a lot of money within 2 years time here's the kicker, top line capable centers and top pairing capable defenders are the two hardest assets to acquire IMO. A 3rd pairing defenseman does not land a top line capable center unless he hast top pairing or at least #3 potential, I do not see this is Dumba. I see him at best a #4 that is primarily an offensive defenseman, basically a much lesser version of a young Dion Phaneuf. That doesn't mean that he doesn't have value, it just means that he doesn't bring back RNH. Dumba, Spurgeon and Coyle are all players that we could use, however if we can land a 2nd pairing RH offensive defenseman without forking over one of our solid young centers or defensemen why would we move RNH for Dumba? I'm not convinced that Dumba would out produce Wizniewski assuming that Wiz has fully recovered.
Bryanbryoil
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Draisaitl was very effective as a RW last season, having the ability to lose a Draisaitl, RNH or to a much lesser degree McDavid to injury and still be able to ice a solid 1-2 punch down the middle is a hell of a luxury. Is it really that hard for many (not you, just speaking to the masses that figure that we HAVE to move RNH or Drai) to understand that we want to have the luxury of 3 high end centers? Oilers fans know what it's like to need a 1C, until RNH we had probably a 10 year gap between 1C's. Now we potentially have 3 and one of which looks at least as good on the wing. Team Canada routinely wins with center laden lineups, not every team has the luxury of being able to have McDavid, Draisaitl and RNH down the middle but I bet you many would (even if McDavid were replaced with a non generational player). McLellan sure didn't complain about having Thornton, Marleau, Pavelski and Couture in SJ.
The funny thing that so many people seem to overlook is that, if RNH, Yakupov, and even Eberle were anywhere nearly as highly valued as they are by HFBoards posters, Taylor Hall would still be an Oiler. He's not, and that's also why the best defenseman they could bring home (with all due respect) was Adam Larsson. It's also similar to how several actual NHL teams were calling about Jonas Brodin last trade deadline, but those last MIN/EDM trade proposal threads seemed to relegate him to the role of a bottom pairing defenseman that couldn't get out of his own way.
Dumba and Coyle for RNH. That's hilarious.
Yeah or maybe Chia and McLellan liked RNH better as a player? McLellan has said that RNH reminds him of Pavelski, I doubt that he'd say that if he thought that he was hot garbage.
Believe it or not there were Oilers fans (myself included) that had Hall behind McDavid, Drai and RNH in terms of forwards that we'd build around. Check my post history, it was said long before Hall was dealt. I was also one that said that I would've taken Hamonic + Lee for Hall while some of my fellow Oilers fans felt that he'd return a hell of a lot more.
Not as hilarious as Dumba straight up, there'd need to be a smaller add on our side for the Coyle + Dumba deal than there'd be for Dumba + for RNH.
Bryanbryoil
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You do realize that Dumba was drafted all of 1 year after RNH right? Seeing as they were on the same WHL team I'd suppose that you may have known that? So RNH is a 2C and it's written in stone, but Dumba's future will take "years" to figure out? You can't teach hockey sense and RNH has it in droves. Unlike Dumba he will take longer to physically mature so IMO RNH actually has more room to grow as a player than Dumba does in spite of being a year older.
so what does a top 5 in the league LW return? Larsson's value is in potential. Until last year, he showed very little potential for becoming anything other than at best a second pairing stay at home defenseman. Again, i'll reiterate that you should keep RNH but Oiler fans in general now seem to have swung around and proclaimed Larsson some godsend when--even after this last season--you were laughing off one for one trades with RNH. Why is that? Thats you plural.
Coyle is too popular with the Wild fans. Its a no go. We would have to offer up Draisaitl for the pair.
I dont think Dumba plus for RNH is that bad -depending on the plus but we dont really need Dumba right now at the loss of RNH.
We cant roll with a 19 year old Mc David and 20 year old Draisaitl as our top 2 centers if we want to challenge for a playoff spot this year. Revisit in a year or 2.
SupremeTeam16
5-14-6-1
Trying to talk trades with Edmonton, is like clapping with one hand.
The "Edmonton LotterOilers" team, full of TOP 5 picks, consists of players much too valuable for them to trade to any other team, as they are far superior than everyone else in the league.
(yet the Oilers consistently have one the worst records year in and year out .)
PROOF:
2006: finished 25th out of 30 teams
2007: finished 19th out of 30 teams
2008: finished 21st out of 30 teams
2009: finished 30th out of 30 teams
2010: finished 30th out of 30 teams
2011: finished 29th out of 30 teams
2012: finished 24th out of 30 teams
2013: finished 28th out of 30 teams
2014: finished 28th out of 30 teams
2015: finished 29th out of 30 teams
and Eddy fans say Minnesota fans over-value their players!!!
You gotta admit though it's pretty amazing that the Oilers finished 25th in the league in 2006 but somehow still managed to make the playoffs and go to the Cup final.
Congratulations, you played yourself.
I saw this before. Scroll down. It ends in 2015 and if you look at the finishes he simply called the 2015-16 season 2015. He means 2006-07
Bryanbryoil
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Had Hall been a ppg player the last 2 seasons chances are that NJ adds or he flat out wouldn't be on the block. Here's my issue, he's a top 5LW (I'd have to take a look at NHL LW's to agree or disagree with that statement but I'll just roll with it for now) so then why doesn't he make Team Canada? Could it be that he has some issues with his game that has the brass cautious about taking him?
Larsson is a young and cheap RHD that is a high end defensive defender and PKer who also has some offensive upside. The Oilers now have a top pairing that costs under $8.5 million AAV.
I for one have not been very high on Hall and that opinion has only grown over the last 2 seasons. You have some Oilers fans that say that he's a top 3LW in the game, I personally think that he's overrated, has poor hockey sense and IMO he flat out gave up last season when McDavid returned.
I've valued RNH over Hall pretty much from day 1, 2 seasons ago RNH was the best player on our team.
Hall was popular with Oilers fans, GM's make moves that they think makes their team better period. Prior to adding Lucic, Maroon Draisaitl and Puljujarvi I would've paid a ton for Coyle, I was a big fan of his long before he broke out (same for Zucker) but I'd sooner keep RNH than deal him for a PP specialist and Coyle, IMO RNH has not broken out yet, he showed glimpses in '14-15 and IMO this season could be when he shows some other NHL fans why posters like I hold him in such a high regard.
Now which years did Ryan Suter pad Brodin's stats?
Suter didn't play with him this year and it kinda looks like he broke out offensively. It's almost like Brodin held him back.
That's a bit of cherry picking.
Of course playing with Suter made Brodin better, there aren't many D-men in the league that that statement isn't also true for, so it's either irrelevant or disingenuous.
Brodin also went from top-pair minutes and 1st/2nd line forwards to, well, not. Another obvious point that would hurt his production.
I'm not even trying to compare him to Larsson, but you can't bring up half of a player's situation and claim it explains his entire play.
Brodin very likely is what he appears to be. A fantastic #4 (which is really what he is for the Wild right now), very good #3, acceptable #2. He will never carry the offensive load of a pairing, but his defensive and transition game are noteworthy and allow him to be the defensive anchor to let an offensive-minded partner be more aggressive.
Suter's boost in stats came mainly from the PP (+10p). +3g, -1a even strength from the year before. Slightly lower CF and FF, slightly higher PDO (all within 1 point). +/- of +3.
Other than the PP nothing; which Brodin shouldn't be on (and Suter spends too much time on) nothing jumps out as breakout.
Suter scoring goals is mostly luck type goals (a sniper he's not). His career high is 8g in a season, and has one career hat trick.
VainGretzky
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re: brodin/suter and the stats...Suter said he finds it awkward playing with a partner of the same handedness. that's why he was complaining before last season. So in a sense Brodin may have been holding him back. shrug.
Met with dial tone.
You could say that about a lot of proposals in this thread.
Aerchon
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This rumour is the most rediculous and fictitious of all the recent oilers rumours.
RNH would fetch dumba, zucker, and xxx player/pick/blue chip prospect and would still make no sense for the Oilers.
Sure, the oilers would like a bottom pairing PP specialist like Dumba but not for RNH. More like Yak and a minor pick. Or Reinhart straight up.
No idea why the oilers would want or value zucker.
RNH would fetch dumba, zucker, and xxx player/pick/blue chip prospect and would still make no sense for the Oilers.
Sure, the oilers would like a bottom pairing PP specialist like Dumba but not for RNH. More like Yak and a minor pick. Or Reinhart straight up.
No idea why the oilers would want or value zucker.
Mr Positive
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why is Coyle so untouchable? I get that he's a good player coming off a great season, but still a checking line center type, granted that he spent time in the top six as a winger I believe. If Coyle is a piece used in an RNH trade, you're still getting the best player in the deal.
Funny.
He's not a center... He's a top 6 right wing. He just had his first 20 goal season and major reason was he could free wheel on the wing. He doesn't carry any baggage. His cap hit is wonderful. He's a really gritty player and is strong on the boards. Oh, and the fact he's our only top 6 quality right wing unless you want to count Nino or Granlund as right wingers.
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The main points of your post are completely false and carry a disgustingly strong Oilers bias.
Bryanbryoil
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Dumba for RNH should've been met with "are you ****ing kidding me Fletcher? Is your blood glucose level o.k.?"
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