For sure you can. We just don't find them very often. Most of them are pretty useless. Other than Ilya, our European FA signings have been a waste of everyone's time. And the vast majority of our UFA signings have been pointless.
TSN: Mikheyev
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But it wasn’t nothing though. Why did Edmonton get to dictate the value on a trade. If you want cap space you need to pay.
- Dec 12, 2017
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Would teams get in a bidding war to sign Mik?
Maybe someone pays a 7th to get him signed to have that piece of the roster covered before the draft/FA season.
Because Edmonton had all the leverage as evidenced by them saying f*** it and giving us nothing.
There's a difference between needing to dump him and just adding 500k to his number when it's not on the roster.
It will most likely be a benefit overall to them in the long run as they won't need to have him there for year 8.
If we get anything higher then a 6 I'll tip my cap to dubas.
NHL teams don't usually give up big value for UFAs rights especially ones like mik. Maybe jack would get more who knows
- Dec 12, 2017
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ACC1224
Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
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Very few are worth what they get as UFA.
ToneDog
56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
Who would you rather have for $21+m if Mik gets 4.5x5?? Paul all day for me.
They had no leverage. Toronto wasn’t re-signing him so why help another team if they aren’t gonna even meet in the middle. Dubas isn’t a lucky isn’t gonna take just what’s thrown his way.
Mess
Global Moderator
Best Bang for your Salary Cap Buck !!!! ** Cap management 101 **
2021-21 stats
=========
John Tavares ........ 79 games .. 27 goals .. $11 mil AAV = $407,400 cap $ consumption per goal.
Ilya Mikheyev ...... 53 games .. 21 goals .. $ 1.645 mil AAV = $78,333 cap $ consumption per goal.
Michael Bunting ..79 games .. 23 goals .. $950k AAV = $41,304 cap $ consumption per goal.
Last season a JT goal cost the Leafs $400k of Cap, a Mikheyev goal at $78K and Bunting goal $41K, with Leafs getting much better value per goal from the bottom end of the roster.
First Kadri, then Hyman, now Mikheyev and next year Bunting all forced off the Leafs roster for salary cap reasons, because Leafs can no longer afford these higher cap value productive players because they have so much invested in JT among others. Leafs can only afford depth players making $1.5 mil or less but once their contracts are up and you have to pay for their production, you have to move on from them.
2021-21 stats
=========
John Tavares ........ 79 games .. 27 goals .. $11 mil AAV = $407,400 cap $ consumption per goal.
Ilya Mikheyev ...... 53 games .. 21 goals .. $ 1.645 mil AAV = $78,333 cap $ consumption per goal.
Michael Bunting ..79 games .. 23 goals .. $950k AAV = $41,304 cap $ consumption per goal.
Last season a JT goal cost the Leafs $400k of Cap, a Mikheyev goal at $78K and Bunting goal $41K, with Leafs getting much better value per goal from the bottom end of the roster.
First Kadri, then Hyman, now Mikheyev and next year Bunting all forced off the Leafs roster for salary cap reasons, because Leafs can no longer afford these higher cap value productive players because they have so much invested in JT among others. Leafs can only afford depth players making $1.5 mil or less but once their contracts are up and you have to pay for their production, you have to move on from them.
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Rather neither at the cost or Paul at his price for 1/2 years
I think a 2/2.5 mil a year player at the level of both of them is something that is something we can get if that's something we want to spend money on
Yeah agreed. Shows how important all the picks we've thrown away might have been
The oilers signed him anyways for a very short aav bump and we got nothing
We turned down the opportunity to get an asset to "not help" a team that's not even in our conference when the help was a fairly insignificant amount of money.
It'll be the same thing in this case if we ask for something dumb everyone will just tell us no and we'll get nothing
Dubas was willing to help them. Doesn’t mean Edmonton gets to dictate what they will give Toronto. If Edmonton wasn’t willing to meet in the middle than screw them. I wouldn’t help them either. Toronto isn’t a charity case.
deprw
Registered User
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Trading negotiation rights is one thing, but signing player first and lowering the cap hit is another. There is certain price on the market for that and it was right call from Dubas not to negotiate on that. If Holland wants to gain advantage and lower cap hit, then you can't walk over another teams GM.
Next time we don't get low balled that easily, because another team knows that we aren't desperate.
hotpaws
Registered User
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yup f*** them , getting nothing is much better than a 6th rd pick
usernamezrhardtodo
Registered User
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I did not know about the trade deadline date affecting UFA's. I thought it was mostly about just being under contract with the current team when the player hits UFA. Good to know. In that case I don't blame Dubas for asking for more than a 6th.
Racer88
Registered User
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Most likely not worth it but he sure was dam good in the playoffs…….something we sorely lack
No question it’s Paul
Nylanderthal
Registered User
- Jun 9, 2010
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This is the correct answer. The truth is they could easily afford to keep him by moving out some of the expected riff raff from the team (kerfoot Holl mrazek), it’s just we’ve seen what he’s capable of here and it’s not what the team needs so moving on is the right move regardless of cap space
Stephen
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Stephen
Moderator
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Those sign and trade scenarios feel like more of a courtesy/convenience thing than a hard up negotiation in the NHL. Like oh well, we couldn't get the 8 years from Toronto. Leafs have no leverage in any case. Would be fine to just have an extra marginal asset than none.
deprw
Registered User
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Would other team help us for basicly free? Probably not, so if you're going to help by lowering cap hit, you should get something back. I think our ask was the common price and Oilers tried to low ball.
This is always this same discussion. If Dubas is hard on negotiations it's wrong, but he gives up he should be harder. Look CBJ and Jarmo, he gets his price everytime, because he has his ask and either you pay or you don't. No discounts. If you start giving discounts, you'll never build that hard line.
