Value of: Mike Matheson

[Gurglesons]

Matheson has been moved twice and has returned little value. I’m not sure why him suddenly putting up points on a bottom five team suddenly inflates his value to a 1st or 2nd.

 

[LemonSauceD]

This guy has very minimal value @ 4.87 and the extra year, imo.

This is someone you wanna hide against top players and high leverage Dzone situations.

I am very skeptical that he is viewed as an impactful Top4 dman who would push other players down in the lineup by any other NHL teams. I think teams would view him as a depth addition playing down in the lineup.

Matheson has averaged 24-25 minutes a season since he became a Hab.

He’s also been one of the most efficient point producers on the backend. Obviously he gets favourable o zone starts.

He’s similar to Dougie Hamilton for instance. If you pair him with a solid defensive player and reduce his ice time to about 18-20 minutes, he should be a serviceable top 4 dman on any team. I think the criticism he’s getting is a bit harsh.

 

[Playmaker09]

This guy has very minimal value @ 4.87 and the extra year, imo.

This is someone you wanna hide against top players and high leverage Dzone situations.

I am very skeptical that he is viewed as an impactful Top4 dman who would push other players down in the lineup by any other NHL teams. I think teams would view him as a depth addition playing down in the lineup.

You say that yet teams have given up large returns for Shattenkirk, Yandle, Barrie, Kaberle, Goligoski. Klingberg was offered a massive contract by Dallas etc.

There always seems to be a buyer for a 20+min a night D who can run a PP, no matter the flaws.

 

[StreetHawk]

If the Habs do move Matheson and Savard (due to be a UFA), they need to be prepared and committed to spend possibly both cash on a contract and assets to get a couple of quality veteran Dman. Their D really needs help.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Matheson has averaged 24-25 minutes a season since he became a Hab.

He’s also been one of the most efficient point producers on the backend. Obviously he gets favourable o zone starts.

I’d take him over Dougie Hamilton for instance. If you pair him with a solid defensive player and reduce his ice time to about 18-20 minutes, he should be a serviceable top 4 dman on any team. I think the criticism he’s getting is a bit harsh.

So he'd need a good partner, reduction in minutes, and then should be merely serviceable? That does not sound very valuable. Esp. factoring in the contract.

You say that yet teams have given up large returns for Shattenkirk, Yandle, Barrie, Kaberle, Goligoski. Klingberg was offered a massive contract by Dallas etc.

There always seems to be a buyer for a 20+min a night D who can run a PP, no matter the flaws.

Matheson isn't even that good of a PP guy. He's decent, he's only PP1 because he's on MTL. He would not be that on other teams.

Depth defenseman rather than bonafide top4dman/PPQB is how good teams would see him.

 

[Habs Halifax]

So he'd need a good partner, reduction in minutes, and then should be merely serviceable? That does not sound very valuable. Esp. factoring in the contract.



Matheson isn't even that good of a PP guy. He's decent, he's only PP1 because he's on MTL. He would not be that on other teams.

Depth defenseman rather than bonafide top4dman/PPQB is how good teams would see him.

Truth is usually in the middle and I feel it applies to this narrative with Matheson. You might be right that Habs are putting too much value with Matheson but then you may also be wrong by lowering it down too much. That sort of thingy. He's not just a depth D man. Sorry, that is just not accurate. He's a good #3 or 4 guy but belongs in the mix with guys who know how to play D. Your guy Rielly is kind of the same. Not really that great in his own end but holds his own... ideally, you want him paired up with a mobile physical stud so he can focus on offense a bit more. Does that mean Rielly sucks or is overrated? NO

Matheson's value would not be less than what the Leafs got in return for Sandin.

 

[ElPrimeTime]

You say that yet teams have given up large returns for Shattenkirk, Yandle, Barrie, Kaberle, Goligoski. Klingberg was offered a massive contract by Dallas etc.

There always seems to be a buyer for a 20+min a night D who can run a PP, no matter the flaws.

I don't think it's accurate to compare when those players were traded vs, the Matheson situation right now. Outside of Kaberle, all the players you mentioned were between 26-28 years old and none of those trades happened in the last 5 years. There weren't as many d-man who could put up 60 points back then (Shattenkirk was 4th out of d-men the year he was traded with 56 points in 80 games).

Klingberg's "big contract" with the Stars was signed in 2015. He got two more contracts in 2022 and 2023 and is now out of the league at age 32.

In 2023, Klingberg and Gostisbehere (probably similar comparables) did not have outstanding returns and they were pending UFAs. Klingberg (age 30) returned Andrej Sustr, Nikita Nesterenko and a 2025 4th round pick and Ghost (29) returned a 3rd.

Now if he were a stupid slow, physical, bruising defensive d-man, then he'd probably get a first because teams get stupid for those at the deadline.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Truth is usually in the middle and I feel it applies to this narrative with Matheson. You might be right that Habs are putting too much value with Matheson but then you may also be wrong by lowering it down too much. That sort of thingy. He's not just a depth D man. Sorry, that is just not accurate. He's a good #3 or 4 guy but belongs in the mix with guys who know how to play D. Your guy Rielly is kind of the same. Not really that great in his own end but holds his own... ideally, you want him paired up with a mobile physical stud so he can focus on offense a bit more. Does that mean Rielly sucks or is overrated? NO

Matheson's value would not be less than what the Leafs got in return for Sandin.

Not a Leafs fan, i guess everyone assumes so because the avatar lol.

But Sandin was 22 when traded and was not making a lot of money, 1.4M. Caps targeted him for the future and as much for upside.

Matheson is a 30 year old vet. I don't see him getting a 1st round pick but ibve been wrong before.

Let's see what happens i guess....

 

[Digitalbooya]

Feel like Matheson is the exact kind of guy that even amongst NHL GMs and pro scouts there's wildly differing opinions. The big problem for MTL is I just don't see the fit anywhere. What contender 1) needs an offensive 2LD 2) can fit in the contract for a second year in-season and 3) is willing to give up a 1st+?

I feel like MIN is probably the closest to hitting all 3? Cap and futures to play with, competing but also Matheson would be a clear upgrade to their group. FLA maybe if they can accrue enough space at the deadline? Probably the best on-ice fit but would almost certainly prevent them from bringing Ekblad back though.

Minnesota makes sense fit wise, the contract length coincides with Kaprizov's next contract and bridges them into Buium. Also they are the one of the only teams that doesn't have a blue line threat like Matheson on the powerplay. Lastly, with their D depth they should be able to cover most of his defensive woes and give him favorable minutes. I don't see them offering a 1st though unless there is significant retention. The main problem for the Wild is Faber and Middleton's extensions are eating ~10M of the 13M coming off the buyouts next summer and Rossi is going to get a big raise too. Assuming the cap goes up about 5M again that leaves 7M to work with if no cap is going back the other way.

That’s an easy no thanks for Minnesota.

We don’t need LD at all - Brodin-Middleton-Chisholm-Merrill with Buium expected to sign at the end of the NCAA season.

I’d rather have Faber run the PP than trade assets (definitely not a 1st) for Matheson AND have to account for his cap hit next year AND have him block Buium/Chisholm/Hunt.

The easiest no because it doesn’t make sense and he doesn’t fit.

 

[Empoleon8771]

You say that yet teams have given up large returns for Shattenkirk, Yandle, Barrie, Kaberle, Goligoski. Klingberg was offered a massive contract by Dallas etc.

There always seems to be a buyer for a 20+min a night D who can run a PP, no matter the flaws.

The problem with Matheson is a very similar problem with Granlund: good teams aren't going to be playing those guys in the roles they succeed in on bad teams. Good teams aren't going to be playing Granlund as a 20 minute a night 1C and good teams won't be playing Matheson as a 22 minute a night top PP defenseman.

If he's being used in that kind of role, it very likely means your team is bad.

 

[Playmaker09]

The problem with Matheson is a very similar problem with Granlund: good teams aren't going to be playing those guys in the roles they succeed in on bad teams. Good teams aren't going to be playing Granlund as a 20 minute a night 1C and good teams won't be playing Matheson as a 22 minute a night top PP defenseman.

If he's being used in that kind of role, it very likely means your team is bad.

I don't disagree with you, at all, but GMs sure seem to no matter how much we continue to complain.

Multiple contenders have bought into the idea of Tyson Barrie as a top D only recently.

 

[dgibb10]

The problem with Matheson is a very similar problem with Granlund: good teams aren't going to be playing those guys in the roles they succeed in on bad teams. Good teams aren't going to be playing Granlund as a 20 minute a night 1C and good teams won't be playing Matheson as a 22 minute a night top PP defenseman.

If he's being used in that kind of role, it very likely means your team is bad.

The Matheson problem is he can do everything at a meh level.

Helpful to a bad team.

But doesn't really move the needle for a good one that much (unless they are truly desperate for a PPQB and can't stomach hiding a ghost type)

Hell of a skater tho

 

[ElPrimeTime]

I don't disagree with you, at all, but GMs sure seem to no matter how much we continue to complain.

Multiple contenders have bought into the idea of Tyson Barrie as a top D only recently.

The bolded part is factually incorrect. Oilers traded Barrie to get an upgrade to Ekholm. Nashville couldn't find a trading partner for Barrie last season and he had to settle for a PTO this season.

 

[Frank Drebin]

Matheson, if traded, will probably return more than hf expects

The acquiring team, assuming matheson is put in a lesser role, will probably be happy with what he brings

Jets were happy with how monahan improved their pp after his acquisition after screaming that they didn’t want him

 

[dirtydanglez]

1st and c-level prospect would be my guess

 

[Playmaker09]

The bolded part is factually incorrect. Oilers traded Barrie to get an upgrade to Ekholm. Nashville couldn't find a trading partner for Barrie last season and he had to settle for a PTO this season.

Edmonton and Toronto both brought him in to be a key piece to their Dcore. What imaginary reality are you trying to construct here?

 

[ElPrimeTime]

Edmonton and Toronto both brought him in to be a key piece to their Dcore. What imaginary reality are you trying to construct here?

What years are you talking about here? Leafs brought him in via trade with 50% retention in 2019-2020 and chose not re-sign him. The Oilers brought him in as a free agent. There is a massive difference in signing someone as a FA vs. acquiring them via trade as in all you have to give them is money.

Oilers understood that if they wanted to compete in the playoffs, they couldn't do so with Barrie. Barrie wasn't even the centre piece in the trade with Nashville. Now we're talking last year... just last year, when Nashville was literally trying to give him away for peanuts, they found no takers as a pending UFA. Despite his offensive skill, no teams were willing to bring him in for their playoff run. Every team in the NHL could have had Tyson Barrie this offseason without having to give up any assets at all, but only the Flames brought him in for a PTO and signed him for pretty cheap.

You're referencing players traded and signed 5+ years ago and that just does not seem to be the case in the current NHL landscape, especially for players that have term. I'd like you to provide me with a recent example, of an offensive defensive who is a defensive liability, similarly aged that had returned even a 1st. If you can, I will gladly admit I was wrong.

 

[FerrisRox]

You told us Domi would fetch a top 10 pick. He was given away + 3rd rounder for Josh Anderson (ouch).

Nobody said this.

You told us Tatar was worth a haul. He wasn't

Nobody said this, either.

You told us Drouin was worth something. He wasn't.

This is ridiculous. There were several Canadiens fans who (idiotically) claimed Drouin wouldn't even have a job in the NHL after Montreal, so there was nobody claiming he was "worth something." You're just making this up.

 

[Bouboumaster]

That’s an easy no thanks for Minnesota.

Your mouth says no but your eyes say yes

Matheson for a 1st and B prospect, let's do that shit

 

[HolyGhost]

Which teams need someone like Matheson and what's the best offer we could get for him? Matheson is a legit stud, he's cost controlled for 2+ seasons and we could even eat some salary for a contender (he's already cheap tho). He's still in his prime, plays big minutes (he can easily play 24-25 mins) vs top competition and he can play on PP1 but he's a great luxury to have on PP2 for a contender.

It's actually very possible that Matheson could get moved as soon as this season imo, we have a lot of players coming up (Hutson/Reinbacher/Mailloux/Barron/Engstrom) and age-wise he doesn't fit into our long term plans (by the time we'll be ready to contend his contract will be up etc.).

Biggest need for MTL is young top 6 help (players that fit into our cores age group), we could add additional pieces like picks (not our 1st rounder)/Barron/Harris/other prospects (Mesar/Barron/Farrell etc) for a bigger deal.

This is a funny thread. Homer glasses firmly on

Nobody said this.



Nobody said this, either.



This is ridiculous. There were several Canadiens fans who (idiotically) claimed Drouin wouldn't even have a job in the NHL after Montreal, so there was nobody claiming he was "worth something." You're just making this up.

Yes some thought they would get a first for Domi

 

[Digitalbooya]

Your mouth says no but your eyes say yes

Matheson for a 1st and B prospect, let's do that shit

Sure, Montreal pays Minnesota a 1st and a B prospect and we will take Matheson off your hands.

 

[HolyGhost]

Matheson has been moved twice and has returned little value. I’m not sure why him suddenly putting up points on a bottom five team suddenly inflates his value to a 1st or 2nd.

He might get a conditional 1st with the condition being the team trading for him makes the final 4, meaning the pick would be 29 to 32. MM sucks in his own zone and all teams know that

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

The problem with Matheson is a very similar problem with Granlund: good teams aren't going to be playing those guys in the roles they succeed in on bad teams. Good teams aren't going to be playing Granlund as a 20 minute a night 1C and good teams won't be playing Matheson as a 22 minute a night top PP defenseman.

If he's being used in that kind of role, it very likely means your team is bad.

The Keith Yandle theory.

 

[Playmaker09]

What years are you talking about here? Leafs brought him in via trade with 50% retention in 2019-2020 and chose not re-sign him. The Oilers brought him in as a free agent. There is a massive difference in signing someone as a FA vs. acquiring them via trade as in all you have to give them is money.

Oilers understood that if they wanted to compete in the playoffs, they couldn't do so with Barrie. Barrie wasn't even the centre piece in the trade with Nashville. Now we're talking last year... just last year, when Nashville was literally trying to give him away for peanuts, they found no takers as a pending UFA. Despite his offensive skill, no teams were willing to bring him in for their playoff run. Every team in the NHL could have had Tyson Barrie this offseason without having to give up any assets at all, but only the Flames brought him in for a PTO and signed him for pretty cheap.

You're referencing players traded and signed 5+ years ago and that just does not seem to be the case in the current NHL landscape, especially for players that have term. I'd like you to provide me with a recent example, of an offensive defensive who is a defensive liability, similarly aged that had returned even a 1st. If you can, I will gladly admit I was wrong.

You say that yet teams have given up large returns for Shattenkirk, Yandle, Barrie, Kaberle, Goligoski. Klingberg was offered a massive contract by Dallas etc.

There always seems to be a buyer for a 20+min a night D who can run a PP, no matter the flaws.

I gave 5 examples already in the past 14 years + Klingberg who was offered a 7x7 extension from Dallas which he stupidly turned down. How many more do you expect? It's not like defensemen of this level grow on trees.

Each one of these returned value of at least a 1st including Barrie who returned a 2C in Kadri. Kadri had the extra 2 years of term, Barrie was retained. Those were the two core pieces of the trade, the rest filler (Kerfoot, picks, prospects).

Toronto then proceeded to use him as their 2nd most played D and after seeing that fail, Edmonton signed him (twice) to be their 2nd most played D as well, where he would continue to play PP1 over an up and coming blue chip prospect in Bouchard, not unlike Matheson/Hutson.

I don't know why you keep bringing up Nashville trading for him as a washed up cap dump at all. And I'm done wasting my time defending a well known fact that GMs stupidly overpay for 20+ minute a night defenseman all the time in spite of their obvious flaws.

 

[archangel2]

Matheson, if traded, will probably return more than hf expects

The acquiring team, assuming matheson is put in a lesser role, will probably be happy with what he brings

Jets were happy with how monahan improved their pp after his acquisition after screaming that they didn’t want him

We have had this thread before when he played on TWO different teams

here are his 2 previous trades for context

• 2020-Sep-24 Traded from Florida Panthers with Colton Sceviour to Pittsburgh Penguins for Patric Hornqvist
• 2022-Jul-16 Traded from Pittsburgh Penguins with round 4 pick in the 2023 draft (Bogdan Konyushkov) to Montreal Canadiens for Ryan Poehling and Jeff Petry