Player Discussion Mike Matheson

[Archijerej]

It's way to early to make a decision on Matheson.

It is a perfectly reasonable assumption that he won't be a core player for the whole duration of Suzuki's and Caulfield's contracts, but he could be a key part of the team for some of that period and a useful support player after that. He might be one of those players you want to keep throughout their mid-30s.

I think the 2025 offseason, before Matheson enters the final year of the current deal, is when you make a decision. You evaluate the state of the roster, Matheson's role, his expectations as to his next contract, available alternatives internally and on the market, their efficiency in terms of age, ability and cost etc. Then you decide if you want to keep this player or cash in.

There's hardly any point in trading him now for futures, just to scramble in a couple of years in search for another Matheson.

 

[Archijerej]

I did not say that. You can always sign a guy on the UFA market or make a trade for one. Nothing prevents you from doing that. It's far easier to sign a 33 years old declining Mike Matheson on the UFA market (or acquire one via trade) that to find elite young players to add to your core.

So, your argument is basically to trade Matheson for elite young talent and then spend some lesser talent or use free agency to acquire a replacement player of comparable quality?

If that's the case then it's certainly good advice in terms of asset management, but I'm affraid it is easier said than done.

 

[Belial]

It's way to early to make a decision on Matheson.

It is a perfectly reasonable assumption that he won't be a core player for the whole duration of Suzuki's and Caulfield's contracts, but he could be a key part of the team for some of that period and a useful support player after that. He might be one of those players you want to keep throughout their mid-30s.

I think the 2025 offseason, before Matheson enters the final year of the current deal, is when you make a decision. You evaluate the state of the roster, Matheson's role, his expectations as to his next contract, available alternatives internally and on the market, their efficiency in terms of age, ability and cost etc. Then you decide if you want to keep this player or cash in.

There's hardly any point in trading him now for futures, just to scramble in a couple of years in search for another Matheson.

HFHabs mantra though!

 

[JianYang]

He was fine but had to adjust to a new system. Dmen typically take the most time adjusting to new systems/teammates as they play the most complex position by a wide margin.

I disagree. His movement looked sluggish (by his standards) to me when he came back from the abdominal injury.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

I disagree. His movement looked sluggish (by his standards) to me when he came back from the abdominal injury.

I think you are conflating his lack of confidence to initially carry the puck with a physical impediment to do so.

 

[JianYang]

I think you are conflating his lack of confidence to initially carry the puck with a physical impediment to do so.

Possibly. But if there was a lack of confidence, it could have also stemmed from being unsure of his body. What makes me suspicious is that he got reinjured fairly quickly after coming back, and when he came back the second time, he was moving like that mobile player from back in training camp almost instantaneously.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Matheson is underrated to a fair amount. Only 48 games last year but others like Chychrun, Theodore, Carlson, also had games missed.

0.71 pts/game over 48 games with only 9 PP pts. A 50-60 pts season from Matheson with 10-15 goals is not out of the question.

His +7 rating on a team where most guys were a - is impressive

 

[schwang26]

Matheson is underrated to a fair amount. Only 48 games last year but others like Chychrun, Theodore, Carlson, also had games missed.

0.71 pts/game over 48 games with only 9 PP pts. A 50-60 pts season from Matheson with 10-15 goals is not out of the question.

His +7 rating on a team where most guys were a - is impressive

I can see that as well. As long as they're healthy, this team will be much better and produce more. Maybe not playoffs just yet, but certainly higher than 5th last.

 

[Habs Halifax]

I can see that as well. As long as they're healthy, this team will be much better and produce more. Maybe not playoffs just yet, but certainly higher than 5th last.

The way I see it, if we don't rise, our youth is not as good as we think they are. I'm expecting a pick from 10-15 range in the next draft. Top 10 pick? That is very possible too but if there are no injuries and the youth grows a bit more, I can see us better than most are willing to admit.

Matheson, Monty, Monahan, Anderson, Savard
+
Suzuki, Caufield, Dach, Guhle
+
Slaf, Xhekaj, Newhook, RHP, Barron, Harris

I don't care about how much Gallagher, Armia, Hoffman are overpaid. That's only 3 of 23 roster players.

The wild cards to this roster are Dach, Slaf, Guhle, Monty, Matheson, Monahan, and Newhook. I would not put much pressure on Slaf to be in that wild card mix. He should be better but I would not expect a break out season at age 19.

 

[Andy]

Matheson looked really really good once he got in game shape last season.

That said, we also need to remember that the habs were a bottom team. I suspect teams playing against the habs did not give a full effort as they would with stronger teams. This may have created a favorable context for Matheson to produce and shine.

It's not meant to be a negative because I really like Matheson. Just taming my expectations.

 

[Habs Halifax]

Matheson looked really really good once he got in game shape last season.

That said, we also need to remember that the habs were a bottom team. I suspect teams playing against the habs did not give a full effort as they would with stronger teams. This may have created a favorable context for Matheson to produce and shine.

It's not meant to be a negative because I really like Matheson. Just taming my expectations.

I think it's more of a factor of MSL letting him be more creative/aggressive with offense than what a contender would allow. I'm pretty sure other teams like beating up on the Habs when they play us. I don't buy that angle to it.

This to me is about MSL and his coaching. He's allowing guys to be creative without harassing them on mistakes. If Matheson was on a contender, I don't see the same production as we seen last season on the Habs. He would be asked to play more safe.

 

[LaP]

HFHabs mantra though!

There's something called age in sports that you simply can't ignore.

You example is a very bad one. A better one would be you own a car that is 4 years old is still under warranty for 1 year and worth a decent amount of money. You wont be able to use it for the next 5 years. What do you do? You keep the car and let it devalue for 5 years before you can use it again? Or you sell it, invest the money and hope you'll be able to buy a new car in 5 years?

What KH have to ask himself is can he win before Matheson and Anderson start to lose value. If the answer is no or doubtful he should move them eventually before it happens.

 

[Frankenheimer]

It’s incredible how much opinion has changed on Matheson. If I recall, opinion was very negative at the time of the trade.

Edit: I was not wrong

Confirmed with Link: - [PIT/MTL] Jeff Petry and Ryan Poehling for Mike Matheson and 4th PIT 2023

forums.hfboards.com

 

[Wats]

It’s incredible how much opinion has changed on Matheson. If I recall, opinion was very negative at the time of the trade.

He won people's respect. If he can stay healthy wouldn't be surprised if he cracks 50+points this coming season.

 

[L4br3cqu3]

He won people's respect. If he can stay healthy wouldn't be surprised if he cracks 50+points this coming season.

Pretty much, a bit like Tatar at the time.

For both of them, I know I thought they simply were 'cap dumps', but they played through it and managed to prove otherwise.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Pretty much, a bit like Tatar at the time.

For both of them, I know I thought they simply were 'cap dumps', but they played through it and managed to prove otherwise.

Much, much, much better skater than Tatar and not soft like Tuna.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

It’s incredible how much opinion has changed on Matheson. If I recall, opinion was very negative at the time of the trade.

Edit: I was not wrong

Confirmed with Link: - [PIT/MTL] Jeff Petry and Ryan Poehling for Mike Matheson and 4th PIT 2023

forums.hfboards.com

That's because he did suck and still kind of does defensively, but it's overlooked because this team is ass and he seems free to play how he wants offensively.

It's usually a great sign, as players who put up points are always valued highly irregardless of how shit they are defensively.

Might be a good trade chip this deadline.

 

[L4br3cqu3]

Much, much, much better skater than Tatar and not soft like Tomas.

Not sure why you're trying to convince me of anything, was talking about their situation, they both were seen as cap dumps.

 

[MtlSars]

That's because he did suck and still kind of does defensively, but it's overlooked because this team is ass and he seems free to play how he wants offensively.

It's usually a great sign, as players who put up points are always valued highly irregardless of how shit they are defensively.

Might be a good trade chip this deadline.

Why this deadline? Have you seen how sweet of a deal he's on :

One full season and he'll get 50+ and he can skate. Hold on to him until you're absolutely sure Hutson is ready or you have 3 players that's better than him on LD if ever....

Trade him for a king's ransom at the deadline in 25/26 or unless the offer is ridiculous...

 

[Belial]

There's something called age in sports that you simply can't ignore.

You example is a very bad one. A better one would be you own a car that is 4 years old is still under warranty for 1 year and worth a decent amount of money. You wont be able to use it for the next 5 years. What do you do? You keep the car and let it devalue for 5 years before you can use it again? Or you sell it, invest the money and hope you'll be able to buy a new car in 5 years?

What KH have to ask himself is can he win before Matheson and Anderson start to lose value. If the answer is no or doubtful he should move them eventually before it happens.

Defensemen tend to age a lot better than forwards.

Some of them even hit their prime around 28 years old.

Karlsson just won the Norris at 33 years old.

There's absolutely no rush to trade Matheson.

Hughes went and got him so that he can be a part of this rebuild IMO.

You trade him at the TDL in his last year at worst.

 

[BLONG7]

Matheson looked really really good once he got in game shape last season.

That said, we also need to remember that the habs were a bottom team. I suspect teams playing against the habs did not give a full effort as they would with stronger teams. This may have created a favorable context for Matheson to produce and shine.

It's not meant to be a negative because I really like Matheson. Just taming my expectations.

He did play well, once he got going and his injury was in the rear mirror.
His offense was crazy some nights, and we also have to remember at the end of the season we had 11 regulars in the press box.......he and Suzuki had no one to help them what so ever......
Great finish to the season.

If we fix the PP this guy will be a big reason why, and 50 pts is not out of the question................and no way does he get traded any time soon.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Why this deadline? Have you seen how sweet of a deal he's on :

View attachment 732871

One full season and he'll get 50+ and he can skate. Hold on to him until you're absolutely sure Hutson is ready or you have 3 players that's better than him on LD if ever....

Trade him for a king's ransom at the deadline in 25/26 or unless the offer is ridiculous...

For some reason I thought he had 1 (after this season, so 1 and 1/4th), but I guess next deadline, or next offseason.

I'd suggest trading him for a big load and then sign like Klingberg for 1 year to be that offensive guy and then, if the Habs suck trade his ass away for a 4th.

Habs need to maximize on vets that have value and NOT f***ING HOLD ONTO TO THEM AND THEN RE-SIGN THEM SO THEY CAN SIT HERE AND SUCK COMPLETE ASS.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Not sure why you're trying to convince me of anything, was talking about their situation, they both were seen as cap dumps.

Not by knowledgeable observers. His last year in Pittsburgh, Mike was 34th in the league among D for ES points while being a plus player.

 

[Boss Man Hughes]

For some reason I thought he had 1 (after this season, so 1 and 1/4th), but I guess next deadline, or next offseason.

I'd suggest trading him for a big load and then sign like Klingberg for 1 year to be that offensive guy and then, if the Habs suck trade his ass away for a 4th.

Habs need to maximize on vets that have value and NOT f***ING HOLD ONTO TO THEM AND THEN RE-SIGN THEM SO THEY CAN SIT HERE AND SUCK COMPLETE ASS.

That was the Bergevin era. Matheson is the only one who fits that bill in the HuGo era and he will be good long past his current contract. HuGo will not sign garbage like Armia to long term contracts. If they add vets when they are a contender it will be short term contracts unless they are convinced they have a few years left (and their is a spot for them).

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

That was the Bergevin era. Matheson is the only one who fits that bill in the HuGo era and he will be good long past his current contract. HuGo will not sign garbage like Armia to long term contracts. If they add vets when they are a contender it will be short term contracts unless they are convinced they have a few years left (and their is a spot for them).

Hopefully not, but they did extend Allen, no ?

Maybe they tried to trade him and only got offered like a 4th, so they decided to keep him.

Or the hopefully thing is they were already aware you need 2 goalies who can actually play to do well