McKenzie: Leafs looking at Bernier

[Drugstorecowboi]

I like Bernier.
I like Scrivens


I don't like Reimer

Agreed.

 

[Deebo]

And if Bernier was a leaf, Frankie would think he's a bust.

Nothing to see here.

 

[ULF_55]

does anyone know if Frattin would have to clear waivers to be sent down?

I don't think so. He will be an RFA in a couple of years

I think he has 3 NHL games of being waiver free.

Once he's played those 3 games he has to clear waivers.

 

[ULF_55]

I like Bernier.
I like Scrivens


I don't like Reimer

Scrivens is 2 years older, so he's not exactly a young rookie goaltender. Bernier was a bit of a drop off from Quick. He is younger, he's Reimer's age, so we can't say he's reached his peak at all ... you know like Reimer.

 

[Wizeman*]

Bernier is a younger version of the situation Luongo is in.

Nobody is going to offer up some first round pick or equivillant for this guy. He isnt even going to be an above average goalie in his prime. He might be a starter on an average team if he continues to develop.

If Lombardi continues to pout , waiting for a deal to his liking, then bernier will rot some more and eventually be so far behind in development he probably will end up in the AHL.

If the kings can get a mid 2nd rounder for him, do it.

 

[zeke]

And if Bernier was a leaf, Frankie would think he's a bust.

Nothing to see here.

yup.

he'd be another overrated leaf prospect if we'd drafted him.

 

[zeke]

2011-12

J.Reimer (23): NHL - 34gms, .900sv% / AHL - 0gms, ---sv%
J.Bernier (23): NHL - 16gms, .909sv% / AHL - 0gms, ---sv%
B.Scrivens (25): NHL - 12gms, .903sv% / AHL - 39gms, .926sv%

2010-11

J.Reimer (22): NHL - 37gms, .921sv% / AHL - 15gms, .920sv% / WC-A - 4gms, .920sv%
J.Bernier (22): NHL - 25gms, .913sv% / AHL - 0gms, .000sv% / WC-A - 3gms, .917sv%
B.Scrivens (25): NHL - 0gms, .000sv% / AHL - 33gms, .924sv% / ECHL - 13gms, .938sv%

2009-10

J.Reimer (21): NHL - 0gms, .000sv% / AHL - 26gms, .925sv%
J.Bernier (21): NHL - 3gms, .957sv% / AHL - 58gms, .936sv%
B.Scrivens (23): NHL - 0gms, .000sv% / AHL - 0gms, .000sv%

 

[DaveT83*]

Scrivens is 2 years older, so he's not exactly a young rookie goaltender. Bernier was a bit of a drop off from Quick. He is younger, he's Reimer's age, so we can't say he's reached his peak at all ... you know like Reimer.

I think if you were to acquire Bernier movign forward - it would be better for the team overall to have him and Scrivens in clearly defined roles - It would signal to Bernier that he's got the reins and its up to him to run with it - there'd be no drama of Reimer feeling passed up - or required to start in X amount of games. Suliking in the dressing room.

Plus I think Ben has more of a Winning Disposition - James really reminds me of Toskala sometimes with the smiling and joking around in pressers after he let in 9 goals - bothers me

 

[TmlHockeyFan]

I have a feeling we're trading Frattin+Reimer/Scrives for Bernier + some other asset.

 

[PasDaSquini]

I have a feeling we're trading Frattin+Reimer/Scrives for Bernier + some other asset.

Wasnt the rumor in the summer Frattin, second and Scrivens?

 

[Frankie]

It doesn't count much. There's plenty of players with cup rings, that doesn't make them more valuable than the ones without, especially when he didn't play a single game. I guess it's good for his experience but as for his development? I can't see the point.

i think its huge for a young player to be part of a winner and see exactly what it takes to win. its an aspect that fans undervalue all the time. players, coaches, and anyone actually involved in hockey will tell us that learning how to win means a lot.

Reimer has also been excellent at every level. He didn't have the chance to play for the Marlies in the playoffs, but that doesn't make him any worst because of that. He did win the MVP at the ECHL level in his pro rookie campaign, but I guess that doesn't count.

reimer's mvp echl playoff performance and championship absolutely counts. my mistake for missing that. its a winning experience that he has under his belt, and i believe he's better for it.

Either way, I'm not discrediting Bernier's accomplishments and what his upside could be. I don't think you understand what the problem most have with acquiring Bernier. It's not what he's accomplished, it's what it'll take to trade for him.

no different than any other potential trade. i think bernier is great and couldn't be more ready to take over an nhl starting job and become a great nhl goalie. but i don't want him on the leafs if it'll take too much to get him. that goes for anyone. i don't want crosby either if it takes too much to get him.

No matter how well he's played through his career, it still doesn't make him to be a guaranteed starter because he hasn't shown the ability to do so. Neither has Reimer for that matter. The price for Bernier is not worth the risk for where we are right now. If the price is right/fair on Bernier, I don't think a single person would have a problem with that.

obviously there's risk. there are no guarantees in any deal. bernier hasn't been a legit nhl starter yet, but he's shown the ability to be able to do it.

i'd be pretty confident that bernier has a very bright future ahead, given his recent history. i think he's going to be much better than reimer. i'd be prepared to give up something significant to get him.

full credit to you for putting forth a valid argument. unlike some of these other chicken posters who don't have the intelligence and/or guts to respond directly and try to actually argue the points.

 

[Guy Boucher]

The easiest way to acquire Bernier is in the off-season. He will not re-sign with the Kings and a modest offer-sheet (or even the threat of it) will put LA against the cap.

He should come cheap. But there will be plenty of options in the off-season.

 

[DD03]

I think if we are getting a goalie like Bernier, it should make Frattin expendable. It's not like Frattin is going to be a top line star or anything. He's not a can't miss prospect. However, Bernier can solve a lot of this teams problems and be a help in net. Our goaltending is a bigger issue then our wing depth. I think Frattin is easily replaceable and a guy like Bernier isn't unless you're a team like the LA Kings.

 

[Frankie]

And if Bernier was a leaf, Frankie would think he's a bust.

Nothing to see here.

and if he was a leaf, you'd think he was fantastic.

argue the points, show me where i'm wrong. grow a pair and try to defend your position. if you even have one?

 

[therealkoho]

Difference between Reimer and Bernier.

Reimer- terrible glove hand, worst recovery starting goaltender in the league. Terrible positioning.

Bernier- has all the talent in the world and has not been given a chance.

The choice is obvious, the question is how much we give up. If Bozak is the best peice we're giving up, I don't think you hesitate.

Reimers positioning was solid before Allaire stared tinkering with him, in fact it was the biggest part of the beef between Allaire and the management. Allaire stated that the assistant coaches were meddling in his instruction of Reimer, when all they were doing were asking for positioning changes.

The other part is after James came back from the (Dr Mom Reimer's diagnosis) "concussion," he was playing far to deep in the net thus giving away too much of the net. His glove isn't that fast that he can give away a square foot on his glove side to NHL shooters

giving up Bozak for Bernier would be vastly overpaid and create a bigger hole in the middle then is there now

Franson + Scrivens for Bernier + a 2nd in 13

thats it, thats all

LA doesn't want to deal no problem make a call to Tallon and see what he wants for Jose

 

[RogerRoeper*]

And if Bernier was a leaf, Frankie would think he's a bust.

Nothing to see here.

Of course. He'd be a bust to so many posters here.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

It is true, Allaire got his grubby paws and Reimer and decided to change him after posting a .921 save% as a rookie. ridiculous. Same with Gustavsson, guy dominates the SEL like no goalie in history. What does Allaire immediately do? Change his style of course! Don't be surprised if we see Gustavsson post some very solid numbers this year on a good Detroit team.

 

[Morbo]

there was SUPPOSEDLY some discussion about trading Bernier earlier, PROVIDED they could get BOTH a first-rounder or "blue-chip prospect" PLUS a serviceable D-Man.

Hilarious.

 

[Bomber0104]

Hilarious.

Imagine that...a team wants a good piece for their prized goaltending prospect.

 

[thewave]

It is true, Allaire got his grubby paws and Reimer and decided to change him after posting a .921 save% as a rookie. ridiculous. Same with Gustavsson, guy dominates the SEL like no goalie in history. What does Allaire immediately do? Change his style of course! Don't be surprised if we see Gustavsson post some very solid numbers this year on a good Detroit team.

I agree, even towards the end of the first season he played, Reimer was "changing". It was obvious, when he first came in he was absolute gold at being in position. He was fast responsive and set in the best place, after Allaire, not so much.

Gus will be a good goalie for Detroit, he absolutely will and we gave him away. I played some net, he is a very good goalie at the core, a true athlete regardless of the Gus haters and Wilson proponents had to say about him.

 

[Frankie]

Of course. He'd be a bust to so many posters here.

like your buddies, if bernier was a leaf, you'd love him and think he's fantastic. you'd never dream of trading him for kadri and frattin, if the teams were reversed.

rather than pretend you're unbiased, why not try to put forward a decent idea or point?

 

[Keeping it Blue]

Suliking in the dressing room.

Where do you even get this stuff from?

Imagine that...a team wants a good piece for their prized goaltending prospect.

Reimer had a bad go of it at the end of last year, but so the did the whole team. What do you think he'd be worth? Reimer and Bernier are very similar prospects at this point, they've had very similar numbers. The only reason I can see you valuing one over the other is that one was drafted higher.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

like your buddies, if bernier was a leaf, you'd love him and think he's fantastic. you'd never dream of trading him for kadri and frattin, if the teams were reversed.

rather than pretend you're unbiased, why not try to put forward a decent idea or point?

Not with the stats he's put up in L.A. Do you see me claiming Reimer is fantastic? There is no difference between Reimer and Bernier right now.

 

[RogerRoeper*]

I think if you were to acquire Bernier movign forward - it would be better for the team overall to have him and Scrivens in clearly defined roles - It would signal to Bernier that he's got the reins and its up to him to run with it - there'd be no drama of Reimer feeling passed up - or required to start in X amount of games. Suliking in the dressing room.

Plus I think Ben has more of a Winning Disposition - James really reminds me of Toskala sometimes with the smiling and joking around in pressers after he let in 9 goals - bothers me

Unforunately, Bernier's midget body reminds me of Toskala.

 

[Frankie]

Not with the stats he's put up in L.A. Do you see me claiming Reimer is fantastic? There is no difference between Reimer and Bernier right now.

if their jerseys were reversed, you'd say bernier was far better. don't pretend you're unbiased. if reimer was in la as quick's back-up, you wouldn't know who he is.

bernier has been groomed absolutely perfectly so far. if he was a leaf, you'd be the first one to say it.