Marty St. Louis

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True Blue on his never ending crusade to trash the Rangers. There are 8 teams left and the Rangers are favorites in many circles to beat the Penguins. True Blue isn't happy if he's not trashing the Rangers in one way or another.
Astute. And spot on. I who have been a Rangers fan much longer than you and have been through much more than you with them, am not happy unless I am only trashing.

What circles are you referring to?

For conversation's purpose, please show how I have "trashed" the Rangers?
At this point the biggest reason I want to see the Rangers win the cup is to see what kind of reasons True Blue would come up for how terrible the team is.
Oh, ignorance is truly bliss. The biggest reason that I want to see the Rangers win the Cup is...well....I am a long suffering Rangers fan and want to see my team win the grail. Your biggest reason is to see how I will react to it. Interesting.
 
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I don't how you can view it as giving them away when we traded them for a top flight player.

Its a risk and all that, but its nothing close to "giving them away"
So when you say "Now is not the time to stockpile", you do not mean trading for picks. You mean keeping your own picks in general.
 
That is what I would like to know. This is a team that finished slightly better than mediocre. And 2 points better than the team that took then to a game 7. Elite??

They were elite in the 2nd half of the season.

They were the 5th best team points-wise, had the 6th most goals per game (2.976) and the lowest goals against (2.049) in the league. Goal differential (+0.927) was 2nd only to Boston and way ahead of the 3rd place team Anaheim (+.650)

I know it is your stance that only the entire season record matters and a teams arc and related improvement (or lack thereof) is irrelevant. You are entitled to you opinion, however the counter to your argument is just as valid and has probably been posted 400 times.

There is no need to constantly act incredulous every time this comes up.

The playoff argument makes no sense. See: Boston last year against Toronto or Chicago against Detroit. Or two years ago the Rangers against Ottawa or the Devils against Florida. Or three years ago Boston against Montreal or Vancouver against Chicago. Or just about a 1000 other playoff series.
 
So when you say "Now is not the time to stockpile", you do not mean trading for picks. You mean keeping your own picks in general.

I mean that with the goalie getting older its more valueable to take a run at the prize than to hope we can draft a superstar with our first round pick, which we never do anyway.
 
If/when Cally resigns in Tampa we get Tampas 2015 2nd round pick in exchange for our 2015 1st round pick. There is no way we should have resigned Cally.

So it is Marty a 1st, a 2nd and a 7th for Cally a 2nd. In my view that is basically Marty for a 1st and 7th unless we keep winning in the playoffs.

if we beat the Pens, the 2nd we part with converts to a 1st.

So it's actually, assuming we beat the pens and Cally signs in TB

Cally, 1st in 2014, 1st in 2015 and a 7th

for

Marty and a 2nd in 2015
 
Its all confusing..What if we beat the Pens and Cally doesn't resign with Tampa? Do we still lose this years number 1?
 
if we beat the Pens, the 2nd we part with converts to a 1st.

So it's actually, assuming we beat the pens and Cally signs in TB

Cally, 1st in 2014, 1st in 2015 and a 7th

for

Marty and a 2nd in 2015

I think his point was we weren't going to sign Callahan anyway, so to him it's not really a lost asset.

So he's saying the picks are all we are giving up. If we beat the Pens, under his logic, it would be a 2014 1st, 2015 1st, 2015 7th for Marty and a 2015 2nd.

If we don't beat the Pens, he's saying the 2nd cancel out and it's really Marty for a 1st and a 7th.
 
On the business side of hockey we can Pooh Pooh dolan all we want, but his franchise is likely up there in value, and to any owner, that is up there in priorities. Make no mistake, dolan wants to win. Sather too wants to win, as do many other franchises who haven't won a cup in the last ten years. Our distaste for dolan goes into just seeing him and Looking like a kid living his dream but sucks at it because He isn't knowledgeable enough, and it irks us to see a spoiled brat. Truth is, if we had the money and a chance, we too may meddle and suck at it and throw away tons of money trying to get it right. Again, I think most want to win, but at times you also want a consistently competitive team that works hard and Hope for a break. If you look at this team and think if most guys play their best they can't beat others? From Henke to what Richards and Nash and St. Louis should provide? it really isn't a bad team and let's Hope for the best. It's the team that's lacing up tonight.

Yes true blue, decided to pop in. Still don't watch enough to say much. Get home after 8:30/9 pretty much Every night the last many years, well including when I posted often. Trying to get back into other.

Damn, its good to see ya old timer ;)

I agree this is not a bad team, especially when you factor in this years opposition. I could see any of the teams still alive in the finals.


Regarding MSL trade, I just don't agree on a method of building a sustainable power by trading first round picks and hoping a UFA signing makes up for it in the future. If the point of acquiring MSL is to get over the hump, does that mean winning a Cup ? Does that mean a finals appearance with a hope of repeating the fete as he gets older ? How does that usually work out for this franchise, you tell me :p:

That said, Henrik isn't getting any younger and I can't argue wholeheartedly it was the wrong move. We really are flying on a wing and a prayer.
 
I mean that with the goalie getting older its more valueable to take a run at the prize than to hope we can draft a superstar with our first round pick, which we never do anyway.
So again, by "stockpile" you mean keep your own picks?
 
Its all confusing..What if we beat the Pens and Cally doesn't resign with Tampa? Do we still lose this years number 1?

Yes, the condition on the '14 first is whether or not we make the conference finals. If Callahan doesn't re-sign with Tampa, we don't get their '15 second.

Basically, whether or not Callahan signs has no bearing on whether or not we keep our first rounder.
 
I think his point was we weren't going to sign Callahan anyway, so to him it's not really a lost asset.

So he's saying the picks are all we are giving up. If we beat the Pens, under his logic, it would be a 2014 1st, 2015 1st, 2015 7th for Marty and a 2015 2nd.

If we don't beat the Pens, he's saying the 2nd cancel out and it's really Marty for a 1st and a 7th.

That would be great but that is a big assumption that we will beat the #1 seed and make the conference finals. This is the same team people said wouldn't make the playoffs and should tank the whole season away.
 
If you were made boss today and you could give up Marty right now before our very next game for the #21 pick in the upcoming draft would you?

And play who in his place? It's too late for that now. The only question left is whether Marty is the missing piece of the puzzle? The roster is set for this playoffs. Marty will be around for next year's run too. We'll see if it was a price worth paying.
 
And play who in his place? It's too late for that now. The only question left is whether Marty is the missing piece of the puzzle? The roster is set for this playoffs. Marty will be around for next year's run too. We'll see if it was a price worth paying.
That is right. If the Rangers get bounced by the Pens this year, the price was a 1st round pick for a trip to the second round. If they get to the ECF, the price was 2 first round picks for a trip to ECF. Hopefully, they win the Cup this year or next and the price is worth it.
 
That is right. If the Rangers get bounced by the Pens this year, the price was a 1st round pick for a trip to the second round. If they get to the ECF, the price was 2 first round picks for a trip to ECF. Hopefully, they win the Cup this year or next and the price is worth it.

I would agree... They have to get by the Pens for it to be worthwhile. I can't imagine they thought by adding Marty they would have enough to get by the Bruins though, especially if they head into the ECF with Nash having 0 goals.
 
I would agree... They have to get by the Pens for it to be worthwhile. I can't imagine they thought by adding Marty they would have enough to get by the Bruins though, especially if they head into the ECF with Nash having 0 goals.
For me, I would not categorize paying 2 first round picks for a trip to ECF as worthwhile. If they did not believe that by adding MSL would be enough to put them on equal footing as the Bruins, then why sacrifice the picks.

As I believe PLD said, this trade was made with ultimate playoff success in mind. And that will be the ultimate way to judge it.
 
I think his point was we weren't going to sign Callahan anyway, so to him it's not really a lost asset.

So he's saying the picks are all we are giving up. If we beat the Pens, under his logic, it would be a 2014 1st, 2015 1st, 2015 7th for Marty and a 2015 2nd.

If we don't beat the Pens, he's saying the 2nd cancel out and it's really Marty for a 1st and a 7th.

SO, under that premise, Callahan is a THROW IN?
 
Its all confusing..What if we beat the Pens and Cally doesn't resign with Tampa? Do we still lose this years number 1?

If we get to the SCF we can only sign your father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate.

Tampa Bay get's the greatest unknown player ever signed that's not Ryan Callahan.
 
SO, under that premise, Callahan is a THROW IN?

I guess, I was explaining what he was saying, not my opinion. I think the point was that Callahan wasn't going to sign here so giving him up wasn't exactly a loss, because we wouldn't have paid the price - although that fails to acknowledge his presence on the roster this season.
 
OK so let's take another perspective:

Suppose we kept Callahan (and the picks) with the intention of letting him walk at FA?

Does that mean we were expeting to go all the way as is this year?

Or.....were we expecting to go all the way when those unknown pics came to fruition along with some other FA signing? (using the added cap space) And if that's the case, what is the timeline?

2 years? 3 years? 5years?

Is the alternative to making the MSL deal really better? esplain

Personally I'm not losing any sleep over the pics. We have one of the most dynamic players of the modern era. AND, he can still play!
 
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