Salary Cap: Marner Deal Discussion Part III

[Mr Hockey]

Then they’ll probably just fold the franchise.

see, they shoulda kept Lou ...

 

[Menzinger]

gotta love the armchair GM eh? amazing how these guys always sign players cheaper and get better returns on trades. You must be batting away GM jobs with a stick!

Lol.

Arguments sure are easy when certain folks rely on totally fictional numbers

 

[Bomber0104]

Closest I’ve seen is Tarasenko fitting the bill. Sprinkled with injury but he produced at a comparable rate and scored more goals. He did it a year older I believe.

They're not comparable in point production or age.

Tarasenko's first full year in the NHL was in his D+4 year.

 

[BoredBrandonPridham]

see, they shoulda kept Lou ...

He quit to fulfil his lifelong dream of running the Isles into the ground.

 

[Erndog]

Of course they would get paid, that's not the issue. The issue is we could have had them at much lower numbers. Matthews was available at 9 per as was marner. Nylander was at least $1M more than it should have been. All total that's like $6M.

Matthews almost played for free but the CBA didnt allow it.

 

[Mr Hockey]

He quit to fulfil his lifelong dream of running the Isles into the ground.

Possible, he could still hate the Isles from way back when

 

[A1LeafNation]

So in today's cap, what cap hit did Kane and Tarensenko sign for after their entry level deals?

 

[Peasy]

So in today's cap, what cap hit did Kane and Tarensenko sign for after their entry level deals?

8.82m for Kane
8.16m for Senko

(Those values are based on a 79.5m cap).


9.2m for Kane
8.5m for Senko

(83m cap).

 

[A1LeafNation]

8.76m for Kane
8.11m for Senko

(Those values are based on a 79m cap).

And on and 83m cap it's like 9m give or take.

So f*** off Marner and sign your deal.

 

[Peasy]

And on and 83m cap it's like 9m give or take.

So **** off Marner and sign your deal.

Yeah I updated with 83m cap.

Friedman was saying that the cap might not even hit 83m next season based on the escrow.

 

[The CyNick]

gotta love the armchair GM eh? amazing how these guys always sign players cheaper and get better returns on trades. You must be batting away GM jobs with a stick!

I'm just telling you what the offers were. The young GM could have had marner at $9M x 8 years last summer. He decided to bet against marner having a great season even though he signed an elite UFA and promised to play him with marner. Now he's going to wind up signing him to matthews money over five years. That's a $2.6M swing against us. With matthews the offer on the table was $9 x 3 years. Another $2.6M flushed away.

Numbers don't lie.

 

[The CyNick]

And on and 83m cap it's like 9m give or take.

So **** off Marner and sign your deal.

Not when matthews was handed so much money. Marner does more for the team than matthews. Why shouldn't he get equal pay?

 

[Menzinger]

I'm just telling you what the offers were. The young GM could have had marner at $9M x 8 years last summer. He decided to bet against marner having a great season even though he signed an elite UFA and promised to play him with marner. Now he's going to wind up signing him to matthews money over five years. That's a $2.6M swing against us. With matthews the offer on the table was $9 x 3 years. Another $2.6M flushed away.

Numbers don't lie.

Only people do when they pull them out of thin air

 

[The CyNick]

Only people do when they pull them out of thin air

I actually heard slightly different numbers that make the young GM look even more foolish, but I'm going by what was widely reported by trusted sources based on the guidelines of this site.

If your problem is who this site identifies as trusted sources, I would suggest you take it up with a mod and not waste space on here debating it.

 

[nuck]

So in today's cap, what cap hit did Kane and Tarensenko sign for after their entry level deals?

Tarasenko $7.5M but cap was about 16% lower so $8.7M today. A bit of front loading but no bonuses. Kane was $6.3M but cap was 40% lower so $8.8M today A small bonus and his season was almost identical to Marner's but then the monster playoff where he lead the club in scoring and they won the Cup. You can't just correct for cap growth though, as RFAs are now negotiating like UFAs and Mitch Marner's dad thinks he is the second best player in the league

In an alternate reality where the club never signed JT and Matthews wanted to wait till the last minute to sign, what would Marner's ask be? Actually he would probably be pointing to Eichel so his floor would start at $10M anyways. Matthews pushed for McDavid money based on his potential seasons, not his actual ones, and while he didn't quite reach that he got a short term and massive front loading so crazy money for 73pts. Mitch just says "look at my actual season and pay me, but I don't accept that wingers are less valuable and assists are the same as goals." Does that really make much less sense?

Matthews got overpaid so that sets Mitch's bar higher as well because the cap is the club's problem, not the player's. I blame Dubas a bit, but Pegula dropping his pants for Eichel really set this group of contracts down the path to today where McDavid got X and our boy is almost the same so lets pay him like it.

I can't wait til this crap is done and we can just cheer for whatever lineup they can afford to keep.

 

[Menzinger]

I actually heard slightly different numbers that make the young GM look even more foolish, but I'm going by what was widely reported by trusted sources based on the guidelines of this site.

If your problem is who this site identifies as trusted sources, I would suggest you take it up with a mod and not waste space on here debating it.

Matthew's at 9 million was not "widely reported". One article suggested that a short bridge was discussed - but there is absolutely zero evidence suggestting it was anything remotely near finalized. You're manipulating facts to take a pot shot at Dubas (like always).

 

[LaPlante94]

Not when matthews was handed so much money. Marner does more for the team than matthews. Why shouldn't he get equal pay?

The only wingers in this league who make as much as some of the top C in the league have 40-50 goal seasons on their resumes. You get paid to score in this league and if you're a top line C. He deserves anything between 9.5-10 mil and that's about it. I'm actually curious if there's a team in the last 15 years or so that had a winger as their highest paid player and won anything? Even Ovechkin couldn't do it until they got 2 top centers in Kuznetsov and Backstrom. Kane and Toews always had the same cap hit but they never had a 2nd line C like Tavares or even close and had a much better D core and a goalie on a much cheaper deal than ours. Maybe it's happened but I can't remember if so.

 

[A1LeafNation]

Not when matthews was handed so much money. Marner does more for the team than matthews. Why shouldn't he get equal pay?

Matthews was given the Malkin equivalent. Marnerh should be given the Kane equivalent if that's the case, even though they never won a cup on their entry level deals.

Marner is not a center nor will ever be a center and will never be the face of the franchise or up there with McDavid representing the face of the NHL.

 

[Notsince67]

And on and 83m cap it's like 9m give or take.

So **** off Marner and sign your deal.

9.3MM for 5 years. would translate to 11+ for 8 years... number that Matthews should have been signed for.

 

[Notsince67]

I'm just telling you what the offers were. The young GM could have had marner at $9M x 8 years last summer. He decided to bet against marner having a great season even though he signed an elite UFA and promised to play him with marner. Now he's going to wind up signing him to matthews money over five years. That's a $2.6M swing against us. With matthews the offer on the table was $9 x 3 years. Another $2.6M flushed away.

Numbers don't lie.

Pretty sure that 9 was marners ask. Could have probably signed him for 8.5

 

[Notsince67]

Matthews was given the Malkin equivalent. Marnerh should be given the Kane equivalent if that's the case, even though they never won a cup on their entry level deals.

Marner is not a center nor will ever be a center and will never be the face of the franchise or up there with McDavid representing the face of the NHL.

Except Marner and Kane are pretty close comparables while Malkin and Matthews weren't even close

 

[Jozay]

I'm just telling you what the offers were. The young GM could have had marner at $9M x 8 years last summer. He decided to bet against marner having a great season even though he signed an elite UFA and promised to play him with marner. Now he's going to wind up signing him to matthews money over five years. That's a $2.6M swing against us. With matthews the offer on the table was $9 x 3 years. Another $2.6M flushed away.

Numbers don't lie.

LMAO, you cant be serious.

You actually think giving Marner 9 mill a year last summer would've been smart?

You'd probably be the first one killing Dubas for giving Marner a deal like that.

 

[Walshy7]

LMAO, you cant be serious.

You actually think giving Marner 9 mill a year last summer would've been smart?

You'd probably be the first one killing Dubas for giving Marner a deal like that.

And still arguing $9m is overpaid after his 94 point season. That guy couldn’t be more transparent,

 

[ITM]

I'm just telling you what the offers were. The young GM could have had marner at $9M x 8 years last summer. He decided to bet against marner having a great season even though he signed an elite UFA and promised to play him with marner. Now he's going to wind up signing him to matthews money over five years. That's a $2.6M swing against us. With matthews the offer on the table was $9 x 3 years. Another $2.6M flushed away.

Numbers don't lie.

Mindful of the deal that never was, Dubas didn't bet against Marner because he didn't accept that side's proposal. In every action taken for the club, Dubas isn't hoping for less in the assets he's acquiring and re-signing. He's betting on the club he's building to improve.

Your point is presentable without fiction.

 

[A1LeafNation]

All I heard was Marner wanted to wait for the other two to be done first.

There was no real negotiation talks with him last summer imo.