Salary Cap: Marner Contract Discussion - Training camp looms

[ShaneFalco]

Wants to play here and nowhere else but doing everything possible to make it difficult to sign him and if signed, he's likely not here long.
Well done Mitch.

 

[kb]

its finding a partner though. 7/77 is a pretty big overpayment for marner, the new team would have to not only pay that contract but give up fair value to us for marner

If it didn't work here, why do people assume he'd torpedo his entire life and career by being this stupid a second time?

He does this a second time, he can enjoy sitting or playing in the KHL.

 

[DarkKnight]

@SAMCRO44 Just to respond to the Mirtle comment on the other thread. Sure he could be wrong, but a lot around here treat him like an oracle, so....

 

[Walshy7]

Marner for Provorov...does either side not think long and hard about that?

in a vacuum Marner is worth more and a decent piece more, but due to horrendous contract demands youd have to think. Provorov had a pretty bad year last year no?

 

[HockeyGuruPitka]

Leafs fans always go no matter who is in the line-up.

If they can't agree to a contract that works for both you trade him.

It will always come to that.

Team will move on and so will the player.

this would be a decision you make in around July 1, when you can spend the money on FA and teams are still shaping up the lineups and willing to part with young guys. Right now the options are either sign him or let him sit.

 

[SprDaVE]

Actually, trading him out of Canada probably eliminates the circus.

I think the compensation not the price is what stops teams from offersheeting him, and the fact he thinks he can get whatever he wants in Toronto.

Leafs have to entertain trading him, the same way that marner entertained offersheets.

They should but the return would be almost worst than the contract wants from Marners camp.

 

[WTFMAN99]

Wants to play here and nowhere else but doing everything possible to make it difficult to sign him and if signed, he's likely not here long.
Well done Mitch.

I don't even think a 3 year deal is a good idea anymore. Reality is if he's this difficult in the next 3 years, team will either have to significantly overpay or he can take the 1 year QO and walk to UFA.

7-8 year extension would make the most sense simply because we don't have to go through this again. If it is a 3 year extension, I don't expect him to be a Leaf after that. This negotiation has been brutal.

 

[ShaneFalco]

Also...re: Dregers report...we can't just include past bonus money in a contract...is he that much up the agents a$$ that he actually needs to sell that part of an $11mil cap hit is $1.6 mil in back time bonuses he wasn't good enough to get out of Lou as the agent to sell this as something worse then it really is?

That he even mentioned that tells you how petty the Marner camp is. I honestly feel bad for the guy for being surrounded by fools.

He can do what he wants and choose to get this over with. Instead he pretends he's out of the loop

 

[Dekes For Days]

Yes, but if all that matters is the most recent 94 point season (in some minds), then all that really matters is how you perform in the big games.

I don't agree that his 94 point season is all you need to look at, and I don't think a 7-game sample against one team with specific circumstances is the same value in comparisons as an 82-game sample (or bigger) against a similar group of teams as everybody else.

What would you rather a player win, Art Ross or Conn Smythe?

Frankly, both are pretty meaningless. I'd rather have the cup. And the best way to do that is to recognize the true value of the players you have.

 

[Jack Bauer]

What he means is that they offered more in the contract to make up for not including the bonuses in his ELC.

So basically they included ~1.6M more in the contract than they normally would.

So now we're not even just making $11 mil offers its $9.4+$1.6 to make him feel better about the deal?

It's $11 mil. There is no back time bonus money. That language can't and won't exist in the deal. It's an ego stroking way of presenting the exact same deal John Tavares signed.

 

[Punch Drunk Loov]

You work your entire life to have a career in hockey. If you're offered 77M you've achieved your life's goal AND it's on your favourite team where your family lives. How can you possibly hold out for 82M or something?

 

[Jack Bauer]

Nylander set his own precedent by holding out until the last possible minute and then played like dog-**** the rest of the year.

I guess Marner feels he can do the same thing now with impunity.

And in 10 weeks time you'll be on here celebrating Dubas for that deal when he starts the season and plays very well next to Matthews.

 

[SprDaVE]

So now we're not even just making $11 mil offers its $9.4+$1.6 to make him feel better about the deal?

It's $11 mil. There is no back time bonus money. That language can't and won't exist in the deal. It's an ego stroking way of presenting the exact same deal John Tavares signed.

I agree. I'm just trying to explain what Dreger meant. It's obvious that it's a huge thing from Ferris and Marner that they need to repay for not included them in their ELC in some capacity.

The Marner camp still talking about not getting bonuses from Lamoriello's time here is something else.

 

[Damisoph]

Nylander set his own precedent by holding out until the last possible minute and then played like dog-**** the rest of the year.

I guess Marner feels he can do the same thing now with impunity.

Man, you just take huge leaps to push this narrative you’ve got going. Good for you.

$11m is an overpay at any term and Ferris should have taken that and ran, if it was actually offered. I bet point comes in at under that $8.83m for three years that mirtle is pushing.

 

[ULF_55]

Nylander set his own precedent by holding out until the last possible minute and then played like dog-**** the rest of the year.

I guess Marner feels he can do the same thing now with impunity.

Yes, he did ... well he started like dog poop, got up to speed and played with someone who fell off a cliff career wise who got bought out and rejected for any deal from his life long team.

Points wise it was dreadful ... but his contract was based on his ELC years.

 

[Jack Bauer]

He can do what he wants and choose to get this over with. Instead he pretends he's out of the loop

Which in say 1997 you might be able to understand.

A young 20-something in 2019?

Stop insulting our intelligence. (not you, SAMCRO44 )

Such a hard thing to accept when you see the offers and view the comparables.

At this point i'd offer him less and make it a "sign for 3/24 or 7/73.5" but you're signing one of those 2 or not playing in the NHL for 1-2 years. Good luck making that money back during 2 lockouts and maybe even rollbacks as well before you retire.

 

[Jack Bauer]

I agree. I'm just trying to explain what Dreger meant. It's obvious that it's a huge thing from Ferris and Marner that they need to repay for not included them in their ELC in some capacity.

The Marner camp still talking about not getting bonuses from Lamoriello's time here is something else.

That alone would have me sitting along with Mitch asking if he's willing to let his agent turn him into a villain for the rest of his life in his home town.

Who else in NHL hard cap CBA history has whined this hard about not getting a B bonus?

 

[inthe6ix]

in a vacuum Marner is worth more and a decent piece more, but due to horrendous contract demands youd have to think. Provorov had a pretty bad year last year no?

Yeah Provorov was pretty mediocre last year.

Although if MM moves, I wouldn't want him anywhere staying in the East - would hate to have to face him back here multiple times per year.

Parayko would be a stretch, but if we had to add, that's something worth entertaining.

Aiming lower, Dumba in Minny would be nice too.

 

[DarkKnight]

Anyone entertaining trading Marner at this point has lost the plot....completely. Also, if you actually expect Dubas to publicly state he would entertain trading him, you're a complete maroon.

 

[kb]

Which in say 1997 you might be able to understand.

A young 20-something in 2019?

Stop insulting our intelligence. (not you, SAMCRO44 )

Such a hard thing to accept when you see the offers and view the comparables.

At this point i'd offer him less and make it a "sign for 3/24 or 7/73.5" but you're signing one of those 2 or not playing in the NHL for 1-2 years. Good luck making that money back during 2 lockouts and maybe even rollbacks as well before you retire.

And roll back the offers as time goes on.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Next time Marner is asked about it "oh you know I have no idea I've just been playing fortnight for the last 4 months I would never ever in a million years tell my agent what I want....its all him I swear."

 

[Bomber0104]

And in 10 weeks time you'll be on here celebrating Dubas for that deal when he starts the season and plays very well next to Matthews.

You make that sound like a guarantee.

Can't wait.

 

[ULF_55]

They should but the return would be almost worst than the contract wants from Marners camp.

Except you can't let the player dictate how the team is built, nor what decisions the team makes with regards to player deployment, letters, ...

Team Player ... team always comes first.

 

[Bomber0104]

Man, you just take huge leaps to push this narrative you’ve got going. Good for you.

$11m is an overpay at any term and Ferris should have taken that and ran, if it was actually offered. I bet point comes in at under that $8.83m for three years that mirtle is pushing.

What narrative?

You're already conceding that Dubas is overypaying by $11M at any term so what exactly is wrong about what I've said?

He's backed himself into a corner and now he's getting bent over even worse than he did in the Matthews deal.

 

[Jack Bauer]

You make that sound like a guarantee.

Can't wait.

You clearly have an anti-Nylander bias and can't let it go.

I'll say you'd eat your words but your style of poster will just move on to your next OCD player obsession.