Value of: Marco Rossi +

[HuGort]

MN would be looking for a high 1st in this years draft - our offer would be something like

Marco Rossi + 2024 3rd

Would prefer to keep our first - the plus along with Rossi can be negotiated....looking to get into the top 5 ideally. What's your teams best offer and what would the plus need to look like?

Habs might trade our first for Rossi plus your first? I have to think about it though. We currently draft 7th. If guy we want at 7 is gone.

 

[roon]

How can you not see that? You expect a top 5 pick to perform at a similar pace at 19-20 years old, not 22.

A bigger, stronger, younger, more skilled & talented Dach was traded for #13. A better comparable for Rossi would be Newhook.


Let’s be realistic for a moment, would you trade ANY of the players you mentioned above for Rossi? I wouldn’t. You don’t trade potential building blocks for complementary pieces like Rossi. He’s good, but he ain’t it

On top of that, all those teams are still rebuilding and nowhere near close to compete again. Rossi ain’t it

Kirby Dach isn't playing like he is a more talented anything.

 

[roon]

Habs might trade our first for Rossi plus your first? I have to think about it though. We currently draft 7th. If guy we want at 7 is gone.

The difference between Rossi and the 7th OA is not our 1st round pick in the mid teens.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Kirby Dach isn't playing like he is a more talented anything.

Although a very limited sample size but Dach was by far our best forward during training camp and the first game he played. Better than Suzuki even.

But let’s say that doesn’t count. Their 22 years old season had Dach (last year) with more points than Rossi (this yesr) with 13 less games played. Nevermind the fact that one is 6’4 220 and the other is 5’9 180.

I’m sorry again but you’re not getting anywhere near a top 10 pick for Rossi. Again, your best comparable is Newhook is who got a late first and early second.

 

[roon]

Although a very limited sample size but Dach was by far our best forward during training camp and the first game he played. Better than Suzuki even.

But let’s say that doesn’t count. Their 22 years old season had Dach (last year) with more points than Rossi (this yesr) with 13 less games played. Nevermind the fact that one is 6’4 220 and the other is 5’9 180.

I’m sorry again but you’re not getting anywhere near a top 10 pick for Rossi. Again, your best comparable is Newhook is who got a late first and early second.

Alright - thats one Habs fan's opinion.

 

[AKL]

You don't trade Rossi for a draft pick. If you think Rossi is expendable (he isn't), trade him for a similar aged, similar caliber defenseman.

Trading Rossi is incredibly short sighted.

 

[f7ben]

You don't trade Rossi for a draft pick. If you think Rossi is expendable (he isn't), trade him for a similar aged, similar caliber defenseman.

Trading Rossi is incredibly short sighted.

I would rather move Ek than Rossi at this point.

 

[squashmaple]

Columbus could be interested in Rossi, but probably only if they somehow end up with 6th OA or worse, and much more likely for something other than that pick anyway. But they also don't line up well with Minnesota. Columbus only has the two top defense prospects (Jiricek, Mateychuk) and no appetite to move either one. Can't really see Minnesota being interested in Columbus's farm full of ten million small wings, either. The new GM may also want to use the top-10 pick as a chance to put his own stamp on the organization more than to acquire an older player.

Now if you want to talk JEEK, Columbus is all ears no matter who they hire as GM, and that pick and more is on the table for sure.

 

[Osakahaus]

if im the Islanders I should just trade Rossi for nelson, wahlstrom, and a 2025 2nd

 

[Baksfamous112]

Alright - thats one Habs fan's opinion.

Seems to me like it’s pretty much everyone’s opinion other than yours so far.

 

[AKL]

if im the Islanders I should just trade Rossi for nelson, wahlstrom, and a 2025 2nd

Yeah I have no doubt the Islanders would jump for joy at this idea

 

[Osakahaus]

Yeah I have no doubt the Islanders would jump for joy at this idea

well the problem is the Wild and their cap hit. Do they want Nelson, and do they believe that Wahlstrom is a good player still? He's become very meh in doses and the islanders have seemingly given up on him. Given their track record in the past with disgruntled 1st round islanders forwards, maybe don't trade Wahlstrom to them. Perhaps wahlstrom scores an overtime goal in game 7

 

[AKL]

well the problem is the Wild and their cap hit. Do they want Nelson, and do they believe that Wahlstrom is a good player still? He's become very meh in doses and the islanders have seemingly given up on him. Given their track record in the past with disgruntled 1st round islanders forwards, maybe don't trade Wahlstrom to them. Perhaps wahlstrom scores an overtime goal in game 7

The problem is that's a ridiculous proposal for Rossi and the Wild would never consider it for numerous reasons

 

[GOilers88]

If Rossi is becoming a legitimate top 6 center at age 22, that's kind of exactly what you'd expect from the 18 year old kid you draft this year.

Looks to me like a team would be trading with the intent of skipping 3/4 years of development time, which is certainly reasonable imo. People have made that out to be an insane proposal, but I don't think I agree.

This site has always favored draft picks and mystery boxes over proven players, and like OP I've never really understood it either. I think most people here would have a completely U23 team if it were up to them, and then be dumbfounded when it struggles to succeed.

Though I can't say I've watched Minny or Rossi, so it entirely depends on what you think he is right now.

 

[AKL]

This site has always favored draft picks and mystery boxes over proven players, and like OP I've never really understood it either.

OP is valuing a mystery box over a much more proven player

 

[roon]

OP is valuing a mystery box over a much more proven player

I would say I am willing to trade one of our known commodities for the chance to improve our Defensive mystery box prospects.

F depth is a strength of ours - D depth not so much.

 

[GOilers88]

OP is valuing a mystery box over a much more proven player

OP is valuing defense over forwards. He said it pretty clearly.

 

[BondraTime]

Rossi doesn’t have near that kind of value around the league.

Teams aren’t trading out of the top 5 picks knowingly.

Have to go back to what, 2002 for the last time a top 5 pick was traded leading up to the draft when it was a known pick (not including Stutzle or Byram picks that were traded years prior). That trend isn’t going to be bucked for Marco Rossi and a few odds and ends.

 

[AKL]

I would say I am willing to trade one of our known commodities for the chance to improve our Defensive mystery box prospects.

F depth is a strength of ours - D depth not so much.

F depth chart was also a strength of ours when we had Granlund, Nino, Coyle, Zucker, Larsson, etc. Then it wasn't. Have some patience. Wait to see who actually meets or exceeds expectations, and who falls short. Trying to win the game before the game starts is how you lose the game.

OP is valuing defense over forwards. He said it pretty clearly.

OP is trading a 22 year old middle six C with potential for a draft pick.

If he valued defense he would trade that player for another similar aged and similar caliber defenseman.

He may want a defenseman, but he is putting the mystery box defenseman over the established forward.

 

[GOilers88]

Rossi doesn’t have near that kind of value around the league.

Even if I may lean to agree with that, it's just a guess. Nobody has any idea what GM's would value him at. 22 year old top six center? Sounds like a draft pick this year without the 3 years of development to get there.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if there was a team out there who bit in it, no matter how unlikely some think it may be.

F depth chart was also a strength of ours when we had Granlund, Nino, Coyle, Zucker, Larsson, etc. Then it wasn't. Have some patience. Wait to see who actually meets or exceeds expectations, and who falls short. Trying to win the game before the game starts is how you lose the game.



OP is trading a 22 year old middle six C with potential for a draft pick.

If he valued defense he would trade that player for another similar aged and similar caliber defenseman.

He may want a defenseman, but he is putting the mystery box defenseman over the established forward.

He can still value defense and prefer to go with a defensive prospect.

Is there any top 4, 22 year old defensemen out there that would be available? Maybe throw some names out there. This is why discussions take place.

 

[AKL]

He can still value defense and prefer to go with a defensive prospect.

Right, so we agree he's valuing the mystery box over the proven player.

 

[Baksfamous112]

If Rossi is becoming a legitimate top 6 center at age 22, that's kind of exactly what you'd expect from the 18 year old kid you draft this year.

Looks to me like a team would be trading with the intent of skipping 3/4 years of development time, which is certainly reasonable imo. People have made that out to be an insane proposal, but I don't think I agree.

This site has always favored draft picks and mystery boxes over proven players, and like OP I've never really understood it either. I think most people here would have a completely U23 team if it were up to them, and then be dumbfounded when it struggles to succeed.

Though I can't say I've watched Minny or Rossi, so it entirely depends on what you think he is right now.

Not exactly. With a top 5 pick you're mostly looking at a building block asset. first liner center, top pairing D or elite wingers. Below average 2C at 22 is not exactly what you expect from a top 5 draft pick, sorry

OP is valuing a mystery box over a much more proven player

Let's look at those mystery boxes since Rossi was drafted and let's see how many of them you take before Rossi:

2020:

1. Lafreniere - Yes
2. Byfield - Yes
3. Stutzle - Yes
4. Raymond - Yes
5. Sanderson - Yes

2021:

1. Powers - Yes
2. Beniers - Yes
3. McTavish - Yes
4. Hughes - Yes
5. Johnson - Debatable but I think I take Johnson although I could argue Rossi is move proven

2022:

1. Slafkovsky - Yes
2. Nemec - Yes
3. Cooley - Yes
4. Wright - No
5. Gauthier - Yes

2023:

1. Bedard - Yes
2. Carlsson - yes
3. Fantilli - Yes
4. Smith - Yes
5. Reinbacher - Yes

Those mystery boxes usually end up much, much better than a guy like Rossi would so you can understand why people would value those much more than a complimentary piece like Rossi.

Even if I may lean to agree with that, it's just a guess. Nobody has any idea what GM's would value him at. 22 year old top six center? Sounds like a draft pick this year without the 3 years of development to get there.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if there was a team out there who bit in it, no matter how unlikely some think it may be.


He can still value defense and prefer to go with a defensive prospect.

Is there any top 4, 22 year old defensemen out there that would be available? Maybe throw some names out there. This is why discussions take place.

Even if you value him as a top 6 center, no one is ditching out a top 5 pick for him. No one.

 

[BondraTime]

Even if I may lean to agree with that, it's just a guess. Nobody has any idea what GM's would value him at. 22 year old top six center? Sounds like a draft pick this year without the 3 years of development to get there.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if there was a team out there who bit in it, no matter how unlikely some think it may be.

If you’re taking an offensive C in the top 5 of the draft, the pick that is being asked to give up (not even mentioning that Center is 5’9) and he had 37 points in his D+4, you’re not very pleased with the selection, even if he’s playing in your top 6.

 

[BuiumSaveUs]

Don’t think trading Rossi makes a whole lot of sense but Guerin doesn’t like him

 

[GOilers88]

Not exactly. With a top 5 pick you're mostly looking at a building block asset. first liner center, top pairing D or elite wingers. Below average 2C at 22 is not exactly what you expect from a top 5 draft pick, sorry

Let's look at those mystery boxes since Rossi was drafted and let's see how many of them you take before Rossi:

2020:

1. Lafreniere - Yes
2. Byfield - Yes
3. Stutzle - Yes
4. Raymond - Yes
5. Sanderson - Yes

2021:

1. Powers - Yes
2. Beniers - Yes
3. McTavish - Yes
4. Hughes - Yes
5. Johnson - Debatable but I think I take Johnson although I could argue Rossi is move proven

2022:

1. Slafkovsky - Yes
2. Nemec - Yes
3. Cooley - Yes
4. Wright - No
5. Gauthier - Yes

2023:

1. Bedard - Yes
2. Carlsson - yes
3. Fantilli - Yes
4. Smith - Yes
5. Reinbacher - Yes

Those mystery boxes usually end up much, much better than a guy like Rossi would so you can understand why people would value those much more than a complimentary piece like Rossi.


Even if you value him as a top 6 center, no one is ditching out a top 5 pick for him. No one.

He's also repeatedly stated that his proposal was contingent on additions to Rossi, which hasn't been addressed once.

"Looking to get into the top 5 IDEALLY".

It appears as though most people just decided Rossi isn't worth a top 5 pick, discussion over." without even trying to discuss anything.