Friedman: Mackinnon injury might force Avs to go big game hunting sooner rather than later ( Toews, Horvat)

[BB88]

Um yeah, sure. "Anything could happen".

But there hasn't been any evidence with how Carolina runs their club that they would go big-game hunting after a rental. They haven't done it. It's not like they weren't considered contenders last season, and they didn't do it then.

Again, the Canes have been considered contenders for a few seasons now and have not made a big rental addition at the trade deadline. I doubt it happens now.

Calling the Avs conservative...a team that traded major roster pieces to retool prior to last season's trade deadline...is a take lmao.

You’d think at some point Carolina would like to get over the barrier and to the finals?

Their roster is build to win now and they have a major hole on that roster

 

[Big Muddy]

Not really actually. The only assets we'd want from Colorado I doubt are on the table. Not interested in their bottom 5 1st.

Well, that's too bad I guess. Probably best to throw those small fish away.

 

[StickShift]

Perfect storm for the Canucks to maximize a return for Horvat.

Naturally this means they will re-sign him long-term.

 

[bossram]

I know, 'the best predictor of future behaviour is past behaviour' and you may well be right, but if Carolina doesn't invest in today at some point they are going to miss their window.

Or you build a good team year-in and year-out, without mortgaging the future so that you have a steady pipeline, and hope it comes together (like STL or WAS).

You’d think at some point Carolina would like to get over the barrier and to the finals?

Their roster is build to win now and they have a major hole on that roster

 

[BB88]

Or you build a good team year-in and year-out, without mortgaging the future so that you have a steady pipeline, and hope it comes together (like STL or WAS).

The goal is to win the Cup.

Not be a 2nd round exit team

 

[bossram]

The goal is to win the Cup.

Not be a 2nd round exit team

So you're saying trading for Horvat is 100% guaranteed to win the Cup then? Why isn't everyone trying to do that?

 

[EdAVSfan]

To be fair, Colorado was a conservative deadline trading team until it wasn’t.

Carolina may or may not make different decisions. Really all depends on how they feel their chances are in the short term (1-3 years)

 

[CallMeShaft]

Don't know how Colorado would get Horvat. They do not possess the assets needed to trade for a 27yo 1B level center.

Toews would be an easier get, but that's provided he waives his NMC for Avs (you'd think he would, but who knows).

 

[Cypher]

Not trading Avs 1st rounder until closer to the deadline. Who knows how far down the standing Avs will fall with all these injuries. Unless the pick is top5/10 protected.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I wonder if the Avs might be interested in adding a depth player who might well be a useful addition for the medium term.... thinking specifically of Dvorak, who'd be a useful 2/3C once McK is back but might also help fill the gap in the meantime. I guess cap-wise this only works if McK is out long-term.

No. We can't afford a 3C making North of $4M.

Literally zero interest in Dvorak.

 

[BB88]

So you're saying trading for Horvat is 100% guaranteed to win the Cup then? Why isn't everyone trying to do that?

No?

I’m saying maybe they should someday break out of their habit of not going after bigger players at the deadline to make a push.

Their team has a clear ceiling and it’s not the Cup

 

[bobbyking]

the best toews in the NHL already plays for them

 

[Canucks LB]

Toews not playing

 

[Perratrooper]

How about a first, Girard and Newhook for Timo and Reimer?

I’d be more than happy with the Avs getting Meier, but I don’t think the value is a first +Newhook+Girard and Colorado has no need for Reimer as Francouz and Georgiev are close to/if not better goalies.

Toews not playing

 

[Avsfan1921]

Is Newhook really that good? I'm not being snarky, I'm actually asking.

Either way, the Canucks need good young defencemen, not more skill forwards, though I guess it depends on who we lose if JR actually decides to sell.

Currently, no. And frankly, he’s not trending in the right direction either. He’s gotten a few points but his play has been less than stellar since he’s entered the league. He doesn’t show any offensive flashes with regularity, sucks at board battles and is not good defensively. He isn’t going to return much when he’s traded imo.

However, people are giving th Avs too much credit when it comes to their 1st round pick… they will likely still make the playoffs but it’s not gonna be in a top position. The pick will likely be high teens to early twenties unless everyone gets miraculously healthy, which probably holds a bit more value than Newhook and his draft pedigree.

So in order to get a Horvat calibre player I’d say it would take more than Newhook and a first but we don’t much in the system outside of those two pieces. Girard still holds more value than most people think I suspect but he’s not what Vancouver needs. If Sakic can find a team that likes him though, I could see either him or van flipping him as “part” of a trade that brings Horvat to Colorado.

 

[Drury_Sakic]

All in favor of making the big swing now, but Joe best protect a lotto pick this year if they deal the 1st. This season has all the making of a trap if injuries continue on.

 

[biturbo19]

Toews to the Avs, and then experiencing a big scoring resurgence going on a tear, and winning the Cup to further cement his intangible legacy just feels like one of those "meant to be" sort of things. I can't really explain why that seems to "right"...but it feels like something that is just supposed to happen as part of NHL history.


Not sure if i'm mixing in some Bourque storylines or where it's really coming from. But i'm fully expecting it to be a thing. I've convinced myself, outside of rational reasoning.




Horvat to Colorado just doesn't seem like the right storyline. Nor do the Avs really have the pieces to lead to a satisfactory return for me as a Canucks fan. The ship has sailed on prying Byram out of Colorado, and outside of that...there isn't much in the cupboards that is of a high enough caliber to get my excited as a centerpiece. Nor are their 1st round picks that enticing, as especially with Horvat, that'd be a late pick. Too many other teams have pieces that i covet far more than anything the Avs could offer.

 

[Canadian Canuck]

So you're saying trading for Horvat is 100% guaranteed to win the Cup then? Why isn't everyone trying to do that?

What a stupid question. Maybe because not every team is a Horvat away from being legit favourites? Colorado would have the highest odds by a long shot to repeat with the addition of Horvat. Team's like Boston would also become instant favourites.

 

[bossram]

No?

I’m saying maybe they should someday break out of their habit of not going after bigger players at the deadline to make a push.

Their team has a clear ceiling and it’s not the Cup

People said that about the Caps and Blues before they won their Cups. Not good enough. But they had good teams every year, made some good but not blockbuster additions at the deadline, and found a way to win.

I think the Canes can win the Cup with or without Horvat. Would he help? Yeah, obviously. But I don't see anything wrong with Carolina's philosophy of maintaining a competitive club for the long-term, and not blowing all their cash at one trade deadline.

I don't know what your fetish is with Horvat to the Canes.

What a stupid question. Maybe because not every team is a Horvat away from being legit favourites? Colorado would have the highest odds by a long shot to repeat with the addition of Horvat. Team's like Boston would also become instant favourites.

I have no idea why you're inserting yourself here, responding to a clearly exaggerated comment.

I was responding to someone saying they think Horvat to the Canes is mostly likely (it's not, it's very unlikely because it's never been the MO of the current Canes regime to spend big on rentals) and that the Canes need Horvat to win the Cup (I don't think that's true).

 

[Ita]

Currently, no. And frankly, he’s not trending in the right direction either. He’s gotten a few points but his play has been less than stellar since he’s entered the league. He doesn’t show any offensive flashes with regularity, sucks at board battles and is not good defensively. He isn’t going to return much when he’s traded imo.

However, people are giving th Avs too much credit when it comes to their 1st round pick… they will likely still make the playoffs but it’s not gonna be in a top position. The pick will likely be high teens to early twenties unless everyone gets miraculously healthy, which probably holds a bit more value than Newhook and his draft pedigree.

So in order to get a Horvat calibre player I’d say it would take more than Newhook and a first but we don’t much in the system outside of those two pieces. Girard still holds more value than most people think I suspect but he’s not what Vancouver needs. If Sakic can find a team that likes him though, I could see either him or van flipping him as “part” of a trade that brings Horvat to Colorado.

Just want to say I appreciate your honest and candid response on the evaluation of your team's own player. Most fans are usually biased when evaluating their own team.

 

[BB88]

People said that about the Caps and Blues before they won their Cups. Not good enough. But they had good teams every year, made some good but not blockbuster additions at the deadline, and found a way to win.

I think the Canes can win the Cup with or without Horvat. Would he help? Yeah, obviously. But I don't see anything wrong with Carolina's philosophy of maintaining a competitive club for the long-term, and not blowing all their cash at one trade deadline.

I don't know what your fetish is with Horvat to the Canes.

I have no idea why you're inserting yourself here, responding to a clearly exaggerated comment.

I was responding to someone saying they think Horvat to the Canes is mostly likely (it's not, it's very unlikely because it's never been the MO of the current Canes regime to spend big on rentals) and that the Canes need Horvat to win the Cup (I don't think that's true).

My fetish with Horvat to Carolina?

This is the 1st time I talk about Carolina needing to upgrade the 2C.
It doesn’t have to be Horvat but they need a legit top6 C.

Again I’m simply saying maybe just maybe Carolina should break out of their habbit and go for the big move.

But if you want to build the run around luck and getting hot at the right time go for that instead

Edit
It really sounds like you don’t read the posts you reply

 

[Gstank]

I dont see Colorado having the assets to compete in the Horvat sweepstakes unless they are will to part with Byram.

Maybe a package deal Horvat and Schenn for Byram? Otherwise you are looking at 2 1sts and a good prospects or Newhook, 1st and a prospect like Oaulsson. Lots of other teams have at least a couple of high end prospects or young NHL players that they could part with for Horvat

 

[Xirik]

Horvat

for

Avs 2023 1st and conditional 2024 1st if Av's win the cup in 2023. if not it becomes a 2025 2nd round pick.


Thought of adding Girard but couldn't figure if it that was a bit to much.

 

[Nucker42]

I could totally see Colorado moving Newhook + 1st

They are reigning champions and with Horvat would be well situated for a true challenge at the repeat.

I wouldn’t say this is the specific deal Vancouver should take. I think value wise it’s the ballpark area. As much as Vancouver needs D I think they should grab the best deal prospect wise. They can draft another D.

True…. Newhook would be a good addition for the long term.

Horvat
Schenn

For

Newhook
Kaut
1st
2nd

 

[nammerus]

True…. Newhook would be a good addition for the long term.

Horvat
Schenn

For

Newhook
Kaut
1st
2nd

Done and done.