LW Jimmy Vesey (2012, 66th, NSH; 2016 UFA, NYR)
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The rumor is that this is completely engineered by his advisor and his dad, who is supposedly very involved in Jimmy's career. It doesn't exactly sound like this is an educational move. At the best, this is Vesey's camp making a move to get the absolute best possible offer from Nashville, and they're willing to wait to get it. At the worst, yeah. UFA.
But the thing is, who would be willing to sacrifice hundreds of thousands of dollars in order to gain LESS than that in contract negotiations? It doesn't make any sense. At the minimum, this has to be either about education or becoming a UFA. and I don't think the education aspect is very strong here.
You're condescension is hilarious.. This is not a black and white scenario whereby rules can easily be defined to cover all situations.
I'm well aware of what the CBA states and how it has been clarified.
The rules are based on assumptions of the paths that the vast majority of players will follow. The college route is essentially the only time where player rights are held longer than 2 years. This is why said rules are identified in the CBA, it is meant to protect both the teams and the players, while trying to maintain a balance between the two.
Had they explicitly defined the scenario, the balance would be more in the teams favor as they would have automatic control over a player for a longer period of time than the average player without having to try to lure them away beforehand. (i.e they could see what they had before making any kind of offer)
The rules are not defined in such as way as to condone players only playing out 3 years of college and then becoming UFA's between June and July of that year. In fact the last portion of the rule which defines what "graduation of his college class" means, is there to stop players from starting a 4th year and then stopping short of completing all their credits after hockey is finished so that they become free agents early.
Calling it an afterthought was not really a good way to define the scenario I will give you that. The reality is that the NHL/PA probably knows that this loophole exists, but the pro's of protecting teams against the small amount of players that the scenario applies too, is outweighed by the cons of how teams could take advantage of the prolonged rights.
Either way it does not seem like it is going to matter in this situation anyways as it sounds like he intends to finish college.
P.S Still not sure why you keep hammering on the definition of a loophole either. For the last time, just because rules are explicitly defined does NOT mean that a loophole concerning said rules cannot exist. Not every rule/law can be defined in such a way that it covers all scenarios whether intended or unintended. Just ask any expert in tax law.
I'm well aware of what the CBA states and how it has been clarified.
The rules are based on assumptions of the paths that the vast majority of players will follow. The college route is essentially the only time where player rights are held longer than 2 years. This is why said rules are identified in the CBA, it is meant to protect both the teams and the players, while trying to maintain a balance between the two.
Had they explicitly defined the scenario, the balance would be more in the teams favor as they would have automatic control over a player for a longer period of time than the average player without having to try to lure them away beforehand. (i.e they could see what they had before making any kind of offer)
The rules are not defined in such as way as to condone players only playing out 3 years of college and then becoming UFA's between June and July of that year. In fact the last portion of the rule which defines what "graduation of his college class" means, is there to stop players from starting a 4th year and then stopping short of completing all their credits after hockey is finished so that they become free agents early.
Calling it an afterthought was not really a good way to define the scenario I will give you that. The reality is that the NHL/PA probably knows that this loophole exists, but the pro's of protecting teams against the small amount of players that the scenario applies too, is outweighed by the cons of how teams could take advantage of the prolonged rights.
Either way it does not seem like it is going to matter in this situation anyways as it sounds like he intends to finish college.
P.S Still not sure why you keep hammering on the definition of a loophole either. For the last time, just because rules are explicitly defined does NOT mean that a loophole concerning said rules cannot exist. Not every rule/law can be defined in such a way that it covers all scenarios whether intended or unintended. Just ask any expert in tax law.
Paranoid Android
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- Sep 17, 2006
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MatthewFlames
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A loophole is by definition an unintended consequence. The fact that a NCAA player can become an UFA on August 15 after their senior year is not an unintended consequence. It is the way it is written. So its not a loophole. It is something the NHLPA probably asked for and that the NHL agreed to. When a junior player re-enters the draft and doesn't get drafted, he becomes an UFA. That's not a loophole either. When an undrafted junior player turns 20 they also become UFA's. That is also not a loophole.
Paranoid Android
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Well for starters you quoted a sarcastic joke post with a serious reply. I was expecting your reply to be sarcasm as well
. Secondly, why do you suspect this is not an educational move? Why can't it be both an educational move with a bonus UFA option?
Random Forest
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- May 12, 2010
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Pretty much this. If it's an intended result (or even just one that the framers know is possible), then it's not a loophole, plain and simple. There's really nothing to argue here. It's just not a loophole.
LeafChief
Matthew Knies Enthusiast
Any weaknesses to this guy's game? How close is he to Fiala or Kamanev on the Pred's prospect list?
Edit: Just realized he has an even better progression through the NCAA than Kreider. Would people consider him on the same tier as Kreider when Kreider was his age?
Edit: Just realized he has an even better progression through the NCAA than Kreider. Would people consider him on the same tier as Kreider when Kreider was his age?
I'm pretty sure there is a thread devoted to this issue. This one is actually supposed to be about Vesey (and even though it is the situation that he is in, it's not the place to debate the definition of a loophole).
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From a style prospective, who is a good NHL comparison for Vesey? These comparisons are usually fairly easy to find online, but for some reason I can't find any for Vesey.
The Podium
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thrillhous
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- Jan 5, 2006
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His progression is not better than Kreider's. Kreider started college hockey at age 18, Vesey at 19.
The Podium
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Captain Clutch
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I think Kreider is actually a decent comparison, both big speedy wingers with a nice scoring touch. I would say Kreider is faster but Vesey has really nice wheels. Vesey has higher hockey IQ and is better at making the players around him better. He was the only high schooler on the WJC team that won Gold for the USA two years ago, very impressive player. Doubt seriously he goes anywhere but Nashville, he's that kind of kid.
supermann_98
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- May 8, 2002
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I'm curious to know more about this kid from the amateur scouts in here.
As a leaf fan it's fun to find out more information about any future Leaf players.
As a leaf fan it's fun to find out more information about any future Leaf players.
Woodhouse
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