If they can hang on to both goalies, that would be the best move. But if they need more scoring because of the injuries on the Canucks' 2nd line, then I agree that trading Schneider should be considered. Luongo's contract is just so bad that it may be unmovable. Certainly I would not want that contract in Toronto.
Speculation: Luongo Trade Discussions Thread - All
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If they can hang on to both goalies, that would be the best move. But if they need more scoring because of the injuries on the Canucks' 2nd line, then I agree that trading Schneider should be considered. Luongo's contract is just so bad that it may be unmovable. Certainly I would not want that contract in Toronto.
for this year yes, going in to next they are a bit f'd
they are losing most of their depth and have to resign Edler
they can amnesty Ballard and maybe Booth but would still be pretty tight
I see the Sedin's as being elite for another 2 maybe 3 years and Kesler is breaking down fast (maybe he should go)
but if their intention is to try and win with the Sedins they need to be doing it now
and the difference between Schneider and Lu in not is just not that much different to warrant accepting such a descrepency in potential return
Exactly. And considering the Canuck GM and so many of their fans are on record as believing the Lu contract is "not too bad" (for another team), why any angst in trading Schneider now? I would be OK with giving up assests for Schneider, but not for Lu.
The Luongo contract was a good move for Vancouver at the time. They're cup contenders, they lock up a top 10 goalie in the league while their best players are still their best players.
But now that they've undermined him as their undisputed #1 and hedged their bets on Schneider, that Luongo contract is going to turn into a huge blunder. In the end, I think that it is Vancouver that will have to make compromises just to get rid of him. Why did they create this situation? Sure Schneider is looking like the better long-term bet, but the Canucks are contenders right now.
To me it would have made more sense to keep Schneider as a backup/1b goalie, and his value increases as he continues to show he's the real deal. Then trade Schneider for a considerable return in young players to fill the big holes that are developing in their lineup.
But now that they've undermined him as their undisputed #1 and hedged their bets on Schneider, that Luongo contract is going to turn into a huge blunder. In the end, I think that it is Vancouver that will have to make compromises just to get rid of him. Why did they create this situation? Sure Schneider is looking like the better long-term bet, but the Canucks are contenders right now.
To me it would have made more sense to keep Schneider as a backup/1b goalie, and his value increases as he continues to show he's the real deal. Then trade Schneider for a considerable return in young players to fill the big holes that are developing in their lineup.
Caustic
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Vancouver didn't really have the option of keeping Schneider as a backup for any longer. He wanted to become a #1 and his play showed he deserved this. His contract was up for renewal, and the fact the Canucks signed him to 4 million deal shows that he was signed to become the #1 goalie.
I actually think (as much as I think the guy is a wicked goalie) that trading Schneider might have been a viable option at one time. But now, you don't just sign a guy to three years and then trade him. As a result, the only options left are to play Luongo as a backup (which is both a waste of cap space as well as talent, besides being controversial), or trade him.
Many people seem to think the contract is a big issue, but I really don't think it is. The cap hit is reasonable and I actually think the long contract is a GOOD thing for a team, as long as Luongo continues to play at a high level.
However, those who say that Gillis is the one who will have to make concessions in a trade are entirely correct... but not because of the contract. It is because the only realistic option for Vancouver right now is to trade Luongo, and other GMs know it. Add to that the fact there are only a couple of teams that really need a goalie, and that drives down the return that much more. Under different circumstances, a star goalie would garner a star player in return. But unfortunately for Gillis, it isn't going to happen in this case... yet, he's holding out for the best return he can get.
Add to all this the fact that Vancouver really needs a 2nd line centre right now with Kesler out, and the pressure is even higher for Gillis.
I still say though, without giving up any young talent like Gardiner (which isn't going to happen), that Luongo would be an excellent aquisition for the Leafs. Assuming, of course, they expect to be competetive right now. If they plan to rebuild, then they are better off with the two questionable goalies they have right now.
I actually think (as much as I think the guy is a wicked goalie) that trading Schneider might have been a viable option at one time. But now, you don't just sign a guy to three years and then trade him. As a result, the only options left are to play Luongo as a backup (which is both a waste of cap space as well as talent, besides being controversial), or trade him.
Many people seem to think the contract is a big issue, but I really don't think it is. The cap hit is reasonable and I actually think the long contract is a GOOD thing for a team, as long as Luongo continues to play at a high level.
However, those who say that Gillis is the one who will have to make concessions in a trade are entirely correct... but not because of the contract. It is because the only realistic option for Vancouver right now is to trade Luongo, and other GMs know it. Add to that the fact there are only a couple of teams that really need a goalie, and that drives down the return that much more. Under different circumstances, a star goalie would garner a star player in return. But unfortunately for Gillis, it isn't going to happen in this case... yet, he's holding out for the best return he can get.
Add to all this the fact that Vancouver really needs a 2nd line centre right now with Kesler out, and the pressure is even higher for Gillis.
I still say though, without giving up any young talent like Gardiner (which isn't going to happen), that Luongo would be an excellent aquisition for the Leafs. Assuming, of course, they expect to be competetive right now. If they plan to rebuild, then they are better off with the two questionable goalies they have right now.
Dwight K Schrute
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It basically boils down to Gillis having to trade luongo to have an hope signing elder back. Gillis has to trade him and Nonis and every other GM knows that. Gillis won't get anything close to a good prospect in return. Gillis HAS to trade Luongo before next season and you are kidding yourself if you think other GM's are not aware of this. If you wan't luongo for Macarthur straight up-- maybe there is a deal.
It's tough to say that the contract isn't a big issue. Everyone knows that Luongo is a top goalie in the NHL, but there's no market for him. There's only one explanation for that. If Luongo was on a 5 year or less contract there'd be a bidding war for him, of that I have no doubt.
Furthermore, I suspect GMs are not all that excited about acquiring a player that is signed longer than the Player's productive years in the NHL, it raises uncertainty. It won't be this year or next or even the one after that but there will be a time when Luongo's contract will be an issue on a team's roster which will be a negative for any GM's legacy that acquires him.
As each day passes it becomes more and more unlikely that Luongo will be traded in the foreseeable future. The new CBA did not help matters for Gillis at all.
Stephen23
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Here is what I wrote on the Luongo thread in the trade board which kind of sums up my views on the whole Luongo situation for Vancouver:
stakesishigh
how swede it is
Canucks LB
My Favourite, Gone too soon, RIP Luc, We miss you
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93gilmour93
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Too bad the creator doesn't have a clue about the CBA. TO trades for him Luongo retires and the Leafs eat the cap hit not Vancouver.
You think its still funny?
You think its still funny?
colchar
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If they trade for him and he retires the new CBA states that they share the cap hit.
Keeping it Blue
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Yeah, it's funny. Also, you're incorrect, the Canucks will get some of his cap hit back. The Leafs will also get some, but it called a joke.
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Duffman955
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cant stop laughing. Amazing video"We are looking for above average goaltending, however we have no idea what it looks like."
So glad we are not talking that choke artist on that contract. Way to go Nonis!
They wanted Kardi, Rielly, a 1st, Gards, lol at least two of them!
Way to go Nonis!They wanted Kardi, Rielly, a 1st, Gards, lol at least two of them!
Leafidelity
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67Cup
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If the equation for a possible Luongo trade was Bozak + x + y = Luongo, as was widely rumoured, the trade just got very much more unlikely, IMO.
The Leafs just let go of two veterans whose primary positions over the years was centre, Lombardi and Connolly. Are the Leafs still actually in position to trade a centre, expecially one with some offensive skills? Bozak is out of position as a first line centre but who else do the Leafs have that would slot in between Kessel and Lupul? It is now very likely, IMO, that Kadri will open the season with the big club, but it is by no means certain that he will play centre. Even if he does, it seems unlikely to me that he would be slotted between Kessel and Lupul. As aside, how many centers last year actually had both their usual wingers score at a ppg rate? I don't know the answer to that question, but I bet the answer is "not many."
Letting go the two veterans seems to mean that Nonis is actually going to engage in a youth movement rather than simply giving the idea lip service. As a result, I don't think the Leafs can dispose of Bozak at this time. (At the trade deadline if the Leafs are out of the playoff hunt is a different matter.)
Now, of course, there may be a Luongo trade based on some other centerpiece. It just seems less likely to me than two days ago.
The Leafs just let go of two veterans whose primary positions over the years was centre, Lombardi and Connolly. Are the Leafs still actually in position to trade a centre, expecially one with some offensive skills? Bozak is out of position as a first line centre but who else do the Leafs have that would slot in between Kessel and Lupul? It is now very likely, IMO, that Kadri will open the season with the big club, but it is by no means certain that he will play centre. Even if he does, it seems unlikely to me that he would be slotted between Kessel and Lupul. As aside, how many centers last year actually had both their usual wingers score at a ppg rate? I don't know the answer to that question, but I bet the answer is "not many."
Letting go the two veterans seems to mean that Nonis is actually going to engage in a youth movement rather than simply giving the idea lip service. As a result, I don't think the Leafs can dispose of Bozak at this time. (At the trade deadline if the Leafs are out of the playoff hunt is a different matter.)
Now, of course, there may be a Luongo trade based on some other centerpiece. It just seems less likely to me than two days ago.
A we move forward and Nonis appears like he has the patience, and support of ownership for rebuilding, can anyone say Luongo is a good idea?
I think Vancouver is in deep doo doo with Luongo. That contract is just a big risk. I wouldn't be surprised if it scares every team away.
I think Vancouver is in deep doo doo with Luongo. That contract is just a big risk. I wouldn't be surprised if it scares every team away.
Contracts similar to Luongo's that are long term and were cap circumventing because the last 2 or 3 years were for "minimal" amounts will become kryptonite to the teams holding them very quickly. Luongo's was signed just 2 years ago and it has already gone south for Vancouver. Brad Richards is 32 now and his contract runs until he's 39. Any bets on whether he will still be an elite center at 35? Would you want to be holding his contract a few years from now. Even Suter and Parise at 27 and 28 years of age now with hopefully many good playing years to go will become some team's headaches during the last 3 or 4 years of their contracts....if not much sooner.
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