Locker Clean-out Day

[Mess]

My anger over the game 7 loss has subsided and now we just wait for next year with hopefully a mentally stronger team and better depth players.

Better luck next year.

Wasn't this the same thing everyone said last year, after Leafs surprising and embarrassing loss to Columbus?

You got your better depth players wish. Did we see any mentally stronger improvement from that season to Leafs 3-1 up and playoff collapse this year with better depth players?

I think the Leafs core and group are earning a league wide reputation as "Paper Tigers", where they have loads of talent and look great on paper, built in a spreadsheet and can tear up a regular season.. However then they're all bark and no bite come playoff time and crumble under the pressure, and lack the intestinal fortitude to be mentally strong and compete and succeed when it counts.

Can you actually get mentally stronger, when you're consistently folding like a cheap tent and exiting like a whimper and not a roar?

 

[Clark4Ever]

Did you expect him to say he wants his teammates and close friends traded?

No, but he could have just said that it's up to management and leave it at that.

Obviously, he must know something we don't.

 

[egd27]

How do you think a cup winning team, or specifically a solid contributor who took a hometown discount would be considered here if they win a cup?

A rarity ?

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

This is some solid new:

Take the A off Marner and Matthews and give it to this beaut.

 

[JohnnyBerts]

Wasn't this the same thing everyone said last year, after Leafs surprising and embarrassing loss to Columbus?

You got your better depth players wish. Did we see any mentally stronger improvement from that season to Leafs 3-1 up and playoff collapse this year with better depth players?

I think the Leafs core and group are earning a league wide reputation as "Paper Tigers", where they have loads of talent and look great on paper, built in a spreadsheet and can tear up a regular season.. However then they're all bark and no bite come playoff time and crumble under the pressure, and lack the intestinal fortitude to be mentally strong and compete and succeed when it counts.

Can you actually get mentally stronger, when you're consistently folding like a cheap tent and exiting like a whimper and not a roar?

Agreed. Paper Tigers until they prove otherwise.

Although I don't think the Leafs had better depth players this year, just different players which IMO they paid too much for and did not look good at all.

 

[myleafs]

I am not denying the Leafs is not hitting. What I am saying is that they could not score when it matters and the two guys that should be leading them just vanished.
They could be hitting like any teams left but if the top two guys combined for 1 goal in 7 games, the chances are the team won't go far.

Thing is those hits often lead to turnovers and goals, we saw that with Nylander. Habs hit often and it had many of the leafs looking over their shoulder. The lack of fight from this team is disturbing when comparing them to other playoff teams. If they come back with the same core and same philosophy of don't engage, I can say it will be the first time in decades I might be out. Watching other playoff games is a real eye opener. Any/every other game im watching I find myself thinking...now thats playoff hockey.

 

[Daisy Jane]

No of course not, but to laugh it off like that's not even a realistic possibility after failing 5 straight years is a touch egocentric no??

I'm not saying he has to be like ya trade Mitch. But even if he were to answer "When you play poor, changes come. I don't think anyone should be shocked by any and all moves that are made as a result. We have failed to fill our end of the bargain, and they have every right to make the changes that are necessary. My preference is no changes as I believe in this group blah blah blah..."

I know it's slightly arguing semantics but showing accountability is massive as a leader. Again, I have not seen the interviews yet so I'll reserve my full judgement when I actually see them. A lot can be misinterpreted in print, and I could have just latched onto the reporters account of Auston "laughing off" the possibility of a big move. I just want to see a little f***ing emotion from these guys that's all. Like are they just content doing this shit every year? hard to believe if they were actually devastated by this it would not show on their faces. Look at Jack Campbell for example. I have no doubt that guy is going to learn from this. He's going to prepare his f***ing dick off to be better. Mitch and Auston always just look so f***ing juvenile in these year end interviews. But again, I'll wait till I see it for my own eyes. At this point its just my assumptions based on previous years

no - i get what you mean. I've been saying this for years., people can Hockey Cliche all they want, but i think even when you do that, certain things come through. There are going to be some people who are gonna clap that answer and go "Good one Auston stick it to Toronto Media." but that answer just makes me roll my eyes.

that question isn't being asked for the sake of being asked. It's been five years, there's been zero progress to where it counts with this team, and as i've mentioned they show more emotion realizing they've scored 40 goals, than being completely humiliated again because they blew another clinching/elimination game again. I'm not saying they have to sit down and break down in front of everyone going "Why, God Why!" but these guys are acting like the lost a regular season game. And instead of giving a thoughtful, reflective answer," or even. "I honestly don't believe we need to change. I think we need to really develop things that will help us get through this block we have. I get why you think we'd have to move someone, but in my gut i believe this is the right group. and we're going to kill ourselves this summer getting better."

but it's "ha ha , have fun with that."

like i said. to me - they very much look like they don't care, so why should i waste my time caring either?

 

[Trapper]

Wasn't this the same thing everyone said last year, after Leafs surprising and embarrassing loss to Columbus?

You got your better depth players wish. Did we see any mentally stronger improvement from that season to Leafs 3-1 up and playoff collapse this year with better depth players?

I think the Leafs core and group are earning a league wide reputation as "Paper Tigers", where they have loads of talent and look great on paper, built in a spreadsheet and can tear up a regular season.. However then they're all bark and no bite come playoff time and crumble under the pressure, and lack the intestinal fortitude to be mentally strong and compete and succeed when it counts.

Can you actually get mentally stronger, when you're consistently folding like a cheap tent and exiting like a whimper and not a roar?

The only time this team gets angry, wants to push back, get in your face is when they have to answer questions about why they always lose.
Maybe think about that.

 

[BodaciousBeefBazooka]

Willy said they played scared.

They looked scared 100%. They looked mentally and emotionally weak just judging my there face expressions and look in their eyes even before the first period puck drop each game. No kidding.

 

[2 Slick]

This is some solid new:

It doesn't surprise me to hear Jason Spezza say something classy like that. He put his heart and soul on the line for the Leafs. Not just in the playoffs, but in the regular season. Played limited ice time had 30+ points in 56 games.

Had more goals than our first line combined in the playoffs.

If a player in the twilight of his career can outplay the entire top line, then you know changes need to be made.

I love Spezza, probably may get a slight raise though.

 

[Gabriel426]

Thing is those hits often lead to turnovers and goals, we saw that with Nylander. Habs hit often and it had many of the leafs looking over their shoulder. The lack of fight from this team is disturbing when comparing them to other playoff teams. If they come back with the same core and same philosophy of don't engage, I can say it will be the first time in decades I might be out. Watching other playoff games is a real eye opener. Any/every other game im watching I find myself thinking...now thats playoff hockey.

This is the thing I don't get.
I never reach the pro-athlete status but came pretty close when I was young playing Rugby.
All the players watch the game and try to learn what others are doing all the time, from set plays all the way down to individual stuff. And we can see why some players are just better and some teams are better....
I don't see why these Leafs(coaches and players) don't go, Avs PP is great, maybe we should try that in practices and in games and see if we can do that or he is doing well by just doing the little things, maybe I can try that or I know I can't skate like McDavid but maybe I can learn how to shield the puck like him....

Maybe I am old school, but I remembered pro-athletes often say stuff like I am learning from that player through watching how he played the games.....

 

[ToneDog]

Oh man if that's the case hoping leaf fans have fire dubas chants going strong next season.

Most likely though we end up with a 100-105 point year get Boston in the 1st round and lose in 7 again

Then the dubas fans will say the core is still young, dubas didn't have cap flexibility and he should get another year and a chance to see things through till the end

2019 - Leafs lose 4-3 to Boston after being up 3-2 -Babs was an idiot. Dubas needs his own coach
2020 - Leafs lose to CBJ 3-2 -Keefe needs a full training camp
2021 - Leafs lose to Habs 4-3 after leading 3-1 - Dubas gave Keefe the right players, it is on the coach.

How many more excuses are their for Dubas and Shanny before they run out of lives ?

 

[rumman]

Until his agent wants 8.5M per season....
Going to be tough to keep this guy with a flat cap.

Not worth his current deal let alone a raise.

 

[Leaffan1991]

Seems like a lot of people like running the same constant mistake over and over again and expect different results. It's very clear it's our core that is the problem and one of them in particular has been brutal in the playoffs for us, Mitch Marner.
I don't doubt he will figure it out with another team but I don't think he will on this team. There is too much pressure and he doesn't seem to handle pressure very well.
We need less magic hands and more do whatever it takes to win. Hits, blocks, skate harder than opposing player.

 

[rumman]

Simmonds added he is open to coming back.

Buh bye......

 

[McSnypsky]

Did you expect him to say he wants his teammates and close friends traded?

It's weird to me but I don't think they aren't that close really, Matts hangs with McJesus and Freddy more in the off season which is where I would link friendships to, more so than, I have to be around this guy for like 10 months! So yeah he's a great guy!

 

[rumman]

Holy shit, they asked Zach Hyman about the criticism Marner and Matthews were taking and he was basically like, "well, they didn't produce."

If I’m Hyman I’m outta here, he could really help a actual cup contender. Then who would do the dirty work to get the “golden childs” the puck?

 

[Mess]

The only time this team gets angry, wants to push back, get in your face is when they have to answer questions about why they always lose.
Maybe think about that.

I'm a firm believer that success breeds success.

In a study that uses website-based experiments to uncover whether “success breeds success” is a reality, researchers found that early success bestowed on individuals produced significant increases in subsequent rates of success. ...

When you learn how to fight through adversity, and overcome obstacles, it builds confidence and that success carries forward into a belief that you can rather then you can't be successful the next time this arises.

Our Leafs young core are now 0-5 in 5 consecutive playoff appearances, and its hard to find any supporting studies of " researchers found that early & often failure bestowed on individuals produced significant increases in subsequent rates of success.

This team needs to learn how to win by winning, and not learn how to win by failing and apologizing.

 

[Throw More Waffles]

Take the A off Marner and Matthews and give it to this beaut.

It's flat out humiliating that he got more goals than Matthews and more points than Marner.

Completely and utterly unacceptable from the top to bottom. Then to have Marner sit there all smugly looking annoyed that he has to answer questions. Matthews looking apathetic.

It's really really hard to not literally hate these people.

 

[Gabriel426]

no - i get what you mean. I've been saying this for years., people can Hockey Cliche all they want, but i think even when you do that, certain things come through. There are going to be some people who are gonna clap that answer and go "Good one Auston stick it to Toronto Media." but that answer just makes me roll my eyes.

that question isn't being asked for the sake of being asked. It's been five years, there's been zero progress to where it counts with this team, and as i've mentioned they show more emotion realizing they've scored 40 goals, than being completely humiliated again because they blew another clinching/elimination game again. I'm not saying they have to sit down and break down in front of everyone going "Why, God Why!" but these guys are acting like the lost a regular season game. And instead of giving a thoughtful, reflective answer," or even. "I honestly don't believe we need to change. I think we need to really develop things that will help us get through this block we have. I get why you think we'd have to move someone, but in my gut i believe this is the right group. and we're going to kill ourselves this summer getting better."

but it's "ha ha , have fun with that."

like i said. to me - they very much look like they don't care, so why should i waste my time caring either?

Completely agree and could not have put it better myself.

 

[Twine Tickler]

no - i get what you mean. I've been saying this for years., people can Hockey Cliche all they want, but i think even when you do that, certain things come through. There are going to be some people who are gonna clap that answer and go "Good one Auston stick it to Toronto Media." but that answer just makes me roll my eyes.

that question isn't being asked for the sake of being asked. It's been five years, there's been zero progress to where it counts with this team, and as i've mentioned they show more emotion realizing they've scored 40 goals, than being completely humiliated again because they blew another clinching/elimination game again. I'm not saying they have to sit down and break down in front of everyone going "Why, God Why!" but these guys are acting like the lost a regular season game. And instead of giving a thoughtful, reflective answer," or even. "I honestly don't believe we need to change. I think we need to really develop things that will help us get through this block we have. I get why you think we'd have to move someone, but in my gut i believe this is the right group. and we're going to kill ourselves this summer getting better."

but it's "ha ha , have fun with that."

like i said. to me - they very much look like they don't care, so why should i waste my time caring either?

Ya I just can't imagine how a guy like Spezz feels about it. Like there's a guy who brings it every night. Who is playing for nothing and is counting on Auston and Mitch to be Auston and Mitch in the playoffs. Every passing year is so valuable to him. And to see these guys just shrug off their shortcomings, and refute the idea that major changes may be necessary is truly infuriating as a fan. I can't imagine what it'd be like for a guy like him. Like why would he want to waste the precious remains of his amazing career on guys who fail to rise to the occasion. This team goes absolutely no where unless these guys show up when it counts. And they never do. I want so much for Spezz to lift that cup as a Leaf, but to be honest I hope he goes to an actual contender. He deserves way more than this shit

 

[Fogelhund]

24, highest paid winger in the league and has a boy body and no shot

I'm not sure that he can pack on much muscle. He was squatting 375lbs and didn't put on weight... you'd have to assume he was doing upper body stuff too.

 

[Leaf4Life]

Willy said they played scared.

He's quickly becoming my favourite player. At least he gets it and looked determined to win (instead of afraid to lose). Marner needs to learn from him.

I can't believe Marner says no changes this offseason. But I guess I shouldn't be surprised, this is the same guy who said they need "more patience with the puck and not shoot too early" after he completely flubbed that open net opportunity by holding on to the puck. He seems lost and clueless lol

 

[KMNRB]

I'm a firm believer that success breeds success.

In a study that uses website-based experiments to uncover whether “success breeds success” is a reality, researchers found that early success bestowed on individuals produced significant increases in subsequent rates of success. ...

When you learn how to fight through adversity, and overcome obstacles, it builds confidence and that success carries forward into a belief that you can rather then you can't be successful the next time this arises.

Our Leafs young core are now 0-5 in 5 consecutive playoff appearances, and its hard to find any supporting studies of " researchers found that early & often failure bestowed on individuals produced significant increases in subsequent rates of success.

This team needs to learn how to win by winning, and not learn how to win by failing and apologizing.

And add to that, the ultimate collective embarrassment of losing to a Zamboni driver, along with this year's epic choke after leading 3-1 as the favorite, not by previous generations of falling Leafs but by this very core.

 

[TheGreatOne11]

Wasn't this the same thing everyone said last year, after Leafs surprising and embarrassing loss to Columbus?

You got your better depth players wish. Did we see any mentally stronger improvement from that season to Leafs 3-1 up and playoff collapse this year with better depth players?

I think the Leafs core and group are earning a league wide reputation as "Paper Tigers", where they have loads of talent and look great on paper, built in a spreadsheet and can tear up a regular season.. However then they're all bark and no bite come playoff time and crumble under the pressure, and lack the intestinal fortitude to be mentally strong and compete and succeed when it counts.

Can you actually get mentally stronger, when you're consistently folding like a cheap tent and exiting like a whimper and not a roar?

Man. I know. But i just have to stop letting them disappoint and anger me. So i had my two days of furious writing on here and venting and this is just where I'm at.

Management believes in this team and the players believe in eachother so i just have to hope for a better result next year.

Losing Tavares changes the dynamic of the team, but even with that we should have won, nobody could close, but i can't just sit here and debate and whine about it all the time you know?

Honestly it's taxing being a fan of this team, you must be friends with disappointment and be used to a broken heart, being a leaf fan is like being in an emotionally abusive relationship.

And i am now just choosing to trust in management and enjoy my summer.

I 100% agree with the paper tiger label, that is definitely becoming who we are.

I have no quick answers on what we should do to change, any Marner trade i believe we will lose and not get proper value back, but again if him and Matthews face #1, Tavares and Nylander can score and vise versa we were robbed of having them not play the shut down line one of our 1A and 1B lines.

But again, not making excuses, we should have won that series and that is all there is to it, i hope we add some solid pieces, i believe Thornton was negative value the whole post season, injured Foligno was a waste of a roster spot, another year of development for Sandin, we shall see what the future holds.

They do want to win, i know they do, they didn't get the job done, all we can do as fans is hope for next year, we have no real control, and i refuse to let them have me dwelling in anger about certain decisions or attitudes.

So I'm off my dude, but i do agree with a lot of what you said, im just choosing to be happy and moving on is all. Have a good one.