Line Combos: Lines you expect to see vs what you want to see

[Henkka]

It has been now 2 games with same lines, without any suffling, and it looks pretty good as a whole:

Car - Larkin - Kane (takes most o-zone starts)
Berg - Kasp - Tank (takes 2nd most o-zone starts)
Copp - Comp - Ray (takes 3rd most o-zone starts)
Ras - Veleno - Fischer (has taken zero o-zone starts)

 

[SirloinUB]

Last night was the most confident Albert Johansson has looked in my viewings. He was really calm and did a great job creating time and space for teammates. Loved his performance.

 

[19 for president]

Cat Larkin Kane
Kasper Compher Raymond
Berggren Copp Tank

Said it in the GDT, I want Kasper and Copp to switch places. Let Marco focus on offense.

It's nice that Copp is putting up some points, but Marco is way more important to the future of this team. Copp can take Kane's shifts at the end of games to get his empty netters.

I also don't love what a Copp-Compher-Ray line does for Ray's offensive production. He may be our best player offensively and now you'd essentially stapled him to a checking line.

In that sense maybe you dump the guy struggling to score/ create changes with Compher and Copp and put Ray with Kasper and Berg. That way Kasper can still develop at Center while being on an offensively minded line. Ray is decent enough defensively that I think this line could work with Berg giving good effort defensively.

Berg-Kasper-Ray
Copp-Compher-Tank

 

[Henkka]

I also don't love what a Copp-Compher-Ray line does for Ray's offensive production. He may be our best player offensively and now you'd essentially stapled him to a checking line.

Are we building a best possible team-effort for Detroit Red Wings, or best possible career output for Lucas Raymond?

Which one is priority one?

 

[19 for president]

Are we building a best possible team-effort for Detroit Red Wings, or best possible career output for Lucas Raymond?

Which one is priority one?

I don't think you can look at one exclusively from the other. You pay Raymond 8 million to put up points. Significantly hampering the offensive output of your best or 2nd best (Larks) offensive player is probably not in a teams best interest long term. You only have so much cap space so you need the guys to score that you pay to score. I'm not advocating for a don't play defense cherry pick approach but you need to utilize players in a way that optimizes their output.

This isn't to say if a scoring guy is totally bombing out don't give him the ole Scotty treatment and stick him in a checking role to get him back attuned with other aspects of the game. Ray hasn't been bombing though. (Why I'm not opposed to swapping him with Tank, who has been struggling)

Right now its semi working because Copp is on a little bit of a tear offensively, but historically he is streaky at best. If that line stops scoring it is a problem because 1 scoring line NHL teams don't typically win. If the Berg-Kasper-Tank line takes off offensively, fine I get the team over the individual line, but until you have a semi consistent 2nd scoring line I think you see if you do what you can to develop some additional scoring chemistry.

 

[Henkka]

I don't think you can look at one exclusively from the other. You pay Raymond 8 million to put up points. Significantly hampering the offensive output of your best or 2nd best (Larks) offensive player is probably not in a teams best interest long term. You only have so much cap space so you need the guys to score that you pay to score. I'm not advocating for a don't play defense cherry pick approach but you need to utilize players in a way that optimizes their output.

This isn't to say if a scoring guy is totally bombing out don't give him the ole Scotty treatment and stick him in a checking role to get him back attuned with other aspects of the game. Ray hasn't been bombing though. (Why I'm not opposed to swapping him with Tank, who has been struggling)

Right now its semi working because Copp is on a little bit of a tear offensively, but historically he is streaky at best. If that line stops scoring it is a problem because 1 scoring line NHL teams don't typically win. If the Berg-Kasper-Tank line takes off offensively, fine I get the team over the individual line, but until you have a semi consistent 2nd scoring line I think you see if you do what you can to develop some additional scoring chemistry.

Patrik Kane is now working 10-times better than opposite ways, and Raymond is maybe missing a bit. But overall, it's A LOT better this way.

You don't have to any favors for any players, based on their paychecks.

You do what is best for the team.

 

[Gniwder]

I also don't love what a Copp-Compher-Ray line does for Ray's offensive production. He may be our best player offensively and now you'd essentially stapled him to a checking line.

In that sense maybe you dump the guy struggling to score/ create changes with Compher and Copp and put Ray with Kasper and Berg. That way Kasper can still develop at Center while being on an offensively minded line. Ray is decent enough defensively that I think this line could work with Berg giving good effort defensively.

Berg-Kasper-Ray
Copp-Compher-Tank

Probably an easier switch since nobody has to change positions, but I see Kasper getting more assists and no goals.

Patrik Kane is now working 10-times better than opposite ways, and Raymond is maybe missing a bit. But overall, it's A LOT better this way.

You don't have to any favors for any players, based on their paychecks.

You do what is best for the team.

The issue is that Larkin is the only center that can drive scoring. Same as last year, and the year before, etc, etc. It's a one line team until Stevie gets a 2C. With 3 top line wingers, one of them gets left out and has to play with Compher. I'd like to see someone other than Copp on the wing though.

 

[19 for president]

Patrik Kane is now working 10-times better than opposite ways, and Raymond is maybe missing a bit. But overall, it's A LOT better this way.

You don't have to any favors for any players, based on their paychecks.

You do what is best for the team.

Oh I don't disagree with removing Ray from the top line and trying Kane there. It definitely works better than the opposite. Kane cannot drive a line anymore.

With that said though, I think putting Ray with Berg and Kasper and Tank with Compher & Copp has the potential for better offense overall while not significantly hindering the defensive aspects of either line.

It might also encourage Ray's goal scoring a bit more. When he plays with DBC and Larkin he tends to defer more. He still puts up solid points, but I'd like to see him get back to driving and shooting a bit more like the end of last year. Berg is a more traditional play maker and Kasper can help with some dirty work and around the net goals.

Probably an easier switch since nobody has to change positions, but I see Kasper getting more assists and no goals.

I could actually see him in a Bert like role on a line with Ray and Berg. He's going to be a more goal mouth/ cleanup goal guy with those two, but I don't think that is a bad thing. He won't have to cheat as much back to cover defensively for Ray as he does for Tank.

 

[Gniwder]

I could actually see him in a Bert like role on a line with Ray and Berg. He's going to be a more goal mouth/ cleanup goal guy with those two, but I don't think that is a bad thing. He won't have to cheat as much back to cover defensively for Ray as he does for Tank.

If you want to see him in a role like Bert, he needs to be playing wing, not center. He's too defensively oriented to camp out at the crease as a center. That's the reason why Copp is getting goals, playing on the wing allows him to camp out at the crease so other players can deflect it off his skates. Playing on the wing will also utilize Kasper's forechecking ability which I expect will be as good as Bert's.

 

[odin1981]

I think Kasper is coming along, but I'd like to see something around Ras/Kasper/Kane or Copp(Compher)/Kasper/Kane at some point. Kane might be getting a little long in the tooth, but if he is paired with younger or prime aged players they can do the heavy lifting of the line. Might be able to pick him up a little but to get him going more like last year.

Taresenko I think should be on the third line since between him, Kane, and Raymond he is probably last of the three in fulfilling a scoring winger role. Raymond isn't a pure scoring winger obviously more so a 2 way winger.