Let’s even the playing field…after tax payroll cap

[Nihiliste]

The cap in no way is for “parity”. It’s for cost control for the owners.

This is the biggest thing that people miss. Adjusting the cap to try to obtain league parity is either going to take away from cost control for the owners or reduce % HRR that goes to the players. People focusing on parity issues completely misunderstand the purpose of the cap

 

[WTFMAN99]

To answer the original question: Yes

Or simply just have player's net salaries as their cap hit.

 

[edog37]

lol. Yeah tax is an issue if you don't have a competent accountant. Players and the NHL have mechanisms they can use to shield their tax burden and essentially pay the same amount of taxes no matter where they chose to play.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about when it comes to taxes. You're just spreading misinformation that has been repeated for years.

You think that junior hockey in Canada is the same as playing in the NHL in Canada. Come on bro lol. You're seriously gonna act like theres as much pressure playing in the US as in Canada come on now.

lol Gaudreau said explicitly that the covid restrictions were not a deciding factor what are you talking about.

Now you're on about healthcare lmao. On nearly every impactful healthcare standard metric Canada beats the US. Do you think nearly every country with a high standard of living has socialized healthcare for fun? The only country that is entirely privatized is the US.

You're spewing nonsense on topics you don't have the slightest of insight on.

And again you are 100% off base. Show me one sliver of actual evidence to state that professional hockey players can't handle the so-called pressure of playing in Canada & run to the US accordingly. Go ahead, show me an instance where a player has been so traumatized by playing in Canada, that he had to escape to the US Hate to break it to you sport, but the US is a hockey nation too. In fact, there were more registered hockey players in the US than there were in Canada. We just happen to have a much larger population & more professional sport leagues.

Membership Statistics

www.usahockey.com

Registered ice hockey players in Canada 2023 | Statista

In the 2022/23 season, there were a total of roughly 549 thousand registered ice hockey players in Canada according to the International Ice Hockey Federation.

www.statista.com

I never said anything about Gaudreau, I mentioned Jeff Petry. He said so himself.

Taxes are significantly higher in Canada than they are in the US. That's not hyperbole, that's fact.

Regarding healthcare, we don't have to wait months on end for procedures. And a lot of the medical innovations worldwide occur in the US. Socialism doesn't work.

What are these Covid policies again, none/zero/ where I live. If your referring to once your in country, I can’t think of much. So policies are basically the same.

I do know you can’t enter US without being vaccinated, I believe that is the same. Could depend on mode of travel for entering.

The more I read the less informed you seem to be unfortunately.

go ask Jeff Petry the family issues he was having getting his family in Canada.

 

[Golden_Jet]

And again you are 100% off base. Show me one sliver of actual evidence to state that professional hockey players can't handle the so-called pressure of playing in Canada & run to the US accordingly. Go ahead, show me an instance where a player has been so traumatized by playing in Canada, that he had to escape to the US Hate to break it to you sport, but the US is a hockey nation too. In fact, there were more registered hockey players in the US than there were in Canada. We just happen to have a much larger population & more professional sport leagues.

Membership Statistics

www.usahockey.com

Registered ice hockey players in Canada 2023 | Statista

In the 2022/23 season, there were a total of roughly 549 thousand registered ice hockey players in Canada according to the International Ice Hockey Federation.

www.statista.com

I never said anything about Gaudreau, I mentioned Jeff Petry. He said so himself.

Taxes are significantly higher in Canada than they are in the US. That's not hyperbole, that's fact.

Regarding healthcare, we don't have to wait months on end for procedures. And a lot of the medical innovations worldwide occur in the US. Socialism doesn't work.


go ask Jeff Petry the family issues he was having getting his family in Canada.

Depends if he was talking about last year or now.
If family is not vaccinated,then need to quarantine.
Same rules apply to Canadians going to US if not vaccinated.
If vaccinated free to go as you please either way.

 

[Mark Stones Spleen]

Should there be increased caps for cost of living adjustments too? Vancouver, NYC, etc should get to spend more money than Buffalo, right?

Maybe we should also have a cap of how much teams are able to spend on management and coaching, Toronto can afford much more on development than Minnesota, correct?

How many f***ing adjustments are we going to have?

 

[blankall]

Nah. Canada needs to fix its own problems. Ultra high cost of living plus high taxes is a bad combo, and its nobody's fault but their own.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Nah. Canada needs to fix its own problems. Ultra high cost of living plus high taxes is a bad combo, and its nobody's fault but their own.

Higher taxes cover health care as opposed to getting a bill for a visit.
Health plans costs thousands in the states.
Taxes are similar to NYC and California, difference being , you don’t pay for a visit US is only country in the world where you get a bill, or pay thousands for a plan.

 

[blankall]

Higher taxes cover health care as opposed to getting a bill for a visit.
Health plans costs thousands in the states.
Taxes are similar to NYC and California, difference being , you don’t pay for a visit US is only country in the world where you get a bill, or pay thousands for a plan.

Now explain Canada's housing shortage.

 

[Captain97]

It's actually a bit of both really.

Likely something to do with what countries do for their citizens like health care and education but can't say for sure.

I'm not gonna say America's Healthcare system is good but the Canadian one is garbage as well.

2019-2020 over 10,000 people died on waitlists for surgies/to see specialists. Adjust that for population of USA that would be over 100,000 people dying while waiting to see the appropriate doctor.

Personally I think we could all learn from Germany. Which has base level Healthcare funded by the government with additional insurance available to provided additional care if needed.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

No.

 

[cowboy82nd]

What are these Covid policies again, none/zero/ where I live. If your referring to once your in country, I can’t think of much. So policies are basically the same.

I do know you can’t enter US without being vaccinated, I believe that is the same. Could depend on mode of travel for entering.

The more I read the less informed you seem to be unfortunately.

That’s false. It was that you needed a negative covid test. And as of right now, that’s been lifted.

 

[jfhabs]

Should the cap also be adjusted based on a players ability to make money from other sources in each market too?

I'm sure a player in NY or Toronto can make far more from endorsement deals than they can in a place like Buffalo or Carolina.

Also implies more work outside of playing hockey tho...

 

[Golden_Jet]

That’s false. It was that you needed a negative covid test. And as of right now, that’s been lifted.

False, need to be vaccinated to enter US.

Technical Difficulties

 

[jbeck5]

People tend to not think that these people have accountants and tax lawyers that help them save as much as possible. I mean Canada has TSFA which I would expect most hockey players max out each year to avoid taxes on those investments.

Lol yeah the $5,000 they can contribute every year sure helps them. What are we at? 65k total? 70k? The TFSA is super handy for us regular folks so we can invest our 70k and hopefully turn it into 150k down the line and take it out without taxes... But that's peanuts for someone making a million or more a year.

It would be like us having a savings account where we can contribute $250 a year and take it out tax free.

 

[majormajor]

Salary cap should be based on expected after tax income, yes.

It would have to be an estimate and it will be off somewhat from player to player, but it will give you an equal playing field between teams.

 

[jbeck5]

To answer the original question: Yes

Or simply just have player's net salaries as their cap hit.

This.

People try to make it complicated. Should be public record and transparent with the NHL how much taxes a player paid. We all know our salaries before and after tax deductions. So does the NHL and it's players. So just use the players salaries after tax deductions as the cap number. Or "net salaries".


It honestly just comes down to using net salaries instead of gross salaries. It's not rocket science.

When I do anything for my budget, I look at my net salary, not my gross salary, so why are we acting like it would be difficult for business men to budget with net salaries???

 

[Golden_Jet]

This.

People try to make it complicated. Should be public record and transparent with the NHL how much taxes a player paid. We all know our salaries before and after tax deductions. So does the NHL and it's players. So just use the players salaries after tax deductions as the cap number. Or "net salaries".


It honestly just comes down to using net salaries instead of gross salaries. It's not rocket science.

When I do anything for my budget, I look at my net salary, not my gross salary, so why are we acting like it would be difficult for business men to budget with net salaries???

Difficult because they pay taxes in state/province where each game is played.

Many different ways players can invest RCAs , is one for Americans in Canada.

Matthew’s pays millions less in taxes than Marner for example with American residency due to huge signing bonuses.
Matthew’s pays like 20% on his signing bonus.

 

[HockeyVirus]

We could start limiting signing bonuses, to even the playing field more, as you suggest.
Other than Toronto no one pays 95% of salary in signing bonuses.

Panthers just did that with Tkachuk lol

 

[glovesave_35]

Can this topic just be stickied? The same responses to the same questions.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Panthers just did that with Tkachuk lol

Lmao, like usual state you something as fact, that is totally wrong according to capfriendly.

ZERO dollars in signing bonus.
Geez at least to do your homework, took me 10 seconds to check, it’s not hard.

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

 

[Dr Quincy]

Always brought up and not always as big of a deal as some want to make it. Especially if you look at overall cost of living, housing, medical costs for family members, etc. Would not be something easy to put together.

Tkachuk is a loser, he lives in a the lowest taxed province for gawd sake. And at the level of income he has, the US federal rate is 37% while being 33% in Canada. I think Alaska and Florida are the only states to have no income tax at all. So that means he will only play in Florida?

In 2022, American employees pay 7.65% of their wages into social security (6.2%) and Medicare (1.45%). Social security premiums are capped at an income level of $147,000. Medicare premiums have no cap. In Canada for 2022, employees pay 5.70% of gross employment income into CPP up to $61,400. Medicare-style benefits are included as part of the country's healthcare plan.

Deduction are harder to judge as it varies from state to state for those income taxes and in Canada, all except Quebec have the same deductions available if I recall. The biggest one in the US is the ability to deduct interest from a mortgage which is weird to me but how many players buy vs rent etc.

Do NHL players pay into Social Security? They are part of the NHL pension program, so I don't think they do get SSI taken out.

As a public school teacher who is part of a pension program, I know that I do not pay into SSI. No double dipping.

 

[HockeyVirus]

Lmao, like usual state you something as fact, that is totally wrong according to capfriendly.

ZERO dollars in signing bonus.
Geez at least to do your homework, took me 10 seconds to check, it’s not hard.

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

Thank You - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Thank you for the amazing 9 years

www.capfriendly.com

 

[Golden_Jet]

Do NHL players pay into Social Security? They are part of the NHL pension program, so I don't think they do get SSI taken out.

As a public school teacher who is part of a pension program, I know that I do not pay into SSI. No double dipping.

in Canada they pay CCP and probably EI, but it would be peanuts on their salary, maybe 1-2k a year, is max contribution total between the 2, as more games in US vs Canada. Max if all games were played in Canada maybe 3k a year.

No idea in US.

Capfriendly or Friedman is wrong, guess we’ll find out.

If Friedman is right ,
Tkachuk doesn’t get the tax rate of 20% on signing bonus that Matthew’s gets.

 

[Butch 19]

Can this topic just be stickied? The same responses to the same questions.

It can be ignored.

Try that.

 

[glovesave_35]

It can be ignored.

Try that.

Bravo.

The point is people obviously want to discuss it, but it gets brought up every time as if it is a novel idea.

I'd rather not ignore it, thanks. It is a flawed idea due to reasons expounded upon over the past five years or so.