Player Discussion Leon Draisaitl's next contract

[powerserge]

Not sure why you're being called a troll just because your opinion goes against the grain but as a conservative I can relate lol. As much as it sucks your not wrong and a team like the leafs are a perfect example and even they have a much younger team and some decent young guys to help keep costs down.
Maybe if Nurse wasn't around things would be different or if there were some good young kids busting down the door things would be easier to navigate but as it stands I truly think and not cuz I'm a nucks fan that trading him makes the most sense. The haul you could get from a team with an 8 year extension in place would be possibly franchise altering and you still have the best player in the world still.

I mean for example say the ducks are the team, Leo Carlson, or McTavish, their best D prospect, + I dunno Troy Terry? +?

From the kings, Byfield, Brandt, +

From the Sens, Brady/Stutzle? Chabot/Sanderson?

From the Canes, Necas, Niskinin, Jarvis, ?

Bottom line is I think it's plausible that pretty much every team would move mountains to get him especially young teams with lots of high-end young talent looking to take the next step or teams like the kings, canes, etc striving to get over the hump.

And since you guys have #97 you are one of only a couple of teams that could do a trade where you lose the best player and still be better after, you could not only plug some holes, be deeper and get younger while also either getting to depending on the trade move another contract to create more cap like Kane, Kulak?


I'm sure Canes fans would say that trade would never happen but think their GM would and while Necas is a big downgrade on Drai, Jarvis is a very good piece and Niskinin is arguably the best player not in the NHL and it's very likely he becomes a legit top pairing stud transforming your backend.

I hope nobody thinks I'm trolling, I'm just genuinely a fan of blockbuster trades and I can't remember the last time a player of Drai's caliber was moved and the massive chaos that would ensue would be crazy.

Hasn't been any name calling since so that's a good thing. Been some good discussions. Yep we could get a haul for Drai but everybody wants to sign all the players and keep the team together. Be interesting to see what we could get for him though. We could probably receive 3 good players and a solid prospect for him. Just believe to stay relevant you need good young cheap players and leave room for them to grow and earn a living too. Conservative to an extent, understand we are in win now mode but have to set us up properly for the future as well.

If McD will be here for another 9 years, want him to have a chance to compete for Lord Stanley every year. Would be a shame to go all in then have to rebuild/retool and miss the playoffs for a few years due to not being prudent. It would be a disservice to him. Which is why my opinion differs as I do not have the pay them what they want, worry about the rest later approach. See what happens

 

[Fourier]

"Depth" is very quickly becoming an antiquated concept in the sense of it being a necessity to "out depth" teams in order to win. Pretty much every series the Oilers have been a part of since 2022 has come with the caveat of "Oilers are in trouble, look at the other teams' depth!" only for the Oilers to beat most of these opponents, some with relative ease.

Very few series are decided by depth. Much more are due to one of, or all three of these things:

1) Which team's elites are better, and which team's elites win the inevitable matchup with the other team's elites head to head?

2) Who has the better special teams on both sides of the puck?

3) Who has the better goaltending?

Other than point 3, which varies, the Oilers will win the first two almost every time against almost any opponent over a 7 game series. Losing Broberg or Holloway doesn't factor into any of these three points whatsoever. Going a step further, losses over the past 3 seasons in the playoffs were due to losing 1, 2, and 3 against the Avalanche, 1, 2 and 3 against the Knights, and 3 solely against the Panthers (Bobrovsky unbeatable for the first 8 periods of the series). Knights and Avalanche were "deeper" than the Oilers each year, but that was a tertiary reason they won, not the main reason.

As we get deeper in the playoffs, the moderate differences in quality between a team's 3rd and 4th lines and bottom defence pair are pretty much complete irrelevant. The only time this really factors is if a team runs into injuries, otherwise it frankly doesn't matter.

This is exactly how I see it. I have said before depth helps but it does not win championships, Your best players do, and I include the goaltender in this. And I think you have articulated this very well.

 

[bringbacktheskate604]

Then cheer for a team without stars. If you are honestly bitching about having 2 of the top 5 players of the last decade that's on you. Players are taking less to play here to win, not everyone has the mindset of filling their bag at all costs. Some like having a mostly filled bag for the chance to drink out of a cup.

Just curious because I've heard this a lot by oilers fans and media but who has actually taken less from the core of this club or anyone for that matter?
There is zero proof that any of the 3 guys signed in July took any type of discount.

I mean one guy was bought out, the other guy is made of glass and Henrique while a fine player is not anything most teams dont already have.

You guys keep saying guys like Bouchard and Drai will take less but until they actually do it's just words and in Leons case, if he was so gung-ho to do that wouldn't we have seen a deal already?

The truth is players are part of a union and taking big discounts is tricky because it lessens the market for similar players around the league and is generally frowned upon. Really the only time you really see major team friendly deals is when absurd term is attached or it's a players in his twilight who's earned his bag.

A guy like Leon is about to become the highest paid player and is going to set a new standard, him taking some huge discount is bad for players coming after him, nevermind the fact that agents also lose in that scenario.

As for guys like Bouchard and Hyman, both have outperformed their current cap hit, in Hyamans case there's that as well as it's his last big contract. For Bouchard, the last deal was not an easy negotiation and he wasn't looking for a bridge deal, combine that with the fact that Nurse got 9.5 million during the flat cap, why in the world would Bouchard take a big discount?

My team already got hit with that scenario of a bad GM not managing the cap well by bridging EP and him getting while a good deal one that could have been far less if he was signed 3 years ago to 8 years like he wanted. Thank God we had Quinn and Demko locked up for five and six years before they really broke out or we would be where you guys are with Bouchard.

These guys at the end of the day have no obligation to be underpaid just like any of us, it's a business not anything personal.

Bouchard especially because of Nurse and his age and position has to be at least 10 million, I don't think he's worth that because of the fact he's stapled to the best player in the universe and that covers up a lot of his warts but he had what double the points of Nurse? While not being any worse defensively.

Holland has really fuked the cap structure much like Dubas did.

I will say tho whatever #97 ends up signing for it will be a good contract even if it's the maximum.

 

[Senor Catface]

Thank god a Canuck fan can let us know what he thinks.

 

[K1984]

Just curious because I've heard this a lot by oilers fans and media but who has actually taken less from the core of this club or anyone for that matter?
There is zero proof that any of the 3 guys signed in July took any type of discount.

I mean one guy was bought out, the other guy is made of glass and Henrique while a fine player is not anything most teams dont already have.

You guys keep saying guys like Bouchard and Drai will take less but until they actually do it's just words and in Leons case, if he was so gung-ho to do that wouldn't we have seen a deal already?

The truth is players are part of a union and taking big discounts is tricky because it lessens the market for similar players around the league and is generally frowned upon. Really the only time you really see major team friendly deals is when absurd term is attached or it's a players in his twilight who's earned his bag.

A guy like Leon is about to become the highest paid player and is going to set a new standard, him taking some huge discount is bad for players coming after him, nevermind the fact that agents also lose in that scenario.

As for guys like Bouchard and Hyman, both have outperformed their current cap hit, in Hyamans case there's that as well as it's his last big contract. For Bouchard, the last deal was not an easy negotiation and he wasn't looking for a bridge deal, combine that with the fact that Nurse got 9.5 million during the flat cap, why in the world would Bouchard take a big discount?

My team already got hit with that scenario of a bad GM not managing the cap well by bridging EP and him getting while a good deal one that could have been far less if he was signed 3 years ago to 8 years like he wanted. Thank God we had Quinn and Demko locked up for five and six years before they really broke out or we would be where you guys are with Bouchard.

These guys at the end of the day have no obligation to be underpaid just like any of us, it's a business not anything personal.

Bouchard especially because of Nurse and his age and position has to be at least 10 million, I don't think he's worth that because of the fact he's stapled to the best player in the universe and that covers up a lot of his warts but he had what double the points of Nurse? While not being any worse defensively.

Holland has really fuked the cap structure much like Dubas did.

I will say tho whatever #97 ends up signing for it will be a good contract even if it's the maximum.

Imagine being so obsessed with the Oilers that you take the time to head over to their board to write a novel about their cap situation.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Just curious because I've heard this a lot by oilers fans and media but who has actually taken less from the core of this club or anyone for that matter?
There is zero proof that any of the 3 guys signed in July took any type of discount.

I mean one guy was bought out, the other guy is made of glass and Henrique while a fine player is not anything most teams dont already have.

You guys keep saying guys like Bouchard and Drai will take less but until they actually do it's just words and in Leons case, if he was so gung-ho to do that wouldn't we have seen a deal already?

The truth is players are part of a union and taking big discounts is tricky because it lessens the market for similar players around the league and is generally frowned upon. Really the only time you really see major team friendly deals is when absurd term is attached or it's a players in his twilight who's earned his bag.

A guy like Leon is about to become the highest paid player and is going to set a new standard, him taking some huge discount is bad for players coming after him, nevermind the fact that agents also lose in that scenario.

As for guys like Bouchard and Hyman, both have outperformed their current cap hit, in Hyamans case there's that as well as it's his last big contract. For Bouchard, the last deal was not an easy negotiation and he wasn't looking for a bridge deal, combine that with the fact that Nurse got 9.5 million during the flat cap, why in the world would Bouchard take a big discount?

My team already got hit with that scenario of a bad GM not managing the cap well by bridging EP and him getting while a good deal one that could have been far less if he was signed 3 years ago to 8 years like he wanted. Thank God we had Quinn and Demko locked up for five and six years before they really broke out or we would be where you guys are with Bouchard.

These guys at the end of the day have no obligation to be underpaid just like any of us, it's a business not anything personal.

Bouchard especially because of Nurse and his age and position has to be at least 10 million, I don't think he's worth that because of the fact he's stapled to the best player in the universe and that covers up a lot of his warts but he had what double the points of Nurse? While not being any worse defensively.

Holland has really fuked the cap structure much like Dubas did.

I will say tho whatever #97 ends up signing for it will be a good contract even if it's the maximum.

McDavid took a discount when he signed his first non ELC contract. RNH took a discount. Henrique took less. Anything under $14 million would be Draisaitl taking less (look at what Tavares got all those years ago and he couldn't hold a candle). Brown could've gotten more after his playoffs, probably the same for Janmark.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Thank god a Canuck fan can let us know what he thinks.

People can post here if they are respectful and not trolling. Give him a chance and let's see his/her intentions.

 

[Senor Catface]

People can post here if they are respectful and not trolling. Give him a chance and let's see his/her intentions.

“There's an old saying in Tennessee—I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee—that says, 'Fool me once, shame on...shame on you. Fool me—you can't get fooled again“

- George W Bush

 

[Oilhawks]

The hand-wringing moved from “oh noes we lost a couple of unproven guys to offersheets” to “omg why hasn’t Leon signing been announced yet”

 

[Fourier]

Hasn't been any name calling since so that's a good thing. Been some good discussions. Yep we could get a haul for Drai but everybody wants to sign all the players and keep the team together. Be interesting to see what we could get for him though. We could probably receive 3 good players and a solid prospect for him. Just believe to stay relevant you need good young cheap players and leave room for them to grow and earn a living too. Conservative to an extent, understand we are in win now mode but have to set us up properly for the future as well.

If McD will be here for another 9 years, want him to have a chance to compete for Lord Stanley every year. Would be a shame to go all in then have to rebuild/retool and miss the playoffs for a few years due to not being prudent. It would be a disservice to him. Which is why my opinion differs as I do not have the pay them what they want, worry about the rest later approach. See what happens

The three good player scenario is almost impossible in a capped world. A trade this year would mean those three guys would have to fit into about $10M in cap space.

Draisaitl would be very hard to trade without losing the deal by a fair bit unless you go mostly for high end futures. And if you do that McDavid probably leaves. Moreover, getting top end futures won't be easy. Draisaitl is not going as a rental to a team that is not a contender or in fact a team that he is very unlikely to sign with. Such teams won't often have a lot of top quality futures that they would move.

The Eichel deal should give one a pretty decent picture of the return. Pretty underwhelming return to basically end the current cup window. As crazy as it sounds you may well be better off keeping him as a "rental" and then try to get something for his signing rights after the playoffs. From there you use his cap space to try and fill out the roster.

 

[Mr Positive]

The three good player scenario is almost impossible in a capped world. A trade this year would mean those three guys would have to fit into about $10M in cap space.

Draisaitl would be very hard to trade without losing the deal by a fair bit unless you go mostly for high end futures. And if you do that McDavid probably leaves. Moreover, getting top end futures won't be easy. Draisaitl is not going as a rental to a team that is not a contender or in fact a team that he is very unlikely to sign with. Such teams won't often have a lot of top quality futures that they would move.

The Eichel deal should give one a pretty decent picture of the return. Pretty underwhelming return to basically end the current cup window. As crazy as it sounds you may well be better off keeping him as a "rental" and then try to get something for his signing rights after the playoffs. From there you use his cap space to try and fill out the roster.

I would definitely keep Drai even without a deal.

I'd say that if Drai doesn't want to sign, I wouldn't take that as meaning that he wants to leave. It would most likely be because he'd want to see if McDavid would re-sign.

They aren’t signing him until he gets back to Edmonton for the season. It will get done, prob already is, just not announced

This could be the case but this wasn't a thing before. We've often see signings done outside of town with player reaction over the phone or on Skype or whatever.

I still overwhelmingly believe that Draisaitl is going to re sign but I bet there is some disagreement about what constitutes leaving money on the table. Or like I said earlier maybe he wants to see what McDavid does first

But any way we want to look at it, none of us here really know anything. I choose to be optimistic about it

 

[joestevens29]

It's probably better if he signs soon. I can just imagine everyday being asked the same stupid question, by the same stupid people.

 

[powerserge]

The three good player scenario is almost impossible in a capped world. A trade this year would mean those three guys would have to fit into about $10M in cap space.

Draisaitl would be very hard to trade without losing the deal by a fair bit unless you go mostly for high end futures. And if you do that McDavid probably leaves. Moreover, getting top end futures won't be easy. Draisaitl is not going as a rental to a team that is not a contender or in fact a team that he is very unlikely to sign with. Such teams won't often have a lot of top quality futures that they would move.

The Eichel deal should give one a pretty decent picture of the return. Pretty underwhelming return to basically end the current cup window. As crazy as it sounds you may well be better off keeping him as a "rental" and then try to get something for his signing rights after the playoffs. From there you use his cap space to try and fill out the roster.

3 young good players signed for cheap and more proven than Holloway and Broberg, 3 mil each and 1 mil for the prospect. There's your 10 million. The Eichel deal isn't even close, he needed surgery, him and the Sabres couldn't agree and Vegas had plenty of risk and had to wait for him to heal up. PLD last year, Jets got a good return, we would get a much higher return.

No need to talk about it, we all want to keep Drai but if 14+ mil have to look at options.

 

[Oildrum]

It's probably better if he signs soon. I can just imagine everyday being asked the same stupid question, by the same stupid people.

Probably why he is hiding out in Europe

 

[Fourier]

3 young good players signed for cheap and more proven than Holloway and Broberg, 3 mil each and 1 mil for the prospect. There's your 10 million. The Eichel deal isn't even close, he needed surgery, him and the Sabres couldn't agree and Vegas had plenty of risk and had to wait for him to heal up. PLD last year, Jets got a good return, we would get a much higher return.

No need to talk about it, we all want to keep Drai but if 14+ mil have to look at options.

Eichel needed surgery but Vegas knew he was going to sign with them.

It would be a useful exercise for fun to put some names to those 3 guys. They all have to come from one team. Who would those guys be from Boston, Carolina or LA for example or pick your contender and see if there really are three such players.

If I had to guess here is about the best I could see for each team:

Boston: Zacha, Carlo, Geekie
LA: Danault, Jeannott and Clarke (though probably Spence instead of Clarke)
Carolina: Necas, Carrier and Morrow

I'd be curious to see some other options that you can name.

 

[McShogun99]

The Draisaitl deal will be announced before training camp. The negotiation is something like the Oilers sliding Draisaitl a blank piece of paper and he just writes a number on it.

 

[Reasonable Oil Fan]

The Draisaitl deal will be announced before training camp. The negotiation is something like the Oilers sliding Draisaitl a blank piece of paper and he just writes a number on it.

8x17.6

 

[powerserge]

Eichel needed surgery but Vegas knew he was going to sign with them.

It would be a useful exercise for fun to put some names to those 3 guys. They all have to come from one team. Who would those guys be from Boston, Carolina or LA for example or pick your contender and see if there really are three such players.

If I had to guess here is about the best I could see for each team:

Boston: Zacha, Carlo, Geekie
LA: Danault, Jeannott and Clarke (though probably Spence instead of Clarke)
Carolina: Necas, Carrier and Morrow

I'd be curious to see some other options that you can name.

Well Pierre-Luc Dubois was traded for Gabriel Vilardi, Alex Iafallo, and Rasmus Kupari, and a second-round pick in the 2024 NHL Draft. Not bad, Drai would command more obviously. No Oilers fans want to hear about Drai being traded so prefer not to go there. 2 Mutts saying Drai 13.5, hope not.

 

[Reasonable Oil Fan]

Well Pierre-Luc Dubois was traded for Gabriel Vilardi, Alex Iafallo, and Rasmus Kupari, and a second-round pick in the 2024 NHL Draft. Not bad, Drai would command more obviously. No Oilers fans want to hear about Drai being traded so prefer not to go there. 2 Mutts saying Drai 13.5, hope not.

I just don’t get this, 13.5 is a realistic number that many would call a discount actually
With all that’s been speculated about the cap, it’s not beyond belief that he gets offered 15 or 16 in free agency

 

[powerserge]

I just don’t get this, 13.5 is a realistic number that many would call a discount actually
With all that’s been speculated about the cap, it’s not beyond belief that he gets offered 15 or 16 in free agency

Not going to get into it anymore after this. Please tell me the reasoning when people say Drai is taking a discount while now being the highest paid player in the league. Logic says this is not a discount, it's the going rate at 15% of the cap.

Highest paid player, yep he's taking a discount, lol. All good. Still hope it's 12.5 or less.

 

[Reasonable Oil Fan]

Not going to get into it anymore after this. Please tell me the reasoning when people say Drai is taking a discount while now being the highest paid player in the league. Logic says this is not a discount, it's the going rate at 15% of the cap.

Highest paid player, yep he's taking a discount, lol. All good. Still hope it's 12.5 or less.

The reasoning is right in my post
He potentially ends up leaving a few million on the table as opposed to going to free agency
13.5 x 8 = 108
Vs
16 x 7 = 112

 

[TB12]

Just curious because I've heard this a lot by oilers fans and media but who has actually taken less from the core of this club or anyone for that matter?
There is zero proof that any of the 3 guys signed in July took any type of discount.

I mean one guy was bought out, the other guy is made of glass and Henrique while a fine player is not anything most teams dont already have.

You guys keep saying guys like Bouchard and Drai will take less but until they actually do it's just words and in Leons case, if he was so gung-ho to do that wouldn't we have seen a deal already?

The truth is players are part of a union and taking big discounts is tricky because it lessens the market for similar players around the league and is generally frowned upon. Really the only time you really see major team friendly deals is when absurd term is attached or it's a players in his twilight who's earned his bag.

A guy like Leon is about to become the highest paid player and is going to set a new standard, him taking some huge discount is bad for players coming after him, nevermind the fact that agents also lose in that scenario.

As for guys like Bouchard and Hyman, both have outperformed their current cap hit, in Hyamans case there's that as well as it's his last big contract. For Bouchard, the last deal was not an easy negotiation and he wasn't looking for a bridge deal, combine that with the fact that Nurse got 9.5 million during the flat cap, why in the world would Bouchard take a big discount?

My team already got hit with that scenario of a bad GM not managing the cap well by bridging EP and him getting while a good deal one that could have been far less if he was signed 3 years ago to 8 years like he wanted. Thank God we had Quinn and Demko locked up for five and six years before they really broke out or we would be where you guys are with Bouchard.

These guys at the end of the day have no obligation to be underpaid just like any of us, it's a business not anything personal.

Bouchard especially because of Nurse and his age and position has to be at least 10 million, I don't think he's worth that because of the fact he's stapled to the best player in the universe and that covers up a lot of his warts but he had what double the points of Nurse? While not being any worse defensively.

Holland has really fuked the cap structure much like Dubas did.

I will say tho whatever #97 ends up signing for it will be a good contract even if it's the maximum.

lol

 

[Fourier]

Well Pierre-Luc Dubois was traded for Gabriel Vilardi, Alex Iafallo, and Rasmus Kupari, and a second-round pick in the 2024 NHL Draft. Not bad, Drai would command more obviously. No Oilers fans want to hear about Drai being traded so prefer not to go there. 2 Mutts saying Drai 13.5, hope not.

No problem.

 

[bucks_oil]

...

I mean for example say the ducks are the team, Leo Carlson, or McTavish, their best D prospect, + I dunno Troy Terry? +?

From the kings, Byfield, Brandt, +

From the Sens, Brady/Stutzle? Chabot/Sanderson?

From the Canes, Necas, Niskinin, Jarvis, ?

Bottom line is I think it's plausible that pretty much every team would move mountains to get him especially young teams with lots of high-end young talent looking to take the next step or teams like the kings, canes, etc striving to get over the hump.

Did you bother to run the numbers on what any one of those blockbuster young top line forward + young top pairing D deals look like?

The Sens & Canes Duos already come in at SEVENTEEN MILLION. Anaheim DUO will as well (they are only ELC for this year).... and Byfield + Brandt are already $11M and a huge downgrade.

It's fine to argue for a blockbuster PRIME for YOUTH deal, but in the modern NHL they just don't work at this level. Drai is good enough that he can command two $8M young players and that is arguably WORSE for the cap structure than keeping him at $13M.

I don't think you can find a duo of players in the NHL that would satisfy the following equation: 1) be better on ice NOW than Drai plus an average $4M vet defender, and 2) come in for less than $17M

So then you are left dealing Drai for guys still on their ELC where there is either still significant risk they live up to Drai's on ice contribution OR if they already are trending that way, you'll end up paying the combo way more than Drai

 

[bucks_oil]

Not going to get into it anymore after this. Please tell me the reasoning when people say Drai is taking a discount while now being the highest paid player in the league. Logic says this is not a discount, it's the going rate at 15% of the cap.

Highest paid player, yep he's taking a discount, lol. All good. Still hope it's 12.5 or less.

This is actually a fair point.

Malkin's 3rd contract is a good comparator. Playing alongside the best player in the world, re-upping to extend the window together. It yielded two more cups. He was actually younger when he signed for $9.5M x 8 which equaled 13.77% of the cap.

In today's dollars that means $12.11M. That's what a discount looks like.