Proposal: Led Zubpelin's When The Leddy Breaks: COL + DET + OTT

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

You realize that's your opinion, and not a fact, right?

Bottom line Detroit's not desperate for LD, Our D pipeline is one of the very best in the league. Yeah i would love to have Byram but we will do fine with or without him. Not dealing our Captain and hometown kid for him when Center depth is our biggest need.

 

[Perennial]

When a proposal only has a lineup for one team, you can see exactly how much thought they put into it for the other teams.

Ottawa and Detroit aren't finished products, they barely have 3 lines of NHL calibre players between them...

Do you really need to see where Gagner and Namestnikov fit into Detroit's lineup this season?

 

[BurgoShark]

I don't share Dorion's optimism that the rebuild is over, so with Zub and Brown set to hit UFA in 2 years, I'd gladly swap them out for a 20 year old prospect with Newhook's upside

It’s not just the value of these players. The OP is asking Ottawa to become a worse team while also paying $10m over the next two seasons for guys to play elsewhere.

They are also asking Ottawa to trade away two guys in areas they already lack depth. They probably need to add a RD and a RW - not lose one of each.

 

[The Moose is Loose]

Communication Breakdown

No one even got your nice joke

They just rambled on

 

[Perennial]

this guy needs to be banned from posting. every single one of his proposals is absolute trash

Would you keep returning to a restaurant you didn't like just so you could complain about the food?

Put me on ignore and move on with your life...

 

[drw02]

If wings are trading Larkin they'd want a young C like Newhook much more than Byram who would just add to an already congested D pool

 

[Perennial]

So my point still stands, Johnson wont waive for Detroit. And Larkin alone is worth just as much as Byram. Detroit's D pipeline both LD/RD is among the very best in the league. So it's still a no go we need Center depth period.

Bottom line Detroit's not desperate for LD, Our D pipeline is one of the very best in the league. Yeah i would love to have Byram but we will do fine with or without him. Not dealing our Captain and hometown kid for him when Center depth is our biggest need.

It’s not just the value of these players. The OP is asking Ottawa to become a worse team while also paying $10m over the next two seasons for guys to play elsewhere.

They are also asking Ottawa to trade away two guys in areas they already lack depth. They probably need to add a RD and a RW - not lose one of each.

I'm of the opinion a rebuilding team doesn't "need" anything except elite young talent and patience...

Detroit and Ottawa are very unlikely to make the playoffs in the next 2 seasons, so I don't see the value in holding onto players in their prime who are 2 years away from UFA... regardless of which position the play or the letter that's sewn to the front of their jersey

 

[Perennial]

It’s not just the value of these players. The OP is asking Ottawa to become a worse team while also paying $10m over the next two seasons for guys to play elsewhere.

They are also asking Ottawa to trade away two guys in areas they already lack depth. They probably need to add a RD and a RW - not lose one of each.

It's about taking a step back now in order to take 2 steps forward...

If Brown and Zub leave as UFA's in 2 years, doesn't Ottawa become a worse team then anyway?

And, yeah, they could be traded at next season's deadline as rentals if they haven't re-signed, but at that point they're unlikely to return a prospect with Newhook's potential

Using your rationale, Ottawa shouldn't trade Zub and Brown for Lafreniere if it were offered because they have a need at RW and RD...

 

[howboutahug]

Oh man this is a big no from Colorado

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

And take the Avs out of this deal too.

Take Detroit out of this proposal as well. In fact, take this proposal and its ridiculous name out and shoot it in the face.

I don't care if the value is even okay for Detroit (don't want to get into Larkin for Byram or whatever)... Detroit doesn't need to be trading pretty much the only C of any top line talent we have on the roster or in the system right now for even a really good defensive prospect.

If you're going to ignore the needs of teams in your proposals, you shouldn't be making them.

E: And no, "Rebuilding teams don't have needs" isn't an answer. If you trade Larkin, the Red Wings have Pius Suter at C. And that's it. Pius Suter was just non-tendered by Chicago. We're talking adding another several years to the rebuild here if you want to trade away the one guy who can actually center a top line from Detroit. Because even if we land Shane Wright or Bedard... they're a couple years away from being legit Cs. Rebuilding teams need legitimate NHL talent while they're rebuilding or you're the early 2010s Oilers or the Sabres from now and you've got no damn future, even if you're landing lottery picks.

 

[BurgoShark]

It's about taking a step back now in order to take 2 steps forward...

If Brown and Zub leave as UFA's in 2 years, doesn't Ottawa become a worse team then anyway?

And, yeah, they could be traded at next season's deadline as rentals if they haven't re-signed, but at that point they're unlikely to return a prospect with Newhook's potential

Using your rationale, Ottawa shouldn't trade Zub and Brown for Lafreniere if it were offered because they have a need at RW and RD...

Nope. What I meant was that is not beneficial for Ottawa’s development of young RWs and RDs to be thrust into roles they are not ready for. They would need to replace the players traded away, and having them gift $10m in cash to other teams makes that difficult.

if the proposal was Brown and Zub for Newhook and a pick, different conversation.

 

[FissionFire]

So Detroit gives up Larkin, who could easily get a 1st+ on his own, plus Leddy at 50%, who they just gave up a 2nd + Panik for, and all they get back in Bowen Byram? I mean he’s a good player, but not a 1st++ and 2nd+Panik good. Larkin for Byram 1-for-1 might work, but Detroit needs Centers badly even with Larkin on the team. This trade just seems awful for Detroit.

EDIT: And that’s before even factoring in taking on the EJ cap dump as well.

 

[Perennial]

Nope. What I meant was that is not beneficial for Ottawa’s development of young RWs and RDs to be thrust into roles they are not ready for. They would need to replace the players traded away, and having them gift $10m in cash to other teams makes that difficult.

if the proposal was Brown and Zub for Newhook and a pick, different conversation.

I'm not really sure what your concern is over RD...

The team can roll with Zaitsev, Brannstrom and J. Brown on the right side this season

And if you're worried about the development of a young RW, just bring up one of the many veteran wingers in the system to replace Brown in the lineup

Rebuilding teams should be concerned with what their roster will look like in 2 or 3 seasons, not the upcoming one

 

[Jumptheshark]

Too many moving parts

 

[OilersFanatics505]

Avs out: Byram, Newhook, Johnson, MacDermid
Avs in: Larkin (50% retained), Leddy (50% retained), C. Brown (50% retained), Zub

Red Wings out: Larkin, Leddy (50% retained)
Red Wings in: Byram, Johnson

Sens out: Larkin (50% retained) C. Brown (50% retained), Zub
Sens in: Newhook, MacDermid, (Larkin)


Colorado go all in by adding multiple upgrades throughout their lineup, while also clearing the remaining 2 years of Johnson's contract

Detroit get a stud LD prospect for their rebuild. Larkin can gain some playoff experience with Colorado and then re-sign with the Red Wings as a UFA in 2 years when their young core is ready to contend and Johnson's contract is coming off the books

Ottawa add an elite prospect to their talented young core. MacDermid is a thrown-in simply to make the cap space work


Colorado's lineup:
Landeskog - MacKinnon - Rantanen
Nichuskin - Larkin - Burakovsky
Compher - Kadri - Brown
Maltsev - Jost - O'Connor

Toews - Makar
Leddy - Girard
Murray - Zub

Why does Colorado move cost controlled ELC players for marginal upgrades right now at a higher cap rate?

 

[Perennial]

So Detroit gives up Larkin, who could easily get a 1st+ on his own, plus Leddy at 50%, who they just gave up a 2nd + Panik for, and all they get back in Bowen Byram? I mean he’s a good player, but not a 1st++ and 2nd+Panik good. Larkin for Byram 1-for-1 might work, but Detroit needs Centers badly even with Larkin on the team. This trade just seems awful for Detroit.

EDIT: And that’s before even factoring in taking on the EJ cap dump as well.

The Hockey Writers have Byram as the 8th best prospect in hockey...

https://thehockeywriters.com/nhl-top-100-prospects-ranking/

Larkin is 2 years away from UFA, and is coming off a season where he scored 23 points in 44 games playing over 20 minutes a game

I'm at a loss for why people think a rebuilding team as bad as Detroit would be better served keeping a 2C nearing UFA instead of adding a 20 year old prospect who has the potential to be a franchise Dman

 

[Perennial]

Why does Colorado move cost controlled ELC players for marginal upgrades right now at a higher cap rate?

 

[OilersFanatics505]

Marginal upgrade being the important phrase.

 

[Clamshells]

Ottawa and Detroit aren't finished products, they barely have 3 lines of NHL calibre players between them...

Do you really need to see where Gagner and Namestnikov fit into Detroit's lineup this season?

Can you imagine if Yzerman built is team around "who cares where anyone plays?" good lord dude. Look at the very unambiguous feedback you're getting, this is poorly thought out for Detroit and Ottawa.

You also seem to misunderstand that in order for teams to finish the rebuild, they need to, you know, start winning games at some point. This trade moves in the wrong direction for both of them.

 

[majormajor]

Sens and Wings get ripped off in the OP's deal. Just an Avs fantasy.

 

[lilidk]

Detroit isn't retaining for Larkin. The retention on Larkin comes via Ottawa.

Without Larkin , Detroit have 1.5 center, noway

 

[Perennial]

Marginal upgrade being the important phrase.

I think that's up for debate...

With that said, I am working on the assumption that Johnson will be damaged goods moving forward, so if I'm mistaken about that, then obviously the merits of the deal would be diminished from Colorado's perspective

 

[Perennial]

Can you imagine if Yzerman built is team around "who cares where anyone plays?" good lord dude. Look at the very unambiguous feedback you're getting, this is poorly thought out for Detroit and Ottawa.

You also seem to misunderstand that in order for teams to finish the rebuild, they need to, you know, start winning games at some point. This trade moves in the wrong direction for both of them.

Galileo faced unambiguous feedback as well... I can only assume he didn't care either

 

[deca guard]

sorry to hijack but in case theres a zep fan thats never heard this girl band 'zepparella' own zepplin check it :

 

[TBF1972]

Without Larkin , Detroit have 1.5 center, noway

I am not advocating for this trade.