Twowingcantfly
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2019
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Leafs need a stud D to win a cup. Who is traded for one?
- Thread starter darrylsittler27
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Notsince67
Papi and the Lamplighters
- Apr 27, 2018
- 16,376
- 11,467
What does a poll have to do with it?
Hughes plays a similar style to Makar. His speed is just a step below. Kid will be a beast.
Far better future than Seider IMO.
The Iceman
Registered User
- Sep 22, 2007
- 5,343
- 4,065
Fiala is nowhere near Willy. He is a 25G guy per season based on 80 GP. Career high season 25% lower than Willy.
Essentially the difference between a contributing goal scorer and an elite goal scorer.
And the 3 D you listed have potential but aren't near the player that Dahlin, Morrissey, Hughes, Sergachev, Josi are.
Twowingcantfly
Registered User
- Jul 4, 2019
- 341
- 127
Which of the two does our cap allow to sigh for term. I like em both, prefer MO slightly. His game is top notch
Maplebeasts
I See Demons!!!!!
slozo
Registered User
I am dismayed and slightly surprised at this . . . so many people in love with the disappearing act of Nylander and all his scoring. So they think that a seasoned (but still rookie) Knies; and new additions Bertuzzi and Domi, can't replace the scoring of Nylander and the guys we lost - Bunting, and some dregs. Hunh.
Part of scoring is the opportunity to play with high value players as well - if Nylander is traded before season, or sustains a season long injury, I actually don't see any reason why we wouldn't score just as many or more goals regular season, and just as many or MORE in the playoffs. It's just a higher amount of "depth" guys (if you can call Bertuzzi depth, which he isn't - he has a high end of equalling Nylander's numbers) who figure to be better for a playoff team look and profile.
I've been on record to trade Willy before the season to get a high return, get a high value D-man to play with Rielly or be a top 2nd pairing guy who is essentially our second best d-man. There are many targets . . . when I have time I'll post about the ones I think we could get in a trade for Willy Styles and who might be available.
And what Treliving wil say in public will only be stuff that he thinks is beneficial to his position. That means not showing your cards, folks. He's not an idiot.
Part of scoring is the opportunity to play with high value players as well - if Nylander is traded before season, or sustains a season long injury, I actually don't see any reason why we wouldn't score just as many or more goals regular season, and just as many or MORE in the playoffs. It's just a higher amount of "depth" guys (if you can call Bertuzzi depth, which he isn't - he has a high end of equalling Nylander's numbers) who figure to be better for a playoff team look and profile.
I've been on record to trade Willy before the season to get a high return, get a high value D-man to play with Rielly or be a top 2nd pairing guy who is essentially our second best d-man. There are many targets . . . when I have time I'll post about the ones I think we could get in a trade for Willy Styles and who might be available.
And what Treliving wil say in public will only be stuff that he thinks is beneficial to his position. That means not showing your cards, folks. He's not an idiot.
notDatsyuk
Registered User
- Jul 20, 2018
- 11,976
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Except that Nylander was the one of the top four forwards who played least like the Cowardly Lion.
ZEBROA
Registered User
- Dec 21, 2017
- 3,938
- 2,554
He is not as easy to trade as some seem to think... Almost impossible to win a trade, the opposite GM must be extremely stupid for that to succede. And that GM must be on the list of teams Nylander wants to be traded too.
You know he's gone for nothing as an own rental after another swift playoff exit by this group.
- Dec 12, 2017
- 26,005
- 12,452
Teams that need 40 goal scorers to make the playoffs don’t have top 2 Dmen they can spare.
Carolina is an interesting trading partner. They have 6 experienced Dmen, but Nylander is too good for what they’re willing to trade ( Pesce or Skjei), and I think the Canes are a little “snot “away from being Cup contenders.
Carolina is an interesting trading partner. They have 6 experienced Dmen, but Nylander is too good for what they’re willing to trade ( Pesce or Skjei), and I think the Canes are a little “snot “away from being Cup contenders.
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I disagree that they need a stud D.
I think the defense, needs a piece and a fairly big piece but I wouldn't say they need a stud.
I think if you add a guy like Chris Tanev to this defense that would be enough and I wouldn't call Chris Tanev a stud but he would be a significant addition.
I don't think the defense is as far off as some people do, I think between Rielly, Brodie, McCabe and Klingberg you have a good top 4, but if you add a Chris Tanev and you push Klingberg to the bottom pair and either Lilly or Giordano become your #7, Timmins is your #8.
Now you are set because you got 8 guys you know can play.
Rielly Brodie
Tanev McCabe
Klingberg Gio/Lilly
Gio/Lilly
Timmins
To me that's good enough and you don't need to move Nylander to get Tanev.
Now if you wanted Hanifin or Pesce I'd put Lilly in that deal without hesitation even if Pesce or Hanifin were just rentals although I'm not convinced they would be because the Leafs have nothing but money after this year.
But even if they were pure rentals I'd still put Lilly in the deal without hesitation because Hanifin and Pesce are difference makers they are top pair caliber.
Tanev is top 4.
But either addition to me would be enough.
In fact I would target Calgary before anybody else because if you could get Backlund in a deal you could fix the 3rd line center hole too.
You'd only need about 1 million in cap space if you got retention
I think the defense, needs a piece and a fairly big piece but I wouldn't say they need a stud.
I think if you add a guy like Chris Tanev to this defense that would be enough and I wouldn't call Chris Tanev a stud but he would be a significant addition.
I don't think the defense is as far off as some people do, I think between Rielly, Brodie, McCabe and Klingberg you have a good top 4, but if you add a Chris Tanev and you push Klingberg to the bottom pair and either Lilly or Giordano become your #7, Timmins is your #8.
Now you are set because you got 8 guys you know can play.
Rielly Brodie
Tanev McCabe
Klingberg Gio/Lilly
Gio/Lilly
Timmins
To me that's good enough and you don't need to move Nylander to get Tanev.
Now if you wanted Hanifin or Pesce I'd put Lilly in that deal without hesitation even if Pesce or Hanifin were just rentals although I'm not convinced they would be because the Leafs have nothing but money after this year.
But even if they were pure rentals I'd still put Lilly in the deal without hesitation because Hanifin and Pesce are difference makers they are top pair caliber.
Tanev is top 4.
But either addition to me would be enough.
In fact I would target Calgary before anybody else because if you could get Backlund in a deal you could fix the 3rd line center hole too.
You'd only need about 1 million in cap space if you got retention
TheGreenTBer
Paula Deen does bath salts
- Apr 30, 2021
- 10,289
- 12,662
I think you need a D that can elevate his play and shut down oppositions top player when the playoffs start.
I'm not advocating for Seth Jones but he was able to stifle our top players in the CLB series but naturally his play hasn't been up to par with Chicago but that's also a reflection of the team and the phase they were going through.
No one is trading an established top pairing D for Nylander as the D position is so much more valuable than a top line winger. You'll need to take a chance to an extent. If Chicago can retain on Seth and bring him down 25% that's a gamble worth exploring because you're then paying Seth $7.1 and he's signed long term.
I'm not advocating for Seth Jones but he was able to stifle our top players in the CLB series but naturally his play hasn't been up to par with Chicago but that's also a reflection of the team and the phase they were going through.
No one is trading an established top pairing D for Nylander as the D position is so much more valuable than a top line winger. You'll need to take a chance to an extent. If Chicago can retain on Seth and bring him down 25% that's a gamble worth exploring because you're then paying Seth $7.1 and he's signed long term.
- Dec 12, 2017
- 26,005
- 12,452
They need a big body with some speed and quickness. If Brodie wasn’t playing injured in the playoffs their D is too slow and a year older.
Mess
Global Moderator
William Nylander to Chicago for Seth Jones [50% retention] off his $9.5 mil AAV contract.
Leafs get themselves a 6-4/ 215 RHD .. Big mean and mobile.,
Leafs get themselves a 6-4/ 215 RHD .. Big mean and mobile.,
ULF_55
Moderator
They aren't in position to draft plyers and wait, Matthews is under contract until 2028 that's the window.
They are trying to win not give a player an opportunity
nuck
Registered User
- Aug 18, 2005
- 11,751
- 2,759
I kind of thought this thread would get moved
The OP said what kind of D man fits the bill and not who do they trade Willie for so lets not get tunnel vision on a one for one. Those deals require a lot of luck in the market place and it would be an unlikely coincidence to have that work out.
They need trade Willie to the highest bidder in terms of pure assets, not the highest bidder that has their key piece and will deal it. Otherwise you are not getting the most for him and are only able to grab a D from a club that has the need and cap room for Nylander. The available player is the key and you send you Nylander derived assets, or other as required, to do the deal.
Somebody said a younger more skilled version of Schenn. Yes for sure. Schenn played at a much higher level in the tiny playoff sample than in season so it makes sense they didn't spend to bring him back. The problem is the Klinger move spent the top 4 right side minutes and salary on a guy that doesn't fit with Mo. By default that puts Brodie back with Mo or 3rd pair LD. Klingberg has to be stapled to McCabe I think unless you drop Caber to 3rd pair LD and create an ultra soft Brodie/Klinger 2nd pair. That moves Lilly to 1st pair with Rielly and last years analytics say they did not do well together. In fact regular season Brodie was the best partner Mo had by a bit.
They won't deal Klinger, and a stud D won't move the needle on the 3rd pair so the logical outbound player is Brodie who is in the last year of his deal. Except he is still a good player and away from McCabe his analytics were fine this playoff and better last year. He may not be as done as some suggest.
I think Willie has to go for team and cap structure reasons but Klinger has painted them into a corner this year. Trade WN for the best available return and spend on the biggest need at the TDL. They have some young guys that need the minutes and as long as they get any kind goaltending they won't be reeling from the loss of one scorer.
The OP said what kind of D man fits the bill and not who do they trade Willie for so lets not get tunnel vision on a one for one. Those deals require a lot of luck in the market place and it would be an unlikely coincidence to have that work out.
They need trade Willie to the highest bidder in terms of pure assets, not the highest bidder that has their key piece and will deal it. Otherwise you are not getting the most for him and are only able to grab a D from a club that has the need and cap room for Nylander. The available player is the key and you send you Nylander derived assets, or other as required, to do the deal.
Somebody said a younger more skilled version of Schenn. Yes for sure. Schenn played at a much higher level in the tiny playoff sample than in season so it makes sense they didn't spend to bring him back. The problem is the Klinger move spent the top 4 right side minutes and salary on a guy that doesn't fit with Mo. By default that puts Brodie back with Mo or 3rd pair LD. Klingberg has to be stapled to McCabe I think unless you drop Caber to 3rd pair LD and create an ultra soft Brodie/Klinger 2nd pair. That moves Lilly to 1st pair with Rielly and last years analytics say they did not do well together. In fact regular season Brodie was the best partner Mo had by a bit.
They won't deal Klinger, and a stud D won't move the needle on the 3rd pair so the logical outbound player is Brodie who is in the last year of his deal. Except he is still a good player and away from McCabe his analytics were fine this playoff and better last year. He may not be as done as some suggest.
I think Willie has to go for team and cap structure reasons but Klinger has painted them into a corner this year. Trade WN for the best available return and spend on the biggest need at the TDL. They have some young guys that need the minutes and as long as they get any kind goaltending they won't be reeling from the loss of one scorer.
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TMLBlueandWhite
Go Leafs Go
- Feb 2, 2023
- 2,276
- 2,382
Drysdale still isn't signed.
Ducks have the cap space. Zellweger and Mintyukov make Drysdale redundant. Anaheim is in need of a winger like Nylander.
Whereas the Leafs have one too many of him already.
The core of any rebuild includes five major players: A star center, a number one defenseman, a stud goalie, a power forward, and a high scoring winger.
The Leafs core is anything but balanced. Building the team top heavy makes it poorly constructed. Unless continued mediocrity is the desired outcome.
Which is why trading Nylander for a young RHD on his breakout threshold makes sense.
Too bad I don't have any faith in this franchise being savvy enough to make a predatory trade. Swapping out expensive vets for young talent that will outperform their contracts. If anything I expect the exact opposite.
I mean, let's face it, this is the same team that gave 2x2nd + 3rd for the oldest player in the league.
Ducks have the cap space. Zellweger and Mintyukov make Drysdale redundant. Anaheim is in need of a winger like Nylander.
Whereas the Leafs have one too many of him already.
The core of any rebuild includes five major players: A star center, a number one defenseman, a stud goalie, a power forward, and a high scoring winger.
The Leafs core is anything but balanced. Building the team top heavy makes it poorly constructed. Unless continued mediocrity is the desired outcome.
Which is why trading Nylander for a young RHD on his breakout threshold makes sense.
Too bad I don't have any faith in this franchise being savvy enough to make a predatory trade. Swapping out expensive vets for young talent that will outperform their contracts. If anything I expect the exact opposite.
I mean, let's face it, this is the same team that gave 2x2nd + 3rd for the oldest player in the league.
ULF_55
Moderator
They already have drafted players, and yes they are going to give players an opportunity, example Knies and Robertson to begin and others like Benoit, Abruzzese, Hirvonen and Niemela.
Leafs lineup needs work, it isn't returning as some championship calibre team.
LeafChief
Matthew Knies Enthusiast
Ianturnedbull
Registered User
- Jun 11, 2022
- 6,430
- 5,937
Dubas trading picks for contractual mistakes...well...you know the story already.
Shanny and his Shanny Plan has let his GM go against his vision.
The many years of drafting and we only really have Knies (since Matthews, Nylander, and Marner). Possibly Woll. Amirov might have been the only other bright spot (RIP). Robertson? Who knows? He might have a slight chance to make the team this year.
I am rambling on, but there seems to be very few defensive prospects. I realize they are harder to assess and their maturity comes later.
The other issue is the cap. If only we had more prospects to fill holes instead of trading for 3rd/4th line players at the trade deadline.
LeafChief
Matthew Knies Enthusiast
Niemela and Villeneuve both has strong rookie seasons with the Marlies last year (Niemela joined after his Finnish league season ended).
Koster (although more of a longshot than the other two) was just named captain of U of Minnesota.
There are some defensive prospects to get excited about if you actually watch the Marlies and pay attention to the team's prospects but I also do understand that it is easier to simply bitch and moan online than it is to actually follow the teams prospects.
Seth Jones is complete trash relative to his contract, that's one of the worst contracts in the league if not the worst. If he wasn't drafted top 5 and related to a very prominent athlete(s) nobody would be talking about him.
The guy flat out sucks, he's a mediocre 3-4 D-man getting 9M.
