Post-Game Talk: Leafs Lose 4-3

[IPS]

They've given up the second fewest amount of goals within their division despite Andersen being the third-best goalie on the roster, are leading their division with the lowest xGA despite Andersen being the third-best goalie on the roster, and have given up the fewest shots against within their division, despite Andersen being the third-best goalie on the roster.

They've outshot their opponents in 6 of the last 7 games and scored at least 3 goals in 4 of those games. Blaming the defence is a lazy cop-out and you're sounding like an absolute apologist for an .897 SV% goalie who makes $5M.

Posted it before and I'll post it again, because there's so much truth to this:

I have this theory.

There’s this stereotype that casual, uneducated hockey fans complain about goalies for every goal against. I think subconsciously, people think if they “absolve” the goalie of blame and instead blame goals on defensive breakdowns it demonstrates to others how knowledgeable they are about hockey.

I notice it in online forums and circles way more than I do in real life.

 

[Gallagbi]

The top team in the league averages just over three goals a game and you expect the Leafs to score six. Will never happen especially come playoff time.

I was thinking of a single big gams, not consistently scoring 6.

We could have put up 6 last night IMO

 

[Bluelines]

Any decent goalie stops most of those.

Name one goalie that consistently stops slot tips.

 

[Gallagbi]

Nah 0 would be replacement level. I.e. the average league minimum callup.

Gotcha, that makes a hell of a lot more sense.

What's starter level, just not sure how that scales

 

[Stephen]

I do think this team and offense is capable of putting up a 6+ goal night to overcome the goaltending we've got and I'm a little surprised/disappointed it hasn't happened. Better finish and that was last night.

Still, can't point the finger for real "blame" anywhere but the net lately

I know what you're saying. It's frustrating to see the Edmonton Oilers roll through Canada and pad their personal stats against punching bags like Ottawa, Vancouver like a video game while Toronto's dropping games left right and center with not enough goal scoring to overcome leaky goaltending, so there is some low key disappointment our big guns don't seem to be able to generate that kind of offense on a season long basis and challenge for the Hart and Art Ross etc.

But I think the sustainable way to winning on cruise control a la championship run is to efficiently finish your opponents off by a score of 3-2, 4-1, that kind of range of GF and GA, not expect those 6-5 spectacular run and gun nights or some come from 0-3 to win 4-3 in OT.

 

[Stephen]

Aside from 2 games, our play hasn't really dropped off from that series. We just aren't getting big saves when there were breakdowns.

Seems like every miscue the past 2.5 weeks has ended up behind our goalie.

 

[zeke]

Name one goalie that consistently stops slot tips.

Every goalie we play against.

 

[Gallagbi]

Every goalie we play against.

I'd add and every goalie playing a game that doesn't include us.

Tips go in, but not at the rate were seeing against us

 

[Bluelines]

By watching and balancing with the numbers. And you're right, they're not the "same situations" some are much more difficult, some slightly less.

Take last night and the 18 shots allowed. You have Markstrom, not playing overly well and still making a number of tip saves with more net to cover and less reaction time. The Tavares tip toe save, the crease Simmonds tip from Thornton, the Matthews onetimer, all better chances than comparable goals Fred allowed. Each goalie let in a bad strong side shot.

AM has that shot again and he scores 8 out of 10 times, Markstrom was just lucky, he caught the puck with his back arm. Anyone that says that was a controlled, purposeful save, they are full of poo.

Andy made a number of difficult saves last night too. Fact is the Flames played better in front of Markstrom than the Leafs did in front of Freddy and both teams played poorly TBH. Just because it popular to hate on Freddy right now does not mean he is ALWAYS the problem, which is the standard Leafs go to move, pick out the sacrificial lamb and beat on it till its mush. it's pitiful how athletes are treated in Toronto. The Leafs clean up their defensive zone coverage and we win 3-1. easily.

 

[Bluelines]

Every goalie we play against.

Bull S#it

 

[Marshy]

TDL goalie acquisition please. I love Freddy for the taxi sqaud.

Stay Ready Freddy. We might need you if we get 2 injuries.

 

[zeke]

Gotcha, that makes a hell of a lot more sense.

What's starter level, just not sure how that scales

Not exactly sure but i think based on the season preview projections an average starter is good for about 1-2 over a starter's workload. Maybe closer to 1.

Fred was projected at 1.2 headed into the year. Price 1.0. Markstrom 2.1. Hellebuyck 3.2 I think was tops.

 

[zeke]

Bull S#it

We tip lots and lots of shots. Only some go in.

Amazing but true.

 

[Bluelines]

The goalie we played against last night stopped those types of shots + better ones

So did Andy but mob mentality dictates that you put away honest assessments and just sharpen your pitchforks. I hope he signs with another team in the off season and has a monster year next year.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

AM has that shot again and he scores 8 out of 10 times, Markstrom was just lucky, he caught the puck with his back arm. Anyone that says that was a controlled, purposeful save, they are full of poo.

Andy made a number of difficult saves last night too. Fact is the Flames played better in front of Markstrom than the Leafs did in front of Freddy and both teams played poorly TBH. Just because it popular to hate on Freddy right now does not mean he is ALWAYS the problem, which is the standard Leafs go to move, pick out the sacrificial lamb and beat on it till its mush. it's pitiful how athletes are treated in Toronto. The Leafs clean up their defensive zone coverage and we win 3-1. easily.

this could not be further from a fact

 

[Mess]

Which goalie stops the puck deflected off Dermott?
Which goalie stops the screen?
Which goalie stops the tipped goal?

You didn't answer my question.

Which is why stats don't tell you the entire story. Do the stats tell you how well the Leafs played defensively last night? I don't understand why fans can't easily see the formula the Canucks used in Vancouver is the same formula every team has used since then to beat the Leafs, screen, tip and take away the goalies eyes.

I thought the Flames played a below average game, and were not a serious threat most of the night. Their top players Johnny Hockey and Monahan were virtually invisible, except when getting plastered into the boards.

Except for a few long range seeing eye shots that beat Freddy, they had no reasonable expectation to win that game based on their compete level and overall play. IMO

It felt the Flames blocked double the shots last night than they actually took themselves.

 

[Bluelines]

We tip lots and lots of shots. Only some go in.

Amazing but true.

Same happens on Andy, only some go in, but some how that is not part of the equation?

 

[Bluelines]

this could not be further from a fact

Oh so you didn't watch the game... watch the Leaf break downs, after break downs, after break downs after break downs after break downs.

 

[zeke]

Same happens on Andy, only some go in, but some how that is not part of the equation?

Because more go in on Andy.

 

[IPS]

Oh so you didn't watch the game... watch the Leaf break downs, after break downs, after break downs after break downs after break downs.

f*** I know man. Worst 18 SOG game of all time.

 

[Confucius]

TDL goalie acquisition please. I love Freddy for the taxi sqaud.

Stay Ready Freddy. We might need you if we get 2 injuries.

Bet he would do alright as a backup. Not too many starts and more importantly he isn't the main guy we all would be depending on.

 

[Gallagbi]

AM has that shot again and he scores 8 out of 10 times, Markstrom was just lucky, he caught the puck with his back arm. Anyone that says that was a controlled, purposeful save, they are full of poo.

Andy made a number of difficult saves last night too. Fact is the Flames played better in front of Markstrom than the Leafs did in front of Freddy and both teams played poorly TBH. Just because it popular to hate on Freddy right now does not mean he is ALWAYS the problem, which is the standard Leafs go to move, pick out the sacrificial lamb and beat on it till its mush. it's pitiful how athletes are treated in Toronto. The Leafs clean up their defensive zone coverage and we win 3-1. easily.

Go ahead, let's name them. Which difficult saves did Andy make last night?

Here's the best ones I saw, a Monohan save in the first. Can't recall another truthfully and that Monohan chance is a telegraphed pass he has to settle and shoots into Fred's chest.

Want to do the same with Markstrom, who we both agree was off?
First period: Tavares tip, Matthews tip, Marner slot chance (imagine the breakdown to turn the puck over to Matthews and Marner directly between the hashmarks). Do we count the rebound here? Nah, let's stick with just 1 chance there.

So we're a period in with 2 tips (these are unstoppable right?) And a point blank shot chance better than anything CGY got. We haven't talked about the Simmonds tip or Matthews onetimer in the third or the defensive breakdowns we simply didn't convert on.

You know what we haven't even talked about either? The fact Fred's best clean 3 more times this game where they didn't convert. Literally any chance they got, and some thar weren't chances, ended up with Fred looking behind him. While we allowed 18 shots and dominated by every statistical measure

 

[egd27]

Name one goalie that consistently stops slot tips.

The ones where the attacking player tips it to where the goalie already is.

All deflections are created equally don't you know.

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

The ones where the attacking player tips it to where the goalie already is.

All deflections are created equally don't you know.

why are other goalies able to position themselves properly and take most of the net away, but not Andersen?

 

[Gallagbi]

We tip lots and lots of shots. Only some go in.

Amazing but true.

3-4 on the highlight pack from last night, doesn't include those that are so uneventful they don't make it (goals 1, 3 and 4 aren't on the highlights if they don't go in last night)