Proposal: Leafs /coyotes

[attackfan71]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

third team involved to reduce both kessel and chychrun cap hits kessel by 50% dropping his salary to 1.7mil. And reduce chychrun by 1.8mil

To that team 3rd in 2023 &2nd round pick in 2024 and a (B-) level prospect.
So in package A salary out 4.5mil and salary in is 4.5mil
In package B salary out is 5.25 mil salary in is 4.5mil.

not saying this is something dubas would do but I do think it would be a basis of a deal that could work. Just curious what people think. And don’t get into the mud slinging BS. Constructive ideas and opinions are great love to hear them

Click to read more...

 

[YotesFan47]

Kessel can't be reduced again and you'd need to add way more to either deal. Think Amirov + Knies + Hirvonen + 1st + Holl + Ritchie, plus whatever you have to pay to have a 3rd team retain on Chychrun.

 

[DarthProbert]

"...And don’t get into the mud slinging BS..."

Then don' t start out by posting such a stupid/trolling thread.

 

[attackfan71]

"...And don’t get into the mud slinging BS..."

Then don' t start out by posting such a stupid/trolling thread.

How is it a trolling thread I believe the leafs are giving up value to get value and to give them legit shot at going deep in playoffs

 

[Holymakinaw]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

So the Leafs get a good Winger and a TOP young D-man on a great deal, for.....

Proposal A.
- Garbage
- Garbage
- Mediocre prospect
- Mediocre late 1st rnd. pick

or

Proposal B.
- Garbage
- Garbage
- Mediocre bottom-pairing d-man
- Mediocre prospect
- Mediocre 2nd rnd. pick

LOL. Um.......yeah.

 

[Kaibur]

Coyotes should keep Chychrun and see where their 1st round pick lands.

Trade Kessel @50%, Boyd, and Stralman at the deadline for picks. Use some of those picks to try and move the two late 1sts up to the middle of round 1 and let the new scouting crew work their magic.

 

[howkie]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

third team involved to reduce both kessel and chychrun cap hits kessel by 50% dropping his salary to 1.7mil. And reduce chychrun by 1.8mil

To that team 3rd in 2023 &2nd round pick in 2024 and a (B-) level prospect.
So in package A salary out 4.5mil and salary in is 4.5mil
In package B salary out is 5.25 mil salary in is 4.5mil.

not saying this is something dubas would do but I do think it would be a basis of a deal that could work. Just curious what people think. And don’t get into the mud slinging BS. Constructive ideas and opinions are great love to hear them

Would you trade Nylander and I dunno Spezza for that?

 

[Mrfenn92]

Coyotes say no easily

 

[SR]

How is it a trolling thread I believe the leafs are giving up value to get value and to give them legit shot at going deep in playoffs

Because it’s crap for a #1 young, cost controlled d man. You’re giving up nothing of value for that return.

 

[andora]

I cant see anything starting without one of sandin or liljegren. Need the first rounder or maybe 2. Then probably amirov or robertson. Maybe that gets to the point of just some tweaking/details

Chychrun showa all signs of just being a durable number 1 dman that runs a defence - like pietrangelo does or slavin

The price should be high. Engvall and dermott? These are players every team has several of both in nhl and ahl

 

[Djp]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

third team involved to reduce both kessel and chychrun cap hits kessel by 50% dropping his salary to 1.7mil. And reduce chychrun by 1.8mil

To that team 3rd in 2023 &2nd round pick in 2024 and a (B-) level prospect.
So in package A salary out 4.5mil and salary in is 4.5mil
In package B salary out is 5.25 mil salary in is 4.5mil.

not saying this is something dubas would do but I do think it would be a basis of a deal that could work. Just curious what people think. And don’t get into the mud slinging BS. Constructive ideas and opinions are great love to hear them

Kessel cant be retained anymore. on 2 retentions allowed

that alone doesnt get Chychrun

 

[RebuildinVan]

Every other team beats that offer. why is Nick Ritchie the main piece in both offers?

 

[4thline]

I don't think it's a move that's on the Leafs radar, but IMO if they want Chychrun it's to replace Muzzin, and that then blocks out Sandin moving forward. So Muzzin and Sandin would make up the lion's share of the return. But Arizona would have no interest in Muzzin (or he in them) so it sets up another Duchene/Turris scenario.

Leafs send out Muzzin + Sandin + x
Team 3 sends out 1st + y
Yotes send out Chychrun

Leafs receive Chychrun
Team 3 receives Muzzin
Yotes receive 1st + Sandin + x + y

both x and y subject to a lot of haggling. What does it take to get the coyotes to bite? What are the Leafs and Team 3 willing to add?

 

[ole ole]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

third team involved to reduce both kessel and chychrun cap hits kessel by 50% dropping his salary to 1.7mil. And reduce chychrun by 1.8mil

To that team 3rd in 2023 &2nd round pick in 2024 and a (B-) level prospect.
So in package A salary out 4.5mil and salary in is 4.5mil
In package B salary out is 5.25 mil salary in is 4.5mil.

not saying this is something dubas would do but I do think it would be a basis of a deal that could work. Just curious what people think. And don’t get into the mud slinging BS. Constructive ideas and opinions are great love to hear them

Wait, Your not sure Dubas would do this?

 

[ole ole]

So the Leafs get a good Winger and a TOP young D-man on a great deal, for.....

Proposal A.
- Garbage
- Garbage
- Mediocre prospect
- Mediocre late 1st rnd. pick

or

Proposal B.
- Garbage
- Garbage
- Mediocre bottom-pairing d-man
- Mediocre prospect
- Mediocre 2nd rnd. pick

LOL. Um.......yeah.

Wow ,First time i can honestly say i agree with you.

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

Every other team beats that offer. why is Nick Ritchie the main piece in both offers?

I'll take rhetorical questions for $100 Alex

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

Because it’s crap for a #1 young, cost controlled d man. You’re giving up nothing of value for that return.

but but but... look at ALL those players!!

 

[GreatSaveEssensa]

Way to start off the new year with what may actually end up being the worst trade proposal on HFBoards in 2022

 

[Boondock]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

third team involved to reduce both kessel and chychrun cap hits kessel by 50% dropping his salary to 1.7mil. And reduce chychrun by 1.8mil

To that team 3rd in 2023 &2nd round pick in 2024 and a (B-) level prospect.
So in package A salary out 4.5mil and salary in is 4.5mil
In package B salary out is 5.25 mil salary in is 4.5mil.

not saying this is something dubas would do but I do think it would be a basis of a deal that could work. Just curious what people think. And don’t get into the mud slinging BS. Constructive ideas and opinions are great love to hear them

It seems like you are either under estimating the value of Chychrun or over estimating the value of some of the pieces being offered to the Yotes.
First off let’s look at individual value of the pieces going to Toronto. I would say Kessel at the deadline is worth a 2nd. With max retention add a 3rd, so Kessler @50% = a 2nd and 3rd.
Chychrun is a 23 year old top pairing dman signed for 3.5 more seasons at a very good cap hit. I would think that his value is probably the equivalent to 2 x 1st and a top 3 organizational prospect (yes this is somewhat ambiguous because different organizations have different valued prospects).
Now if the Leafs want to send cap dumps or salary back to the yotes, they can, but those players aren’t value pieces to reduce the overall cost, they are accounting pieces so the Leafs can add better players. So the adds of Ritchie or Engvall are not part of the value going to the Yotes. If you want value for those those pieces it would be better to trade them separately and use those assets in the deal with Arizona.
Now think about the yotes needs - middle of a rebuild, new organizational decisions makers. The team is looking for high end picks and prospects. This starts with C and RHD prospects because they are the most difficult to find, and if your using a 23 year old top pairing D as an asset to help the rebuild you need to make sure elite type pieces are coming back. Toronto’s late first 2 drafts from now is definitely not an elite piece. Arizona has shown they will bring in players and eat some cap space but they want to be paid for those players. Look at the Ghost/Ladd/Stralman and to some extent the Eriksson/Roussel/Beagle deals. In all those trade the Coyotes were given assets to take on the additional cap space. In your deal you are asking the Coyotes to eat cap space and not offering any assets in return.
Finally the overall value is not there to entice the Yotes to make this trade. The 1st is nice, but it will be late and is 2 drafts away. Players like Ritchie, Holl, Engvall - are NHLers but not much more, as stated earlier they are a favour, not value to Arizona. Dermott might be of some interest, but he’s a very small piece in a Chychrun deal. The prospects you mentioned are decent, but aren’t enough to entice a team to move Chychrun level players. They are both wingers, which don’t carry the highest value and neither Knies or Amirov are sure enough prospects to make up for the lack of value in other parts of the deal.


So all in all I think the quality lacks and there would be better options out there than this deal.

 

[Holymakinaw]

Wow ,First time i can honestly say i agree with you.

Don't worry, Buddy.....I won't tell anyone.

 

[Nowotny]

Coyotes should keep Chychrun and see where their 1st round pick lands.

Trade Kessel @50%, Boyd, and Stralman at the deadline for picks. Use some of those picks to try and move the two late 1sts up to the middle of round 1 and let the new scouting crew work their magic.

Coyotes already have 5 (mostly high) second round pick to do that.Picks obtained from Hurricanes and Avalanches can be #31 and #32 but also #17 and #18.Most likely in between.

 

[Iwishihadaspacebar]

Yotes offer Christian Fischer, a 3rd and Johan Larsson for Morgan Reilly 50% retained.

Same energy.

 

[Doublerum1975]

Lol dubas gets that offer and hangs up laughing

 

[Heldig]

To Toronto — Phil kessel 50% retained 3.4mil
Jakob chychrun 4.6 mil

to yotes — package A justin holl. 2mil
Nick Ritchie 2.5 mil
Ridion amirov
2023 1 st round

Or package B. Nick Ritchie 2.5
Pierre engvall 1.250
Travis dermott 1.500
Mathew knies
2023 2nd round pick

third team involved to reduce both kessel and chychrun cap hits kessel by 50% dropping his salary to 1.7mil. And reduce chychrun by 1.8mil

To that team 3rd in 2023 &2nd round pick in 2024 and a (B-) level prospect.
So in package A salary out 4.5mil and salary in is 4.5mil
In package B salary out is 5.25 mil salary in is 4.5mil.

not saying this is something dubas would do but I do think it would be a basis of a deal that could work. Just curious what people think. And don’t get into the mud slinging BS. Constructive ideas and opinions are great love to hear them

Not a single piece in that offer that wows me. A bunch of stuff.

Toronto is a poor fit IMO. No bonafide top prospects. Your 1st rounders will be late. You did not include your best young player (Sandin).

You really think this is the basis for a deal?

 

[Moose and Squirrel]

It seems like you are either under estimating the value of Chychrun or over estimating the value of some of the pieces being offered to the Yotes.
First off let’s look at individual value of the pieces going to Toronto. I would say Kessel at the deadline is worth a 2nd. With max retention add a 3rd, so Kessler @50% = a 2nd and 3rd.
Chychrun is a 23 year old top pairing dman signed for 3.5 more seasons at a very good cap hit. I would think that his value is probably the equivalent to 2 x 1st and a top 3 organizational prospect (yes this is somewhat ambiguous because different organizations have different valued prospects).
Now if the Leafs want to send cap dumps or salary back to the yotes, they can, but those players aren’t value pieces to reduce the overall cost, they are accounting pieces so the Leafs can add better players. So the adds of Ritchie or Engvall are not part of the value going to the Yotes. If you want value for those those pieces it would be better to trade them separately and use those assets in the deal with Arizona.
Now think about the yotes needs - middle of a rebuild, new organizational decisions makers. The team is looking for high end picks and prospects. This starts with C and RHD prospects because they are the most difficult to find, and if your using a 23 year old top pairing D as an asset to help the rebuild you need to make sure elite type pieces are coming back. Toronto’s late first 2 drafts from now is definitely not an elite piece. Arizona has shown they will bring in players and eat some cap space but they want to be paid for those players. Look at the Ghost/Ladd/Stralman and to some extent the Eriksson/Roussel/Beagle deals. In all those trade the Coyotes were given assets to take on the additional cap space. In your deal you are asking the Coyotes to eat cap space and not offering any assets in return.
Finally the overall value is not there to entice the Yotes to make this trade. The 1st is nice, but it will be late and is 2 drafts away. Players like Ritchie, Holl, Engvall - are NHLers but not much more, as stated earlier they are a favour, not value to Arizona. Dermott might be of some interest, but he’s a very small piece in a Chychrun deal. The prospects you mentioned are decent, but aren’t enough to entice a team to move Chychrun level players. They are both wingers, which don’t carry the highest value and neither Knies or Amirov are sure enough prospects to make up for the lack of value in other parts of the deal.


So all in all I think the quality lacks and there would be better options out there than this deal.

ha! I hadn't even noticed that the 1st isn't even in this years draft! lol

so keep the top prospects, defer the draft pick, and offer meh players...

wow.. this gets worse and worse

and good write up btw