Post-Game Talk: Leafs are not better without Rielly

[Gary Nylund]

to sign one player you want to retain a GM whos is incompetent?

thanks no thanks

dubas wins couple rounds he gets to stay or he can find job somewhere else.

1 - That's not what I said
2 - I don't agree that Dubas is incompetent

Be angry if you must, I can live with being 4th overall as of now. Hell, I can even feel pretty good about it.

Cheers!

 

[PromisedLand]

1 - That's not what I said
2 - I don't agree that Dubas is incompetent

Be angry if you must, I can live with being 4th overall as of now. Hell, I can even feel pretty good about it.

Cheers!

the post you quoted did you even follow the conversation?

 

[ULF_55]

I honestly didn’t think we looked all that bad. Second period we had the pick the entire time. Some MASSIVE defensive lapses and bad giveaways again though. Didn’t think the Marner JT line played well, seemed to get caved in all game. Bottom 6 looked pretty good again. Holmberg play continues to be encouraging. And an unfortunate stinker from Sammy.

Event Summary

www.nhl.com

Samsonov wasn't good enough, Lindren was better.
Tavares and marner line lost coverage on a couple goals.
Tavares got buried at the dot ... something is wrong there. Perhaps just one of those nights.
Goal 10 seconds into third ... we witnessed that a few times early in the season.

On to the next one.

 

[ULF_55]

Oh, have to give some props to Engvall and Kampf.

That 3rd. line has looked good recently.

 

[freshwind]

2 games is a blip, 3 becomes a concern that it is a slump

 

[therealkoho]

So many Grade "A" chances they just didn't capitalize on. At least 3 centre crests, a post, and who knows how many flew the net or went wide, and yes some big boy saves.


5-2 is ugly no doubt, but they weren't as ugly as the score suggests.

Malgin as 2LW isn't a solution, he just can't in a physical sense keep up there, he is no MSL or even Steve Sullivan. In fact I'm not even sure if he's an NHL player after watching the last few performances.

David Kampf is for real. Too bad his hands are what they are, 15 to 18 goals from him would be manna from heaven

Oh well it is what it was and is in the rear view mirror, onward and upward!

GLG

 

[Mess]

2 games is a blip, 3 becomes a concern that it is a slump

Tampa Bay is next on the schedule and that might be a round #1 preview again.

 

[ULF_55]

So many Grade "A" chances they just didn't capitalize on. At least 3 centre crests, a post, and who knows how many flew the net or went wide, and yes some big boy saves.


5-2 is ugly no doubt, but they weren't as ugly as the score suggests.

Malgin as 2LW isn't a solution, he just can't in a physical sense keep up there, he is no MSL or even Steve Sullivan. In fact I'm not even sure if he's an NHL player after watching the last few performances.

David Kampf is for real. Too bad his hands are what they are, 15 to 18 goals from him would be manna from heaven

Oh well it is what it was and is in the rear view mirror, onward and upward!

GLG

Announcers called a post/crossbar by Engvall, along with the Malgin post on his one individual effort, when he walked through their defense. Might have been another, and a couple bounces that on a good night would have gone in.

I agree, Leafs need a top 6 left winger who can shoot with some authority. In my opinion, he doesn't have to be a top 6 forward beyond shooting, has to be NHL level skating and defense.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Indeed they are.

Take the team we lost to tonight for example. George McPhee built the Caps into a perennial contender yet the Caps refused to renew his contract. Funny enough they actually did better in the playoffs than us up to each team's respective point in time.

Hell even the team that beat those Caps in the playoffs last year, sure they don't have a 1st round pick until the year 3000 and it looks like they're going to miss the playoffs this year while being capped out with long-term albatrosses that would cost fortunes to move, but they won more rounds than us last year so their management is objectively better than ours.

 

[NinjaKick]

I think we're all bipolar

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Another Bunting level player needs to be the expectation and is also a huge upgrade on the current options.

Knies may give more options to either slot there himself or fill in on the Kamp line allowing Engvall or Kerfoot to jump up.

Feels like Robertson has fumbled a few chances and i dont know what other young options exist.

Bunting was a non-factor in the playoffs last year. We need him, and anyone we want to be like him, to be a lot better. Kerfoot was arguably better since he at least brought defensive value.

The line doesn't need very much. Malgin is not the right stylistic fit because he is too much like Marner. Abruzzese and SDA would likely be the same.

But Jarnkrok was working before the injury, Steeves and Anderson play the kind of game that would work with Tavares/Marner, and even Robertson has 5.28GF/60, zero GA and a 65 xGF% with 25 OZS%. I do not think he has fumbled anything, even if he himself hasn't been on the scoresheet as much as you would like. Then of course Knies is the main option.

Fans want a big splash. The Leafs do not need a big splash. Even at LW. We have 2 guys injured from our LW depth chart right now and even then we are not doing too bad. Just need to swap Anderson and Malgin.

 

[Gary Nylund]

the post you quoted did you even follow the conversation?

Yup.

So many Grade "A" chances they just didn't capitalize on. At least 3 centre crests, a post, and who knows how many flew the net or went wide, and yes some big boy saves.

5-2 is ugly no doubt, but they weren't as ugly as the score suggests.

Malgin as 2LW isn't a solution, he just can't in a physical sense keep up there, he is no MSL or even Steve Sullivan. In fact I'm not even sure if he's an NHL player after watching the last few performances.

David Kampf is for real. Too bad his hands are what they are, 15 to 18 goals from him would be manna from heaven

Oh well it is what it was and is in the rear view mirror, onward and upward!

GLG

That's what I saw, glad I'm not the only one. From some of the comments here you'd think we lost 8-1.

 

[IPS]

Hell even the team that beat those Caps in the playoffs last year, sure they don't have a 1st round pick until the year 3000 and it looks like they're going to miss the playoffs this year while being capped out with long-term albatrosses that would cost fortunes to move, but they won more rounds than us last year so their management is objectively better than ours.

What are you even talking about?

The example I provided is a pretty clear comparison. The Caps let go of George McPhee because he ultimately couldn't build a team to get the Caps over that 2nd round hurdle. The situation mirrors ours almost exactly except it's the 1st round we can't get past. Asserting this as the reason we haven't extended Dubas seems pretty valid to me. And yeah it seems like the management change worked out pretty fking well for the Caps seeing as they finally did break through and win a cup.

 

[IPS]

McPhee was GM of Washington for 17 years despite never winning a Cup, and was only fired after the team missed the playoffs in 2013-2014. That doesn't really help your argument.

It's actually quite a sound argument. The Caps didn't let go of McPhee because they had an off year and missed, it's because the team he built constantly couldn't get over the 2nd round hump. Much like ours can't get over the 1st round hump.

If you wanna pretend like it's some prepostorous assertion that Dubas hasn't been extended yet because they're waiting to see if he can finally beat the 1st round hump, then keep living in your fantasy world, because that's likely the case right now.

 

[Martin Skoula]

What are you even talking about?

The example I provided is a pretty clear comparison. The Caps let go of George McPhee because he ultimately couldn't build a team to get the Caps over that 2nd round hurdle. The situation mirrors ours almost exactly except it's the 1st round we can't get past. Asserting this as the reason we haven't extended Dubas seems pretty valid to me. And yeah it seems like the management change worked out pretty fking well for the Caps seeing as they finally did break through and win a cup.

Well except the part where the new caps GM failed for 4 years (the same length Dubas has been GM) before they won a coin flip game 7 against the championship team that the division system forced them to face in round 2 almost every year.

But just to make sure I have it right, it was the management change that caused the win, not Trotz or Ovi "learning what it takes to win" or whatever? If McPhee stays and hires Trotz + Ovi's still heart grows 3 sizes do they get knocked out again?

 

[IPS]

Well except the part where the new caps GM failed for 4 years (the same length Dubas has been GM) before they won a coin flip game 7 against the championship team that the division system forced them to face in round 2 almost every year.

But just to make sure I have it right, it was the management change that caused the win, not Trotz or Ovi "learning what it takes to win" or whatever? If McPhee stays and hires Trotz + Ovi's still heart grows 3 sizes do they get knocked out again?

You can try and argue the semantics all you want. The Caps changed management and they won. They won the division 7 times under George McPhee. Why would they ever move on from a GM who built them into a perennial powerhouse?

And it was 3 years they "failed" (they won 3 playoff series). Then they took the cup in 2018.

It's actually funny how similar of a situation we're in here in Toronto.

 

[MAB1]

to sign one player you want to retain a GM whos is incompetent?

thanks no thanks

dubas wins couple rounds he gets to stay or he can find job somewhere else.

Burke and Nonis couldn't even make the playoffs consistently lmao

 

[PromisedLand]

Burke and Nonis couldn't even make the playoffs consistently lmao

Burke and Nonis weren't allowed a rebuild by teachers pension plan

Nobody in the history of NHL has effed so royally as dubas

This is a fact and cannot be denied.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Well except the part where the new caps GM failed for 4 years (the same length Dubas has been GM) before they won a coin flip game 7 against the championship team that the division system forced them to face in round 2 almost every year.

But just to make sure I have it right, it was the management change that caused the win, not Trotz or Ovi "learning what it takes to win" or whatever? If McPhee stays and hires Trotz + Ovi's still heart grows 3 sizes do they get knocked out again?

I've had this sort of thought a few times myself. If Dubas is replaced by whoever, do we not get outscored 15-2 in the next 3 game 7's we play?

I like most of what Dubas has done so I'd be fine with extending him now. JMHO.

 

[ULF_55]

Burke and Nonis weren't allowed a rebuild by teachers pension plan

Nobody in the history of NHL has effed so royally as dubas

This is a fact and cannot be denied.

Neither was JFj.

Burke said he could do it quicker.

Burke's lasting impact Rielly.

 

[Martin Skoula]

You can try and argue the semantics all you want. The Caps changed management and they won. They won the division 7 times under George McPhee. Why would they ever move on from a GM who built them into a perennial powerhouse?

And it was 3 years they "failed" (they won 3 playoff series). Then they took the cup in 2018.

It's actually funny how similar of a situation we're in here in Toronto.

I would imagine failing to make the playoffs is probably why he wasn't renewed. Seemed like he did pretty ok taking an expansion team to the finals against Washington in his next GM job though. It's almost like the quality of moves he makes is a better evaluation criteria than how many series his Caps won for predicting future performance.

 

[Dekes For Days]

The Caps didn't let go of McPhee because they had an off year and missed, it's because the team he built constantly couldn't get over the 2nd round hump.

You have no clue why he was fired, and your theory seems like quite a stretch considering they kept him after all of those playoff losses and only fired him after the only time Washington missed the playoffs in the last 15 years. He was also given 17 years as GM, and after the GM change, Washington went on to... lose in the 2nd round three times in a row.

 

[IPS]

You have no clue why he was fired, and your theory seems like quite a stretch considering they kept him after all of those playoff losses and only fired him after the only time Washington missed the playoffs in the last 15 years.

Yeah they didn't disregard is entire resume prior to missing playoffs. Believe whatever you want though. And he wasn't fired, his contract expired.

He was also given 17 years as GM, and after the GM change, Washington went on to... lose in the 2nd round three times in a row.

You're right, he was. Unlike Dubas he actually built his entire team from the ground up.

lose in the 2nd round three times in a row.

Then what???

 

[Torontonian]

Thought Toronto could have won with the amount of chances we had, but we looked like a team that was missing two top 4 d-man, we were really bad in our own end last night.

No reason to panic like people are doing, teams always go on a heater of run and then bad play creeps into the game and go into a losing skid.

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Malgin as 2LW isn't a solution, he just can't in a physical sense keep up there, he is no MSL or even Steve Sullivan. In fact I'm not even sure if he's an NHL player after watching the last few performances.

I don't know why that is immediately where people go all of the time. Probably because he is small. He was actually very good on the forecheck and was able to win puck battles. He also spent much of this year on our checking line, which is more physically demanding, and he was excellent.

The problem is that you have two guys on the line who thrive with the puck on their sticks and are both natural RW's. Marner is one of the top wingers in the league, but he needs the puck a lot for that to happen. Off the puck, he is still good but nowhere near as good.

Malgin is the same, but obviously at a lower level than Marner and now he is playing on his off-wing. So no matter what happens, you have one guy who is not playing in the role which allows them to thrive. When Malgin has had the puck, he has actually been able to do fairly well with it. He just doesn't get the puck a lot, and it would be better to get more of a grinder who is perfectly fine just parking himself in front of the net and cleaning up garbage for Tavares and Marner. Then let Malgin be the Marner on a bottom 6 line. So swapping Anderson and Malgin makes perfect sense.