Speculation: LA Kings Offseason Thread

[GoldenBearHockey]

Some have earned it. Fagemo scored in a game and got sent down immediately. Bjornfot and Spence helped carry a team into the playoffs last year. Spence led the AHL as a rookie I think. Eyssimont got a game next to Kovalchuk and looked pretty good and we never saw him again. Clarke is a star player his whole life and was picked top 10. Moverare has shown he was ready multiple times. Lias was a pg in the AHL and got called up to play on the 4th line. The list goes on really.
Now look at some others. Durzi actively lost games by turning the puck over. Multiple times this year. Never a demotion. Iafallo went months without scoring for months two years in a row. Never benched. Moore looked bad for a while after injury. Never a demotion.
The corpse of Dustin Brown was on the top line until playoffs last year.
There have been several reports now and even Maclellan himself has said players in the minors are upset and feel like there is no path for them to make the NHL no matter what they do.

Bjornfoot, Spence you can absolutely make an argument for, the rest.....really....Fagemo, Eyssimont, Moveare? Who are they taking jobs away from?

 

[SettlementRichie10]

Good to see the Blake public relations team are getting in their hours this early into the offseason.

 

[King'sPawn]

Some don't understand there's a difference between earning ice time and having the coach's trust.

Coaches are human and go with what's comfortable. This isn't demonizing McLellan. But just because a player has played well enough to earn more ice time doesn't mean they have the coach's trust to get that ice time.

Some need to stop pretending they know what they're talking about when they say a player hasn't "earned" his ice time.

 

[MrGuyPerson]

Jack has certainly benefited from the evolution of the Devils as well. He is a generational talent and didn't need time in the AHL.

I don't want to be that guy, but he was not drafted as generational talent. He may be one of the best players this generation, but I personally reserve that term for the prodigies. Jack Hughes was a concensus 1. Like Patrick Kane. Patrick Kane was one of the best in generation, but Generational? I guess it depends how you define it.

In my book, the Generational talents get pegged as "the next" at like age 10. McDavid was pegged back in his early Marlies days. The Marlies were at a tournament for 12 year olds in Chicago and most people there knew of or heard about this McDavid kid. Crosby was pegged well before he light ish up at Shattuck's. Crosby was literally already sponsored at nationals because everyone knew he was "the next". Ovie was pegged as a prodigy really young.

This upcoming 23 draft is unique because it may be one of, if not, the only draft with 2 prodigies the board at the same time. Bedard is prodigy and lived up to the label in juniors. Michkov is prodigy and also lived up to label in the MHL/VHL/KHL. Granted Michkov comes with a KHL contact and some geopolitical issues, but it is still unique to have 2 progidys in one draft class.

Point is Jack Hughes is a top tier player, but I think we define generational talent differently.

 

[Seattle King]

That Blake exit interview was fkn terrifiying.
He better have been lying about most of what he said.
Petersen in the NHL and Byfield in the AHL is enough for me to fire him right now.
His fckups are really starting to stack up now, its becoming increasingly clear he is in over his head and will sink the franchise if left to his own devices.
If he acts upon some of the insane ideas he voiced in that press conference we are all wasting our time caring what happens with this team, it's doomed.

 

[Matt13]

I don't want to be that guy, but he was not drafted as generational talent. He may be one of the best players this generation, but I personally reserve that term for the prodigies. Jack Hughes was a concensus 1. Like Patrick Kane. Patrick Kane was one of the best in generation, but Generational? I guess it depends how you define it.

In my book, the Generational talents get pegged as "the next" at like age 10. McDavid was pegged back in his early Marlies days. The Marlies were at a tournament for 12 year olds in Chicago and most people there knew of or heard about this McDavid kid. Crosby was pegged well before he light ish up at Shattuck's. Crosby was literally already sponsored at nationals because everyone knew he was "the next". Ovie was pegged as a prodigy really young.

This upcoming 23 draft is unique because it may be one of, if not, the only draft with 2 prodigies the board at the same time. Bedard is prodigy and lived up to the label in juniors. Michkov is prodigy and also lived up to label in the MHL/VHL/KHL. Granted Michkov comes with a KHL contact and some geopolitical issues, but it is still unique to have 2 progidys in one draft class.

Point is Jack Hughes is a top tier player, but I think we define generational talent differently.

My sincere apologies to all generational talents in the world for miscatorgerizing Jack Hughes talent.

I appreciate your input on the Kings board about him being really talented but not really really talented.

In the future if you don’t want to be that guy, don’t.

 

[SaltyElkHunter]

If we have Wilson we wouldnt need to add a goon that cant play anymore right? I know you love you some Cliff but he's riding buses in he A these days... id def take him over MacEwen this last deadline thats for sure.. but not going fwd

I said a while ago Wilson is the dude we need . Maybe wait til he is ufa.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

My sincere apologies to all generational talents in the world for miscatorgerizing Jack Hughes talent.

I appreciate your input on the Kings board about him being really talented but not really really talented.

In the future if you don’t want to be that guy, don’t.

Just take the L, man.

 

[KINGS17]

F Todd's extension. Just like the players he coaches he should have to prove he isn't absolute dog excrement at developing the young talent that is on his NHL roster. Todd, you are going to have to "earn more time behind the bench". The youngsters are the players that will determine the Kings future, not Kopitar and Doughty.

 

[Herby]

You're kind of erratic and all over the place saying things that I didn't say or even suggest.

But, lets start with the conversation, how many number 1 or 2 overalls were ever not considered NHL ready? I have always thought of that as kind of a home run spot if you will.

This is from the Hockey Writers. I believe they have a decent take on NHL players:

"One of the biggest misconceptions surrounding Byfield at the draft was how NHL-ready he was. People saw a 6-foot-5, 210-pound young man and assumed he could jump straight into the NHL. In reality, he was always more of a project than some of his peers like Tim Stutzle or Lucas Raymond."

I take that to mean he wasn't ready for the NHL and would take some development time. Again though his time in the AHL was more injury related and bad luck than where they assigned him to develop.

Stop cherry picking players like Knies having success. That has just much to do with the players desire than just the development plan of the team. No one has ever asks how did Pavel Datsyuk become such a good player while developing in Russia. He's just a good player!

I wasn’t only talking to you. The post is directed at anyone who thinks the Kings don’t do things way differently than everyone else. I am not all over the place, my views on these development decisions have been consistent from day one. Go back and read the Turcotte and QB threads, I was against those decisions then because they were unorthodox decisions and because there are so few examples of players being developed that way ending up successful. While the more traditional ways have usually produced solid results.

Based on historical evidence it's pretty clear that most if not all NHL teams would have handled Byfield and Turcotte differently. Knowing that, and knowing how poor the results have been since those decisions were made, do you think it's fair to be very critical of the management team?

There are numerous players in the NHL who never stepped foot on AHL ice at all, and have turned out to be excellent players. Look through each teams best players and you will see many who never played in that league. Including Anze Kopitar and Drew Doughty. So knowing that information, does it not bother you that the Blake take a different approach from others around the league with AHL usage? One of our development coaches said on a podcast this summer that "Only McDavid types don't need AHL time" . Had the Kings drafted any of these players who have thrived without AHL time, would they have been given that same opportunity in LA, or would they have been sent to the AHL?

Saying QB wasn’t going to be a year 1 difference maker is not the same thing as saying he’d be a long-term project. We were all under the impression he would be more Barkov, Thornton, Hughes than Matthews or Laine. But we are entering year 4 and can’t even confidently pencil our #2 overall pick into a prominent role. There is zero chance that was the expectation at the time the pick was made. Nobody thought that, none of the fans and not our GM.

Pavel Datsyuk was drafted 25 years ago, in a pre-lockout NHL with no salary cap and an UFA age at 31. It was a completely different era, and btw, Datsyuk never played in the AHL either. If the Kings had a player like this he today he probably wouldn't have come over because they wouldn't have guaranteed him an NHL spot without spending time in the minors. In the modern NHL with a salary cap and players reaching UFA at a much younger age, there is a need to get production from players on ELC's, especially ones taken with #2 and #5 overall picks.

 

[johnjm22]

That Blake exit interview was fkn terrifiying.
He better have been lying about most of what he said.

He is (sort of). That's why I don't pay much attention to it.

Fans always read too much into that stuff IMO.

 

[MrGuyPerson]

My sincere apologies to all generational talents in the world for miscatorgerizing Jack Hughes talent.

I appreciate your input on the Kings board about him being really talented but not really really talented.

In the future if you don’t want to be that guy, don’t.

Okay, my apologies. I did not intend to be rude or add negativity. I will put in some work to avoid being that guy in the future

 

[Matt13]

Okay, my apologies. I did not intend to be rude or add negativity. I will put in some work to avoid being that guy in the future

I was being overly sensitive. All good my man.

 

[Herby]

Okay, my apologies. I did not intend to be rude or add negativity. I will put in some work to avoid being that guy in the future

Nothing you said was wrong.

Hughes was by no means considered a generational player and he was lost in the NHL in year 1 and for a lot of year 2. Saying Hughes was generational is moving the goal-posts more than saying QB was a 4-5 year project.

 

[SettlementRichie10]

Nothing you said was wrong.

Hughes was by no means considered a generational player and he was lost in the NHL in year 1 and for a lot of year 2. Saying Hughes was generational is moving the goal-posts more than saying QB was a 4-5 year project.

Exactly.

People are only be snippy with @MrGuyPerson because they can’t face the reality that NJ successfully developed Hughes, and the Kings successfully screwed up Byfield.

 

[Maynard]

McDavid was pegged back in his early Marlies days.

I laughed.

 

[King'sPawn]

I laughed.

I don't get what's so funny. Do you have any idea how many people die from pegging accidents? It's undoubtedly in the ones.

 

[SaltyElkHunter]

Kings have a lot of hopes and wishes pinned to their future. The Rosen article echos a ton of what guys on here have been saying. Rob and Luc relying on the “Hey I’m the guy you grew up watching” schtick isn’t fooling as many people as they would hope. This is the most important off-season in the last 10 years for this team. This is where they either make the right moves with talent and the cap or they start regressing as a failed rebuild.

Kings are a billion dollar company and we are definitely seeing a little selective leaking going on. Someone doesn’t like Blake and they are leaking Shit to guys like Rosen to put the pressure on him. Turcotte and Byfield may be what take Blake down unless Clarke and the aforementioned figure out a way to do a 180.

 

[KINGS17]

Kings have a lot of hopes and wishes pinned to their future. The Rosen article echos a ton of what guys on here have been saying. Rob and Luc relying on the “Hey I’m the guy you grew up watching” schtick isn’t fooling as many people as they would hope. This is the most important off-season in the last 10 years for this team. This is where they either make the right moves with talent and the cap or they start regressing as a failed rebuild.

Kings are a billion dollar company and we are definitely seeing a little selective leaking going on. Someone doesn’t like Blake and they are leaking Shit to guys like Rosen to put the pressure on him. Turcotte and Byfield may be what take Blake down unless Clarke and the aforementioned figure out a way to do a 180.

Could be some people in the scouting department are feeling like they are about to get the axe, and they want to let it be known they are not responsible for at least some of this mess.

 

[ZJames]

We are basically the west coast version of the NY Rangers. Both were touted only a few years ago as having the best prospect pools in hockey, both really struggle at developing prospects, both missed on multiple top 5 picks, both are relying on trades and aging players for a playoff push and just hoping that "all you have to do is get in", and both fan bases hate their coaches and GMs. Only thing they really have over us is an all-world goalie.

And we just need to face it: unless the hockey gods smile upon us, we aren't likely to be making a lot of noise in the playoffs for the next few years. Let's just hope, pray, and sacrifice the jerseys of Edler, Peterson, and Durzi to the hockey gods so that maybe our next rebuild will be more successful.

 

[Mattias]

Could be some people in the scouting department are feeling like they are about to get the axe, and they want to let it be known they are not responsible for at least some of this mess.

I wonder this as well. There could be some pressure to reduce or change scouting staff this year given the lack of production from prospects.

Leak information to shift the focus from terrible drafting choices to:
1. Blake overrides us.
2. The management development/coaching is the reason for the mess.

 

[Mr Rogers]

There were plenty of reports saying how DL overuled his scouts during drafts, especially the Teubert pick. Same with the Chris Gibson pick and others in the 2nd round.

Second hand stuff about Turcotte is just that, so it could just be a bitter player/coaches he rubbed wrong. Not everyone gets along, especially one taken 5th overall on a team full of seniors who will never get a shot. I've seen this first hand, guys are dicks to the hot new kid. Zegras [never liked him either] on the other hand screams prima dona, me first type player, which he is. Don't care how much he scores or makes ESPN almost trick goals, there's no place on a team for guys like that. Even his own guys are sick of his shit between whistles, and his lack of effort to minimally defend. He'd never get away with that crap if Getzlaf was there nor here. At some point in his career, he will be traded, probably when the Ducks don't pay him 15 mil a year and make him captain.

In a perfect world, this draft pick becomes so good that it would allow the Ducks to part with Zegras at some point for a haul. I think whoever it is will be better than Zegras, and we'd run with McTavish and 2023 1st rounder up the middle. Zegs is not the type of guy you win a cup with at 1C.

 

[Herby]

Kings have a lot of hopes and wishes pinned to their future. The Rosen article echos a ton of what guys on here have been saying. Rob and Luc relying on the “Hey I’m the guy you grew up watching” schtick isn’t fooling as many people as they would hope. This is the most important off-season in the last 10 years for this team. This is where they either make the right moves with talent and the cap or they start regressing as a failed rebuild.

Kings are a billion dollar company and we are definitely seeing a little selective leaking going on. Someone doesn’t like Blake and they are leaking Shit to guys like Rosen to put the pressure on him. Turcotte and Byfield may be what take Blake down unless Clarke and the aforementioned figure out a way to do a 180.

I just really struggle to see what positives people see from Blake with his time as GM.

He did what everyone here has criticized other teams for doing, trading 1st round picks and elite prospects and committing long-term deals to veterans to try and get into the playoffs, with no real chance of seriously contending.

His 2 most important picks have both been massive flops thus far. And now we know at least one of these picks went against the advice of his scouts.

The team doesn't have a true #1 goaltender under contract for next season, despite having one under contract for $5m in the AHL.

They had to trade a 1st for a rental LHD because the one he used a 1st on is no longer trusted to even play a shift in the playoffs.

If they re-sign both those rentals they are even more against the cap.

He signed Iafallo and Moore, who are redundant players to overpriced contracts.

Danault was a nice value signing, but lets be honest, it only came about because Turcotte, Byfield and Vilardi, players he used high picks on, were all unable to be 2C's.

Blake pretty much is trying to build a team around players drafted 15 and 18 years ago by Dean Lombardi and Dave Taylor.

 

[Nasti]

Where is the proof that QB was going to be a 3-5 year project? Any quotes from managers, draft analysts, heck even fans?

Whether or not you want to use the word “project”, here are a couple articles from before the draft pretty much stating that Byfield would take some time. Kings development decisions aside, he was never going to make an immediate impact.

Sportsnet’s 2020 NHL Draft Prospect Rankings: Final edition

The 2020 NHL Draft is less than a week away, so Sam Cosentino shares his final top 31 player rankings, plus a few honourable mentions.

www.sportsnet.ca

What top prospects Quinton Byfield and Tim Stuetzle can offer the Kings

The Kings are expected to pick either Quinton Byfield or Tim Stuetzle with the No. 2 pick in the NHL draft this week. Here's a look at both prospects.

www.latimes.com

 

[Herby]

Whether or not you want to use the word “project”, here are a couple articles from before the draft pretty much stating that Byfield would take some time. Kings development decisions aside, he was never going to make an immediate impact.

Sportsnet’s 2020 NHL Draft Prospect Rankings: Final edition

The 2020 NHL Draft is less than a week away, so Sam Cosentino shares his final top 31 player rankings, plus a few honourable mentions.

www.sportsnet.ca

What top prospects Quinton Byfield and Tim Stuetzle can offer the Kings

The Kings are expected to pick either Quinton Byfield or Tim Stuetzle with the No. 2 pick in the NHL draft this week. Here's a look at both prospects.

www.latimes.com

None of these things or any quotes by management or posts by fans indicated that Byfield would make almost zero impact through 3 years and be a huge question mark going into year 4. (so a 4 year minimum plan).

Usually when you draft a player #2 overall you are expecting some kind of NHL impact right away, I think the consensus was that QB wasn't going to be one of those guys (and was going to be like Barkov and Hughes) and that is what people meant by stuff like "won't make an immediate impact" Still don't see anything anywhere that suggested anything close to the worst 3 year production from a Top 2 pick in this century.