Speculation: LA Kings News, Rumors, Roster Thread part VII

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HUH? The team that wasn't even supposed to make the playoffs last year are a year behind?
That’s a entirely plausible situation because how your develop players (or not) can set a team back or move it forward more quickly. I don’t think we know yet, but the way Byfield was used at times was questionable and the leg maybe makes some of that understandable. However his under-usage on the power play at the very least may have set his development back not to mention his general under use and sitting in the PO. If they have ended up setting his development back significantly and undermined his confidence all for the sake of a first round exit then that statement could be true. I’m not saying the extreme result is true but they certainly didn’t maximise his development opportunities.

EDIT: I’ve now seen the subsequent posts, so no need to reply 😊
 
It is completely different looking lost in your age 18 season making the jump directly from the NTDP as opposed to looking lost in your age 19 season after playing in the AHL at 18. They are not similar situations at all, and it just proves again just how little Byfield gained in his development from being in the AHL.

It was basically a lost season for him.

32 games...man you are really splitting hairs to shit on something or someone........

You are acting like Byfield WASNT a project at #2, you are acting like he played a FULL SEASON....at age 18.....
 
You think its typical for #2 overall picks to look that bad in the NHL. You think it's typical that entering year 3 you are asking this many questions about a #2 overall pick? It is not typical, and that is why it's being discussed here.

I don't think so on the dramatic thing. The age 18, 19, 20 seasons are the most important years when it comes to defining what type of player someone is going to be. And the Kings continue to make completely unorthodox development decisions with players in those age groups that they used very high picks on. And then we wonder why these kids underwhelm.

What did QB, Turcotte and Kupari gain from being in the AHL as teenagers?
Were these traditional development paths?
Have these paths helped get them to become quality NHL players quicker or slower than traditional paths?


Byfield was not a typical #2. The majority of draft guides and podcast had him a top 3 pick that needed time to develop.

Then Covid hit and the OHL shut down and the kid was forced into the AHL were he struggled at first then started to show great flashes the last half of a year. He was then placed into the NHL for a while 6 games as an 18 year old where he was obviously overmatched.

He returned the next year and was looking like he took a massive step forward in preseason and blows up an ankle missing a massive amount of time. Gets sent to the AHL upon return were he is rusty but looks better as he gets some games under him then bang, right back to the NHL and thrown into a team fighting for a playoff spot with less then star wingers.

We saw inconsistencies, poor decisions, and we saw some flashes that made everyone sit up and pay attention.

The dude was a longer term project from the get go

He missed an opportunity to tear up the OHL(Covid) and went straight to a mens league

He has a grand total of 43 AHL games under his belt and 46 NHL games a majority of which was after a gruesome ankle injury and Covid and paired with duds. He did not get the whole Stutzle top lines, massive PP minutes, make mistake treatment.

I think we can give the kid a bit more rope.
 
Byfield was not a typical #2. The majority of draft guides and podcast had him a top 3 pick that needed time to develop.

Then Covid hit and the OHL shut down and the kid was forced into the AHL were he struggled at first then started to show great flashes the last half of a year. He was then placed into the NHL for a while 6 games as an 18 year old where he was obviously overmatched.

He returned the next year and was looking like he took a massive step forward in preseason and blows up an ankle missing a massive amount of time. Gets sent to the AHL upon return were he is rusty but looks better as he gets some games under him then bang, right back to the NHL and thrown into a team fighting for a playoff spot with less then star wingers.

We saw inconsistencies, poor decisions, and we saw some flashes that made everyone sit up and pay attention.

The dude was a longer term project from the get go

He missed an opportunity to tear up the OHL(Covid) and went straight to a mens league

He has a grand total of 43 AHL games under his belt and 46 NHL games a majority of which was after a gruesome ankle injury and Covid and paired with duds. He did not get the whole Stutzle top lines, massive PP minutes, make mistake treatment.

I think we can give the kid a bit more rope.

Screw off with that context man.....no matter how much it makes sense....he won't buy it.....he will go and say, well no other team does it this way....and yadda yadda yadda....top #2 pick should impact from the start etc.....

It's just the same conversation for the summer......he's convinced development, and through that Byfield....his awful, and won't take context into account
 
Screw off with that context man.....no matter how much it makes sense....he won't buy it.....he will go and say, well no other team does it this way....and yadda yadda yadda....top #2 pick should impact from the start etc.....

It's just the same conversation for the summer......he's convinced development, and through that Byfield....his awful, and won't take context into account
show me the #2 pick that had their league shut down due to a pandemic

Byfield like a lot of picks from his draft, have a different development curve.
 
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I tend to agree that Byfield's stagnation up to this point is mostly on Blake, and some of it is due to injuries. However, I think there are several posters who are frustrated with Byfield's ice time and the situations in which he is deployed by McLellan when Byfield is in the lineup.

McLellan may have been given directions to make the playoffs, or else. If this is the case, Robitaille and Blake shoulder even more of the blame. I think its a fool's errand to "just make the playoffs" while having to ride Kopitar, Danault, Quick, etc. to do it.

Injuries have fast-forwarded the development of some of the defensemen. Perhaps a similar circumstance would be useful for the development of forwards? It may be the only thing that forces the issue with this management team.
The two goals aren’t mutually exclusive, or shouldn’t be. The mistake was trying to make the play-offs at the expense of Byfield it seems. One shouldn’t have seemingly been prioritised over the other and that’s the problem and sitting Byfield in the first round certainly seems to confirm that. I think there’s a bit of blame to go around there. Because by prioritising making the play-offs over Byfield that could be one of those decisions that gets us into the play-offs but further away from a cup.

I say that as someone that in most cases had backed Blake. HOWEVER, we are a long way from being able to assess the real impact of anything that has occurred so far. We are just speculating, arguing and in some cases making stuff up (that last one is a joke, not directed at anyone).

Screw off with that context man.....no matter how much it makes sense....he won't buy it.....he will go and say, well no other team does it this way....and yadda yadda yadda....top #2 pick should impact from the start etc.....

It's just the same conversation for the summer......he's convinced development, and through that Byfield....his awful, and won't take context into account
I agree with much of what you say and the broken leg needs considering also but it’s hard to defend sitting him in the play-offs (& his lack of pp time in general).
 
The two goals aren’t mutually exclusive, or shouldn’t be. The mistake was trying to make the play-offs at the expense of Byfield it seems. One shouldn’t have seemingly been prioritised over the other and that’s the problem and sitting Byfield in the first round certainly seems to confirm that. I think there’s a bit of blame to go around there. Because by prioritising making the play-offs over Byfield that could be one of those decisions that gets us into the play-offs but further away from a cup.

I say that as someone that in most cases had backed Blake. HOWEVER, we are a long way from being able to assess the real impact of anything that has occurred so far. We are just speculating, arguing and in some cases making stuff up (that last one is a joke, not directed at anyone).


I agree with much of what you say and the broken leg needs considering also but it’s hard to defend sitting him in the play-offs (& his lack of pp time in general).

Lack of PP time, yea, I can get behind that, sitting in the playoffs....was probably the best decision for him.

show me the #2 pick that had their league shut down due to a pandemic

Byfield like a lot of picks from his draft, have a different development curve.

Umm......yes.......I take it you missed out on the sarcasm lol that's ok
 
You can hand young players ice time & PP that they haven't earned & bottom the team out. You can also show those young players what it takes to make the playoffs & they can see first hand that they need to be better. It's going to be difficult to convince me making players earn their ice time isn't the right way to go after the year Kaliyev had.
 
You can hand young players ice time & PP that they haven't earned & bottom the team out. You can also show those young players what it takes to make the playoffs & they can see first hand that they need to be better. It's going to be difficult to convince me making players earn their ice time isn't the right way to go after the year Kaliyev had.
Except apparently Kaliyev wasn't good enough to "earn" playing on the top-six after working to pay his dues.

Or Grundstrom being benched after scoring in 3 straight games.

Or Byfield getting benched in both the AHL and NHL playoffs just to watch both teams get bounced.

With all the different ways people learn and grow, why is ONE approach the only correct approach to be applied to all players (in this case, forwards)? Why is there no flexibility in this? Especially since nobody made Mikey Anderson spend all of any season in the bottom pairing before getting paired with Doughty.
 
Especially since nobody made Mikey Anderson spend all of any season in the bottom pairing before getting paired with Doughty.
Well he lucked out cause there was no other option. They brought in Maatta to play with Doughty but he didnt work out on the top pair. There was no one else. Mikey got burned a bunch but they let him play through it and hes settling in really well.
 
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Byfield was not a typical #2. The majority of draft guides and podcast had him a top 3 pick that needed time to develop.

Then Covid hit and the OHL shut down and the kid was forced into the AHL were he struggled at first then started to show great flashes the last half of a year. He was then placed into the NHL for a while 6 games as an 18 year old where he was obviously overmatched.

He returned the next year and was looking like he took a massive step forward in preseason and blows up an ankle missing a massive amount of time. Gets sent to the AHL upon return were he is rusty but looks better as he gets some games under him then bang, right back to the NHL and thrown into a team fighting for a playoff spot with less then star wingers.

We saw inconsistencies, poor decisions, and we saw some flashes that made everyone sit up and pay attention.

The dude was a longer term project from the get go

He missed an opportunity to tear up the OHL(Covid) and went straight to a mens league

He has a grand total of 43 AHL games under his belt and 46 NHL games a majority of which was after a gruesome ankle injury and Covid and paired with duds. He did not get the whole Stutzle top lines, massive PP minutes, make mistake treatment.

I think we can give the kid a bit more rope.

Well, thanks for the good response.

I think this is a bit of a reach though, there is no way the Kings would have expected him to be at this point, he is behind, probably a year behind (that will be determined this year). When people said he wasn't your typical top 2 pick I think they were saying he wasn't going to be McDavid or Matthews, or even a Laine and Eichel, not that he'd be playing at a replacement level in his 2nd year with the organization and big question marks entering year 3.

But if you are right and he was this big of a project, in a cap league that gets younger and younger each year taking a guy with a 4-5 year development path at #2 overall (assuming they were aware as you suggest) then this was a poor selection for the Kings to make. You pass up on multiple years (maybe all the years?) of an ELC while he is developing, you also miss out on getting a player that is going to be able to contribute along side a Kopitar or Doughty. If Byfield takes until his 4th or 5th season to develop into anything of significance where will Doughty and Kopitar be at? Surely by keeping those guys and using the #2 pick the Kings expected to get at least a couple years of crossover of the eras?

These types of picks happened more decades ago, when the UFA age was 31 and players weren't making as much of an impact at 19-22 as they are today.
show me the #2 pick that had their league shut down due to a pandemic

Byfield like a lot of picks from his draft, have a different development curve.
Why was a #2 pick coming off a dominant draft-year even going back to the OHL in the first place?

Byfield had a higher PPG in his draft year in the CHL than Schevnikov, Hischier, Patrick and many other recent high picks who made the NHL as 18 year olds. The Kings had a clear spot at 2C available where he could have spent 50+ games playing mostly with Jeff Carter in a perfect environment on a bad team.

But instead the plan is to send him to the OHL? This is yet another situation with the Kings development choices where you just ask yourself, if you had 8 different teams making this decision and 6 or 7 are making one and the Kings are making another when is it fair to criticize the Kings when they lag behind? It's the same situation with Turcotte, at what point do these unorthodox decisions start to be criticized, it seems for some (not you) it is really going to be never. You still have some referring to guys entering their 6th season in the organization as kids. The "barely old enough to buy a beer" crowd will say that its


I tend to agree that Byfield's stagnation up to this point is mostly on Blake, and some of it is due to injuries. However, I think there are several posters who are frustrated with Byfield's ice time and the situations in which he is deployed by McLellan when Byfield is in the lineup.

McLellan may have been given directions to make the playoffs, or else. If this is the case, Robitaille and Blake shoulder even more of the blame. I think its a fool's errand to "just make the playoffs" while having to ride Kopitar, Danault, Quick, etc. to do it.

Injuries have fast-forwarded the development of some of the defensemen. Perhaps a similar circumstance would be useful for the development of forwards? It may be the only thing that forces the issue with this management team.
Just the playoffs is what they wanted. Danault and Arvidson weren't brought in if they thought the team was going to miss the playoffs, but everyone knew they weren't good enough to make any kind of run. But they also built on that pretty well this summer and with the development of other youth.

I've been critical of Blake's drafting and development decisions (especially in round 1) but I actually think he has done an exceptional job adjusting on the fly and building a pretty good team despite those two huge draft blunders hanging over his head. I think the reality is that Blake probably realized after the 2020-2021 season that the ROI with Vilardi and Turcotte was going to be a disaster and acted accordingly to address that and again has done a good job since then. The Danault signing (even if some wanted to go with more youth) was an excellent signing. The Fiala trade, in which Blake flipped one of his best draft picks as GM as the key piece for an 85 point forward was a great transaction with the pick and the trade. Brock Faber would go ridiculously higher in a re-draft right now, and Blake deserves all the credit for what he turned a mid 2nd rounder into in such a short time. Same thing with the Arvy trade. I have respect for a guy who can make adjustments on the fly and not get married to prospects based on where they were drafted. But it is also still fair to question the weird decisions made with the 1st rounders. Some people are capable of seeing the good and bad, and others think Blake has never done a thing wrong.
 
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People don’t realize that Byfield looking bad and given shitty deployment can be exclusive to one another.

In some ways you can say that it was the lack of ice time but I will say comfortably while Mclellan didn’t help at all, Byfield didn’t do anything to deserve more icetime. He was bad.

If he doesn’t do much better this season you can easily get an idea what kind of player he is going to be. This is his defining season.
 
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Byfield was also one of the youngest members of his draft class. Don’t have time to look it up right now but if I remember correctly he is 9 months younger the Lafreniere and was almost eligible for the next years draft.

Just think we cut the kid a bit of slack. Season hasn’t even started and there has been no updates on any of his off season training etc that I am aware of.

Kid could come out, get paired with Fiala and light the world on fire.
 
Byfield was also one of the youngest members of his draft class. Don’t have time to look it up right now but if I remember correctly he is 9 months younger the Lafreniere and was almost eligible for the next years draft.

Just think we cut the kid a bit of slack. Season hasn’t even started and there has been no updates on any of his off season training etc that I am aware of.

Kid could come out, get paired with Fiala and light the world on fire.
Byfield's birthday is literally today. If he was born 4 weeks later, he would have been eligible for the 2021 draft class.

It's perfectly reasonable to want patience for a very young player. However, there is question on how he's being developed and put in a position to succeed.

Most people aren't dumping on Byfield for where he's currently at. They're questioning the Kings for almost trapping him in this situation with their decision-making.
 
The two goals aren’t mutually exclusive, or shouldn’t be. The mistake was trying to make the play-offs at the expense of Byfield it seems. One shouldn’t have seemingly been prioritised over the other and that’s the problem and sitting Byfield in the first round certainly seems to confirm that. I think there’s a bit of blame to go around there. Because by prioritising making the play-offs over Byfield that could be one of those decisions that gets us into the play-offs but further away from a cup.
lol, you won’t find a team that will do it any differently. If you have the opportunity to make the playoffs, you do it…you aren’t sacrificing that to babysit your teenagers in the org. Utterly ridiculous.
 
I think using “he’s the youngest of his draft class” is a pretty bad excuse all things considered. Maybe if he was being edged out in performance slightly by other players in his draft class I’d acknowledge that. But not for being flat out bad… that holds no water.
 
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I think using “he’s the youngest of his draft class” is a pretty bad excuse all things considered. Maybe if he was being edged out in performance slightly by other players in his draft class I’d acknowledge that. But not for being flat out bad… that holds no water.
What do you think you will be saying if Byfield is a star in this league 4-5 years from now?
 
Except apparently Kaliyev wasn't good enough to "earn" playing on the top-six after working to pay his dues.

Or Grundstrom being benched after scoring in 3 straight games.

Or Byfield getting benched in both the AHL and NHL playoffs just to watch both teams get bounced.

With all the different ways people learn and grow, why is ONE approach the only correct approach to be applied to all players (in this case, forwards)? Why is there no flexibility in this? Especially since nobody made Mikey Anderson spend all of any season in the bottom pairing before getting paired with Doughty.
Blake has said he expects Kaliyev to get a shot in the top6 next year right? Grundström was edged out in a numbers game. Blake seemed unwilling to dump Brown. I understand that decision although I may not agree with it.

Next season Brown & AA are gone there are opportunities for players to grab. It's up to them to grab it. If they can't beat out Lemieux, Lizotte, Moore then I'm not all that concerned.

Byfield got benched in NHL playoffs because Mcdavid was torching him. Kid with 46 NHL games coming off a serious leg injury has trouble defending Mcdavid. Shocked, I'm shocked.

I'd say Mikey grabbed his opportunity. There wasn't a better option & he got the chance & nailed it. There were tons of injuries last year. Fagemo got 4 games & Turcotte got 8. They weren't ready, but they got a chance to find out. Rookies breaking in may show they are ready during an injury call up, but clearing a spot for them may take time. JMFJ being replaced by Voynov took time & Martinez trying to get ice time under Sutter come to mind. Even McNabb was benched during a good stretch of play when other D came off injuries. Toffoli & Pearson getting hated on by Sutter when they broke into the league.

There are even guys that breakout, but there is no space on their team & they end up getting traded. Like that dude the Wild just traded away. It's difficult to fit everyone in. They have to work hard, keep their feet moving & be ready for their shot. Durzi wasn't even on the radar this time last year. Crazy stuff happens.
 
Blake has said he expects Kaliyev to get a shot in the top6 next year right? Grundström was edged out in a numbers game. Blake seemed unwilling to dump Brown. I understand that decision although I may not agree with it.

Next season Brown & AA are gone there are opportunities for players to grab. It's up to them to grab it. If they can't beat out Lemieux, Lizotte, Moore then I'm not all that concerned.

Byfield got benched in NHL playoffs because Mcdavid was torching him. Kid with 46 NHL games coming off a serious leg injury has trouble defending Mcdavid. Shocked, I'm shocked.

I'd say Mikey grabbed his opportunity. There wasn't a better option & he got the chance & nailed it. There were tons of injuries last year. Fagemo got 4 games & Turcotte got 8. They weren't ready, but they got a chance to find out. Rookies breaking in may show they are ready during an injury call up, but clearing a spot for them may take time. JMFJ being replaced by Voynov took time & Martinez trying to get ice time under Sutter come to mind. Even McNabb was benched during a good stretch of play when other D came off injuries. Toffoli & Pearson getting hated on by Sutter when they broke into the league.

There are even guys that breakout, but there is no space on their team & they end up getting traded. Like that dude the Wild just traded away. It's difficult to fit everyone in. They have to work hard, keep their feet moving & be ready for their shot. Durzi wasn't even on the radar this time last year. Crazy stuff happens.
Yes, it was communicated that Kaliyev was expected to play in the top 6 - then they traded for Fiala. So, unless Arvidsson starts off the season injured, Kaliyev won't play in the top-6. Getting time to play in the top 6 because of an injury isn't exactly "earning it."

Grundstrom was benched after scoring in 3 straight games. How has he "not earned" playing time?

Was McDavid playing in the AHL playoffs, too? Because Byfield didn't get to play in the AHL playoffs, either. No answer for that question. Shocked. I'm shocked.

The Kings didn't have the injuries they had when Anderson was put on Doughty's top pairing. He played with Doughty all of the 2020-21 season, after only playing 59 professional games (6 NHL and 53 AHL). He didn't spend an entire NHL season in the bottom pairing.

Heck, Bjornfot got 3 games playing with Doughty as an 18 year-old before he was sent back down to the AHL. When was the last time an 18 year-old was put on a line with Kopitar for a 3 game stretch? A 19 year old? A 20 year old? At best, Kaliyev got a couple shifts sporadically. But there is a stark difference in how coaching and management judges the readiness of a forward versus a defenseman.

I mentioned before the number of players who are starting to become risks of being lost to waivers. There's not enough room in the bottom 6 to marinate rookies for years.

There's nothing wrong with taking a marinating approach to prospects, when it's the right prospects. There IS a problem with showing little flexibility and creativity in how prospects get developed and deployed.
 
It’s all about a Top 9 now, it’s not the DL style NHL anymore where it’s grinders on a third line. Byfield will be centering two pretty proven guys (assuming Iafallo isn’t in a career free fall) and they should be able to take advantage of some soft matchups, something that the Champagne Line simply was not able to do last year as they were dominated most nights forcing TM to lean heavily on the other lines. But a significant upgrade in linemates as well as individual progression should leave both players in good spots even in a “third line” role.

The one area of concern for me is the PP usage. Iafallo should not be on the PP anymore with the players the Kings currently roster. But not only was he on the PP last year he was heavily featured. Iafallo and Danault, even more than Sturm were the big issues on the PP and neither should play over AK. QB on the other hand needs to earn PP time, last year his play did not warrant it and despite popular myths on this forum no team in the NHL is just handing PP time to young players who don’t warrant it. However the AK gripes are more legit, he did prove it on the PP and he was still denied heavy usage, that is on the coaches, they have to be better about getting those young guys involved when their play warrants it. That Dallas game showed us what AK is capable of doing on the PP, that should have been when adjustments were made to get AK and his lethal shot more involved but instead it was right back to the Danault/Iafallo disaster for the rest of the year.
 
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