Tribute Kyle Dubas discussion

[DarkKnight]

We have two more back to backs this month? Is he actually going to stick with Hutchinson or will we run Andy into the ground because it’s our only choice?

Our backup situation is farcical.

 

[Mess]

Been hearing NHL is a results league lately. By that Dubas has failed unless his cast steps up for him the rest of the season and makes the
playoffs.

"Sports are a results oriented business".

5 Elements of a SMART Business Goal

Specific = Dubas was hired to replace Lou Lam as Leafs GM with the objective of advancing Leafs beyond the 1st round of the playoffs and winning the Cup
Measurable = Results YTD .. Year #1 - Loss in Round #1 .. Breakeven no improvement
Attainable = Year #2 - Currently on pace trending to miss playoffs
Relevant = Leafs Window of Cup competitiveness = length of player contracts before stars hit UFA status = 5/6 years.
Time-Based = Year #1 = Failure, Year #2 = Concerned, Year #3 = TBD, Year #4 = TBD, Year #5 = TBD

Grading:
Win Stanley Cup = Happy
Continue to make playoffs annually = Adequate
Miss playoffs with no chance at Cup = Concerned

 

[WTFMAN99]

Concerned for all the obvious reasons.

 

[A1LeafNation]

He f***ed up the back up situation the last two years.

This is costing us home us and maybe even the playoffs.

This is on Dubas and his poor evaluation of the importance of the back up ...which is also due to his part in the Marner negotiations.

 

[MyBudJT]

LOL at people blaming Marner for Dubas' poor cap management.

 

[zeke]

Is that better than having empty spots on the roster?

Is that better than not having the cap space to pay a NHL calibre backup?!

certainly better.

here's the bottom 10 goalies in the league this year, minimum 5 gms played:

1.C.Schneider ($6.00m x 3yrs): .852
2.L.Domingue ($1.15m x 1yrs): .858
3.K.Kinkaid ($1.75m x 1yrs): .875
4.M.Hutchinson ($0.70m x 1yrs): .876
5.J.Quick ($5.80m x 4yrs): .884
6.L.Broissoit ($1.23 x 1yrs): .885
7.J.Howard ($4.00 x 1yrs): .887
8.J.Bernier ($3.00 x 2yrs): .888
9.M.Jones ($5.75 x 5yrs): .889
10.S.Montembeault ($0.71 x 1yrs): .889

Having hutch is certainly better than having all those guys and their contracts, aside from Montembeault and broissoit, the 2 other cheapos.

Meanwhile the 2 best backup goalies in the league this year - by a lot, are near league minimum guys Jarry (.943) and Francouz (.931).

 

[MapleLeafs9]

concerned

Our stars are overpaid (Matthews, Marner, Tavares) we lack major depth on LW, our defence sucks, our team defence sucks, 5/6 of our D are pending UFAs with no space to re-sign them unless we trade one of our overpaid stars, but the sad thing is that we will probably trade Nylander (who has the best contract on the team after Rielly) before any of our overpaid top 3 stars.

It feels like we are struggling so hard this season to barely make the playoffs and get another round 1 matchup with the likely president’s trophy winning Bruins as a 2nd wildcard spot, get destroyed, get laughed at and memed by the other 30 fan bases, then it will continue to trend downhill even more due to our cap situation.

It was nice to get a little hope from the 3 game winning streak after the Keefe hiring, but now that the honeymoon phase has worn off, this team has a lot of issues that coaching won’t fix, and I just don’t have confidence in Dubas to fix them

 

[stopclickbait]

Hes done pretty well addressed the D with the Barrie and Muzzin additions. Unfortunate he held onto Babcock for so long but don't really know whats going behind the scenes with the owner.

Was happy he got out of the awful Marleau and Zaitsev contracts never overpay vets and plugs.

I'm interested if he finds a way to move Ceci atleast its a 1 year contract so not the worst thing in the world, I understand taking a gamble and sometimes it doesn't work.

Will see how the season progresses as the Leafs finally play to there strengths with Keefe behind the bench.

If my biggest qualm against him is the back up goalie situation that seems minor with all the other awful things other GMs do.

 

[LeafingTheWay]

Good moves
-Muzzin
-AJ & KK contracts
-Zaitsev for Ceci
-John Tavares

Lukewarm
-Marleau trade
-Nylander's contract is good, but the process was a mess
-Lindholm for Petan
-Kadri for Barrie

Could've been better
-McBackup
-Matthews and Marner should've signed 8 year deals

Edit - Missed Tavares lol

This pretty much sums it up really well.

I would add Kerfoot to the Kadri for Barrie point, the signing of Mikheyev and Spezza to the 'Good moves' section, and the Leivo trade to the 'Lukewarm/Could've been better' section.

IMO he's done really well, and addressed majority of the needs this team has ever had for the past 10+ years. Adding our best defensive D-man in so long (Muzzin), our best RHD in so long (Barrie) and added more RHD depth Holl/Ceci to the Leafs. Likely the best D-core we've had in 10+ years. Up front, he got us an additional franchise 1C and and fantastic depth.

I really, really hate the backup situation as having a 0-7-1 record with them is insanely bad. Matthews/Marner deals I'm not as worried about since Dubas is able to find/develop cheap depth to save us on capspace. But oh man, if only he had traded Johnsson for a good backup goalie we'd be in a strong situation right now. Then again, maybe it was all part of getting Babcock fired and now acquiring one (still waiting)

 

[deletethis]

Time to fix the O-ring issue so we can see how high this rocket can fly.

 

[Gary Nylund]

certainly better.

here's the bottom 10 goalies in the league this year, minimum 5 gms played:

1.C.Schneider ($6.00m x 3yrs): .852
2.L.Domingue ($1.15m x 1yrs): .858
3.K.Kinkaid ($1.75m x 1yrs): .875
4.M.Hutchinson ($0.70m x 1yrs): .876
5.J.Quick ($5.80m x 4yrs): .884
6.L.Broissoit ($1.23 x 1yrs): .885
7.J.Howard ($4.00 x 1yrs): .887
8.J.Bernier ($3.00 x 2yrs): .888
9.M.Jones ($5.75 x 5yrs): .889
10.S.Montembeault ($0.71 x 1yrs): .889

Having hutch is certainly better than having all those guys and their contracts, aside from Montembeault and broissoit, the 2 other cheapos.

Meanwhile the 2 best backup goalies in the league this year - by a lot, are near league minimum guys Jarry (.943) and Francouz (.931).

Fascinating stuff, here's my rebuttal:

Our backup sucks and that's been by far our biggest problem this season. Not being able to afford a better one is a huge issue.

 

[4thline]

My only concern at this point is the potential over attachment to middle of the roster types. 99% of the teams current issues could have been/ can be fixed with a Johnsson/KK trade.

 

[Gary Nylund]

My only concern at this point is the potential over attachment to middle of the roster types. 99% of the teams current issues could have been/ can be fixed with a Johnsson/KK trade.

Agree 100%. Trade one of those guys for a decent backup and we're a much better team overnight even if we "lose" the trade.

 

[MyBudJT]

There are a few Dubas decisions I don't agree with / understand... but overall I don't hate him.

Some of my issues include:
1) Trading Brown because he got paid 2.1M, but then goes ahead and signs Johnsson for 3.5 x 4
2) Trade Kadri for a 3rd pairing defensemen (or 13th forward, readlly) and lesser centerman...
3) Overpays RFAs in general... especially Nylander, Matthews and Marner
4) Opting to keep Johnsson instead of a 1st round pick when dumping Marleau on Carolina...

He seems to be doing a good job of drafting and developing talent, though.

 

[Guided by Veseys]

I think his situation here in terms of contention, attention and signing the rfas was harder then the experience of most other current GMs. None of them had a comparable in trying to sign two mega stars at once and none of them are scrutinized remotely close in term of media attention.
So in summary, he was very active and things could be so much worse. Given our situation we needed a brilliant GM with vision and tenacity to get us through.
At this point I’m concerned that his moves might not pay off. There’s no sure bet either way.
We needed a great GM. So far he’s a good GM. If it all pans out he will be beyond reproach imo. If we miss the playoffs tho he needs some heat and if he gets fired that’s the way it goes in this market.
The backup situation is interesting. He seemed to hedge his bets there and I guess hope we would somehow become a good defensive team. A bit of an oversight apparently.

 

[deletethis]

I'm sorry, did we give the impression that we think finding a competent backup was super easy?

 

[Buds17]

I'd go adequate with the caveat that it's still early. It's best assessed - in my opinion - when this season is completed and there's a comparison to be made from his first to his second full year in charge.

Plenty of changes have been made already. I'd think more is yet to come. We'll see if it all ends up being for the better. There have been positive signs. There is still some concern.

 

[Trapper]

We have two more back to backs this month? Is he actually going to stick with Hutchinson or will we run Andy into the ground because it’s our only choice?

Our backup situation is farcical.

One is Detroit. If we can’t win with a backup seriously start evaluating the core.

 

[CDN24]

certainly better.

here's the bottom 10 goalies in the league this year, minimum 5 gms played:

1.C.Schneider ($6.00m x 3yrs): .852
2.L.Domingue ($1.15m x 1yrs): .858
3.K.Kinkaid ($1.75m x 1yrs): .875
4.M.Hutchinson ($0.70m x 1yrs): .876
5.J.Quick ($5.80m x 4yrs): .884
6.L.Broissoit ($1.23 x 1yrs): .885
7.J.Howard ($4.00 x 1yrs): .887
8.J.Bernier ($3.00 x 2yrs): .888
9.M.Jones ($5.75 x 5yrs): .889
10.S.Montembeault ($0.71 x 1yrs): .889

Having hutch is certainly better than having all those guys and their contracts, aside from Montembeault and broissoit, the 2 other cheapos.

Meanwhile the 2 best backup goalies in the league this year - by a lot, are near league minimum guys Jarry (.943) and Francouz (.931).

Is it though? Many of those guys are on crap teams who will be in the running for No 1 overall pick, Leafs were supposed to be a contender so having an adequate backup is more important.
NJ/Det and LA are the three worse teams in the league so having your backup on a contender performing at the level of their goaltending is not okay. Kinkaid has not got the job done and is now in Laval while someone else gets a shot. Broissoit has an awful save % but he is .500 (3-3) as a backup. Same for Montembault but he is 3-2-1. If Hutch was 4-4 in the 8 starts backups have gotten would we be having this discussion? Jones is a starter who is having a bad year. Again because a starter is having a bad year it does not excuse Dubas from not addressing the backup position. He basically went into the year with one option for backup without any cap space or a backup plan (pun intended) to address the problem if Hutch did not work out.

Again the fact that Jarry and Francouz are having a great year minimal cost backups does not excuse Dubas for not addressing it. The issue is the backup goaltending that Dubas has assembled is not good enough to be trusted even in a limited (B2B) only role. He has no other options and reserved no cap space just in case. If Francouz an unknown had failed Avs have the cap space to find a replacement. Pens have another viable option in Desmith. He could have been a leaf when he went on waivers but at $1.25m AAV he was a bit to rich for Dubas' budget.

 

[Gary Nylund]

There are a few Dubas decisions I don't agree with / understand... but overall I don't hate him.

Some of my issues include:
1) Trading Brown because he got paid 2.1M, but then goes ahead and signs Johnsson for 3.5 x 4
2) Trade Kadri for a 3rd pairing defensemen (or 13th forward, readlly) and lesser centerman...
3) Overpays RFAs in general... especially Nylander, Matthews and Marner
4) Opting to keep Johnsson instead of a 1st round pick when dumping Marleau on Carolina...

He seems to be doing a good job of drafting and developing talent, though.

LOL at Tyson Barrie being a 3rd pairing Dman.

 

[MyBudJT]

LOL at Tyson Barrie being a 3rd pairing Dman.

He's by far been our worst defensman this season...

 

[Gary Nylund]

He's by far been our worst defensman this season...

LOL again at Tyson Barrie being a 3rd pairing Dman.

 

[Judas Tavares]

The backup situation and the Marner contract are the only issues for me.

I've liked his trades, minus Marleau, but that was Lou's issue.

His 2015 draft produced 3 players so far, while 2018 and 2019 (I consider 2016 and 2017 Hunter's) are too early to judge, Sandin and Robertson look like mid 1sts rather than a late 1st/late 2nd.

I think this deadline and offseason will have a huge bearing going forward.

 

[MyBudJT]

LOL again at Tyson Barrie being a 3rd pairing Dman.

Are you suggesting he's better or worse then that??

 

[Ashdown2]

how about we let HALF the season play out before the pitchforks ?

2 things i would point out.
1) everyone is complaining about backups. Look hutch was pretty damn good last year in his stint with the big club. was everyone expecting his game to fall off a bride ? Also the SV% is misleading, the team frankly was HORRIBLE in many of his starts and i would figure he would have at least 3 wins if trading places with freddie who had laugher games. goalie management is a thing.
2) Wasnt this proclaimed as a 3 headed monster when babs got hired ? babs certainly had his input on the players on this roster and how many minutes they got. wherther its not playing leivo or holl for a complete season or keep on playing marincin, shore and goat who are complete garbage. Who knows what moves he suggested to dubas to make. even this "need a right handed guy" who cares some players can play right side and be lefty.


for me besides some overpayments none of his moves have been terrible.
this offseason will be a huge indicator