Kitchener Rangers 2022-23 Off-Season Thread (Part 5)

[Rangers True Blue]

So MM saying that they were looking for a D, an F, and a G was a dangling carrot for the have nots? Perhaps and probably.

Still, you have to wonder if indeed, Henry is in the mix for that D and if Montreal is more comfortable with the new, improved coaching team and has asked for an open F for Mesar should they feel that he won't get the minutes he needs in the AHL to develop. So there's the F. And as for the 3rd goalie, it's between Edwards and Maillet.

 

[dirty12]

You’d think it was that easy but it isn’t. It depends on what the player wants but Ottawa can play hardball back and say they are fine with just the comp pick and let HB sit out of the OHL for the year. He’d then have to play in an alternate league.

I’m not saying a team would do that but they would if the compensation packages were vastly different.

I cannot see a player that is simply looking for a good place to play with the right opportunities narrowing his list of teams down to one. I think he’d likely be looking at a handful of teams that would suit his desired developmental path. It is fair for the player and fair to the 67’s. Both sides win in that situation.

Windsor and Flint are less than hour from home, Sarnia & Saginaw within 1.5. London and Kitchener are the two most desirable franchises.
But only Flint can really offer what you state is worthwhile right now. Windsor can pull it off if they want.
Kitchener for 2, 3, 4, 4, …another pick? might be best for all sides

 

[EvenSteven]

So MM saying that they were looking for a D, an F, and a G was a dangling carrot for the have nots? Perhaps and probably.

Still, you have to wonder if indeed, Henry is in the mix for that D and if Montreal is more comfortable with the new, improved coaching team and has asked for an open F for Mesar should they feel that he won't get the minutes he needs in the AHL to develop. So there's the F. And as for the 3rd goalie, it's between Edwards and Maillet.

I’m buying what you’re selling! Lol!!

 

[OMG67]

Windsor and Flint are less than hour from home, Sarnia & Saginaw within 1.5. London and Kitchener are the two most desirable franchises.
But only Flint can really offer what you state is worthwhile right now. Windsor can pull it off if they want.
Kitchener for 2, 3, 4, 4, …another pick? might be best for all sides

Kitchener can trade picks through 2028 so I think they have the picks to do what they need in regards to HB. The issue is one of the 2nds is a 2024. I think they are better off using that pick for something other than HB.

 

[EvenSteven]

Windsor and Flint are less than hour from home, Sarnia & Saginaw within 1.5. London and Kitchener are the two most desirable franchises.
But only Flint can really offer what you state is worthwhile right now. Windsor can pull it off if they want.
Kitchener for 2, 3, 4, 4, …another pick? might be best for all sides

You may see a deal with Kitchener where a pick is conditional. Kitchener currently has 2nd, 3rd and 2x4ths that they can move. If Ottawa values picks that are not distant, then the 2nd Kitchener has in ‘24 makes sense. But the 3rd is in ‘27. Perhaps that 3rd can be conditional whereby if and when the Rangers acquire a 3rd in ‘24, that pick would go to Ottawa in place of the 3rd in ‘27.

The Bracco trade between Kitchener and Windsor had similar conditions on a 2nd round pick.

At the end of the day, 2nd and 3rd rounders in ‘24 may trump an offer from another team where to distant 2nds are part of their package.

Kitchener can trade picks through 2028 so I think they have the picks to do what they need in regards to HB. The issue is one of the 2nds is a 2024. I think they are better off using that pick for something other than HB.

Only picks thru ‘27 can be traded I think. Four drafts out.

 

[rangersblues]

You’d think it was that easy but it isn’t. It depends on what the player wants but Ottawa can play hardball back and say they are fine with just the comp pick and let HB sit out of the OHL for the year. He’d then have to play in an alternate league.

I’m not saying a team would do that but they would if the compensation packages were vastly different.

I cannot see a player that is simply looking for a good place to play with the right opportunities narrowing his list of teams down to one. I think he’d likely be looking at a handful of teams that would suit his desired developmental path. It is fair for the player and fair to the 67’s. Both sides win in that situation.

Did they change the rules? I thought the defected player had to be traded by September 15 in order to receive the compensation pick.

 

[EvenSteven]

Did they change the rules? I thought the defected player had to be traded by September 15 in order to receive the compensation pick.

I don’t think traded. Just declared defected. But once they do, they’re walking away from the player. Hence, the urgency to trade him to at least get assets back.

 

[Tim Wallach]

Interestingly, Kitchener has 8 D on the roster right now. Even with McNiel being re-assigned, it doesn't appear they'd have any big rush to add D. So we'll see if HB is a fit for them. He'd for sure be an upgrade on a couple of guys they have, but I'm not convinced they'll pay the price and bump out one of the others.

 

[Jives]

To add a really good 16 year old they can easily bump Scott or Runco. It might make you make a trade away Hunter or Motew quicker but for sure they are in on adding a 16 year old Dman that looks pretty promising.

 

[EvenSteven]

Interestingly, Kitchener has 8 D on the roster right now. Even with McNiel being re-assigned, it doesn't appear they'd have any big rush to add D. So we'll see if HB is a fit for them. He'd for sure be an upgrade on a couple of guys they have, but I'm not convinced they'll pay the price and bump out one of the others.

For the 22nd overall pick? I think the Ranger’s find a spot for him. After MacNiel is sent down, Henry would make eight.

Nothing wrong with 8 on D to start the season. Especially when we consider the vets will be in play to be moved by the deadline.

 

[OMG67]

Did they change the rules? I thought the defected player had to be traded by September 15 in order to receive the compensation pick.

The player needs to be declared defected by I think) September 15. The team is awarded the compensatory pick at that point. It is then up to the team to trade his rights if they choose to. There is no obligation for the team to trade the players rights. They are incentivized to do so of course. But if the value isn’t right and is something that creates a competitive disadvantage or opens them to potential future difficulties dealing with other players, the team may feel the need to play it out fully and risk no trade being made.

Ottawa could also choose to retain the rights to the player and forfeit the defection route and compensation pick. If Ottawa feels they can get pen to paper after the window closes on September 15 knowing the player would likely cave and sign, they could do that as well. Of course, there is the risk the player refuses to report and shifts focus to other opportunities and their team is left with nothing. But, Ottawa would retain his rights for the OHL for five years.

 

[EvenSteven]

If they declare him defected to get the comp pick, but do not trade his rights, they lose his rights after the two week window and the player is designated a free agent, no?

Ottawa needs to work out a trade somewhere if they want more than just the comp pick.

 

[Tim Wallach]

To add a really good 16 year old they can easily bump Scott or Runco. It might make you make a trade away Hunter or Motew quicker but for sure they are in on adding a 16 year old Dman that looks pretty promising.

For the 22nd overall pick? I think the Ranger’s find a spot for him. After MacNiel is sent down, Henry would make eight.

Nothing wrong with 8 on D to start the season. Especially when we consider the vets will be in play to be moved by the deadline.

Oh, I'm not saying I wouldn't do it or that they shouldn't. I'm saying I'm not convinced they will.

Without naming names, there are a couple players on this roster I'd personally drop in a heartbeat.

 

[EvenSteven]

Oh, I'm not saying I wouldn't do it or that they shouldn't. I'm saying I'm not convinced they will.

Without naming names, there are a couple players on this roster I'd personally drop in a heartbeat.

Me as well. And I won’t mention the names either.

 

[OMG67]

If they declare him defected to get the comp pick, but do not trade his rights, they lose his rights after the two week window and the player is designated a free agent, no?

Ottawa needs to work out a trade somewhere if they want more than just the comp pick.

Someone can correct me if I am wrong but the player is not a true free agent. I believe the player goes back into the draft next year. He isn’t eligible to be signed by another team and play this season. I believe as an underage player, he would need to be redrafted. It is similar to a non drafted 16 year old being signed as a free agent right away now. They can’t do that.

 

[EvenSteven]

Someone can correct me if I am wrong but the player is not a true free agent. I believe the player goes back into the draft next year. He isn’t eligible to be signed by another team and play this season. I believe as an underage player, he would need to be redrafted. It is similar to a non drafted 16 year old being signed as a free agent right away now. They can’t do that.

Yup. You’re right. I misspoke. He’d go back into the draft.

The same way Cam Fowler did when we walked away from him in 08.

 

[GeoBlue]

You’d think it was that easy but it isn’t. It depends on what the player wants but Ottawa can play hardball back and say they are fine with just the comp pick and let HB sit out of the OHL for the year. He’d then have to play in an alternate league.

I’m not saying a team would do that but they would if the compensation packages were vastly different.

I cannot see a player that is simply looking for a good place to play with the right opportunities narrowing his list of teams down to one. I think he’d likely be looking at a handful of teams that would suit his desired developmental path. It is fair for the player and fair to the 67’s. Both sides win in that situation.

If it is true what is said that Henry's family wants him to play in Kitchener, then Kitchener it will be, if at all possible. As has been said before, there are many more options for kids nowadays as there was before. In Henry's case, he could very well sit out a year and play college hockey. Many high picks have done this. Sitting out a year and going through another draft only gives everyone a year to think about things. But if he still wants to play in Kitchener THEN, then the wheel goes around again.

 

[EvenSteven]

Fantilli applied for exceptional status, was turned down, then went to the Steel, liked it, and stayed to go the college route.

HB could go down the same path.

 

[OMG67]

Fantilli applied for exceptional status, was turned down, then went to the Steel, liked it, and stayed to go the college route.

HB could go down the same path.

Except he wasn’t drafted by Chicago. Wasn’t Fantilli drafted by Chicago?

 

[EvenSteven]

Except he wasn’t drafted by Chicago. Wasn’t Fantilli drafted by Chicago?

I don’t remember. Probably. But HB could probably walk onto any USHL team if he wanted to as a free agent.

 

[OMG67]

If it is true what is said that Henry's family wants him to play in Kitchener, then Kitchener it will be, if at all possible. As has been said before, there are many more options for kids nowadays as there was before. In Henry's case, he could very well sit out a year and play college hockey. Many high picks have done this. Sitting out a year and going through another draft only gives everyone a year to think about things. But if he still wants to play in Kitchener THEN, then the wheel goes around again.

I agree but I also don’t feel a picks only deal is set in stone because of the rules. A two part deal can happen. This is why I highlighted Rehkopf. Do the deadline deal now, get the ‘07 when he’s available an in hand (plus more picks) and call it a day.

If Kitchener is offering a 2nd, 3rd and 4th in a take it or leave it deal, it is incumbent on Ottawa to refuse the deal and redirect the pressure to the player to accept alternate teams or not play in the League this season. Ottawa would need to not cabe on their demands otherwise Ottawa gets whipped perpetually for seasons to come with players and other teams knowing they will cave.

I don’t remember. Probably. But HB could probably walk onto any USHL team if he wanted to as a free agent.

I’m not sure he can do that as a 16 year old. I think he’d be looking at jr A or maybe a US prep school.

 

[dirty12]

Except he wasn’t drafted by Chicago. Wasn’t Fantilli drafted by Chicago?

He was signed prior to USHL draft. It is a bit of a free for all where teams can sign a player and forfeit their 1st pick and a second player costing their 2nd pick as well

 

[LDN]

I am so damn excited about this HB trade! Looking forward to seeing what happens

 

[EvenSteven]

I agree but I also don’t feel a picks only deal is set in stone because of the rules. A two part deal can happen. This is why I highlighted Rehkopf. Do the deadline deal now, get the ‘07 when he’s available an in hand (plus more picks) and call it a day.

If Kitchener is offering a 2nd, 3rd and 4th in a take it or leave it deal, it is incumbent on Ottawa to refuse the deal and redirect the pressure to the player to accept alternate teams or not play in the League this season. Ottawa would need to not cabe on their demands otherwise Ottawa gets whipped perpetually for seasons to come with players and other teams knowing they will cave.


I’m not sure he can do that as a 16 year old. I think he’d be looking at jr A or maybe a US prep school.

If HB will only play in Kitchener, and Kitchener offered to empty their cupboard in the deal (2nd, 3rd, 2x4ths), it’s probably close to market value for the 22nd overall pick - whether that is his ranking or not.

Ottawa would be wise to take the picks, the comp pick, and call it a day.

Holding onto the player’s rights costs them the comp pick and then they have to hope he eventually reports or that they could trade his rights down the road, when, down the road he could have gone the college route.

That’s IF he’ll only play in Kitchener.

 

[Ward Cornell]

Mark me down for not making this trade.