Kingston Frontenacs 2024-25 Season Thread, Part I

[OMG67]

There is value for development to practice at the OHL level, learning the system, adapting to OHL life, travelling with the team etc. you still need to play but sometimes the player would practice with the OHL team but play their games in Tier II where possible.

 

[leafs4life94]

There is value for development to practice at the OHL level, learning the system, adapting to OHL life, travelling with the team etc. you still need to play but sometimes the player would practice with the OHL team but play their games in Tier II where possible.

This is where I wish Kingston still had the Voyageurs to have a local team. Of the signed guys that aren't with Kingston they have guys in Pickering (Betts), Cornwall (McQuaig) and Carleton Place (Shewfelt). Nothing crazy far but it's still an extra hour + of travel that makes having players come in for practices a pain.

 

[OMG67]

This is where I wish Kingston still had the Voyageurs to have a local team. Of the signed guys that aren't with Kingston they have guys in Pickering (Betts), Cornwall (McQuaig) and Carleton Place (Shewfelt). Nothing crazy far but it's still an extra hour + of travel that makes having players come in for practices a pain.

Ottawa can do it easily. Big advantage here. I know they have done that in the past. We have a couple players that may benefit from that as well. Not enough excess skaters though.

 

[ottsabrefan]

0-6 in one goal games this year. 3-0 in lopsided games. Interesting.

 

[frontsfan67]

0-6 in one goal games this year. 3-0 in lopsided games. Interesting.

0/3 in OT games too

Frustrating start so far but the rest of the division isn’t doing the best either so it’s fine I guess

 

[frontsfan67]

Paul Ludwinski 2024/2025 AHL reg season 3GP 0G 0A -3 3rd line mins

2023/2024 AHL reg season- 5GP 0G 0A 2pim +1

2023/2024 AHL Playoffs DNP

Not sure where to get his 2024/25 pre season stats but I checked rookie scoring and he didn’t get listed for a point- not sure how many games he played though.

Don’t think he’s ready for the AHL but I haven’t watched the games just stat watching. Wonder if he comes back here. Interestingly enough the fronts haven’t made any trades for OA’s yet

 

[dirty12]

Paul Ludwinski 2024/2025 AHL reg season 3GP 0G 0A -3 3rd line mins

2023/2024 AHL reg season- 5GP 0G 0A 2pim +1

2023/2024 AHL Playoffs DNP

Not sure where to get his 2024/25 pre season stats but I checked rookie scoring and he didn’t get listed for a point- not sure how many games he played though.

Don’t think he’s ready for the AHL but I haven’t watched the games just stat watching. Wonder if he comes back here. Interestingly enough the fronts haven’t made any trades for OA’s yet

Third line minutes in the AHL for an ‘04 is pretty good, I think. Dressing for every game with fourth line minutes would be enough for me to believe the player is not returning for an OA season.

 

[dirty12]

0/3 in OT games too

Frustrating start so far but the rest of the division isn’t doing the best either so it’s fine I guess

The points gained by Brantford at the expense of Kingston is not really fine though.

I have thought all along Allard would be the fall back option if not getting Wakely. I wonder if the Soo is asking too much

 

[frontsfan67]

Brantford gained 1 more point than Kingston yesterday. But I get your point. Yes I’ve been saying all along Allard, swick, OVS, McCoy are players they're likely keeping close tabs on. I think they're going to wait and see with Ludwinski here and if nothing happens and he doesn’t get sent back- whoever is available still they’ll go for the best one.




Fronts have to win today- need 4/6 points that’s still a good weekend.

 

[OMG67]

WRT OA’s, many of the teams holding the top OA’s are simply going to hold them until the deadline so they can bank some points in the standings. I don’t think anyone should assume it is only a matter of Kingston going out and getting one like they are pulling products off the shelf at the grocery store.

Other than Musty, I doubt many significant players will come available prior to the Christmas break.

This is a great opportunity for teams like Kingston to keep rolling out their younger players. Give them some quality minutes. Maybe even mix up the lines a bit and insert some of them as the 3rd wheel on a top line for a period here and there. See how well they respond. It may be good for their development. Worse case scenario, you uncover they are not quality enough to be relied upon and you go into the deadline with a better prepared shopping list.

In the less likely scenario where it looks hopeless, at least you will have taken enough time to make an internal assessment and have the choice to not participate at the deadline and maintain current assets.

 

[dirty12]

WRT OA’s, many of the teams holding the top OA’s are simply going to hold them until the deadline so they can bank some points in the standings. I don’t think anyone should assume it is only a matter of Kingston going out and getting one like they are pulling products off the shelf at the grocery store.

Other than Musty, I doubt many significant players will come available prior to the Christmas break.

This is a great opportunity for teams like Kingston to keep rolling out their younger players. Give them some quality minutes. Maybe even mix up the lines a bit and insert some of them as the 3rd wheel on a top line for a period here and there. See how well they respond. It may be good for their development. Worse case scenario, you uncover they are not quality enough to be relied upon and you go into the deadline with a better prepared shopping list.

In the less likely scenario where it looks hopeless, at least you will have taken enough time to make an internal assessment and have the choice to not participate at the deadline and maintain current assets.

In general that is sound strategy. But Kingston needed those points handed to Brantford and Oshawa in those three one goal losses. The plan had to be bank points while division rivals were minus players imo. The team should want no part of a first round match up with Oshawa, Brampton, or a Brantford team given a reason to load up.
As far as I know, Allard is waiting on a team. As soon as the frontenacs knew Wakely would not go to them, they should have made as good an OA and team fit as there is available their priority imo.

 

[OMG67]

In general that is sound strategy. But Kingston needed those points handed to Brantford and Oshawa in those three one goal losses. The plan had to be bank points while division rivals were minus players imo. The team should want no part of a first round match up with Oshawa, Brampton, or a Brantford team given a reason to load up.
As far as I know, Allard is waiting on a team. As soon as the frontenacs knew Wakely would not go to them, they should have made as good an OA and team fit as there is available their priority imo.

I guess it depends on philosophy. You can go out and get the best available early or you can wait and get “The Best.” I prefer the approach of getting the “The Best” later.

 

[scotty171]

In general that is sound strategy. But Kingston needed those points handed to Brantford and Oshawa in those three one goal losses. The plan had to be bank points while division rivals were minus players imo. The team should want no part of a first round match up with Oshawa, Brampton, or a Brantford team given a reason to load up.
As far as I know, Allard is waiting on a team. As soon as the frontenacs knew Wakely would not go to them, they should have made as good an OA and team fit as there is available their priority imo.

Apparently Allard is injured at the moment. I have not seen anything about the extent of the injury anywhere though.

 

[dirty12]

I guess it depends on philosophy. You can go out and get the best available early or you can wait and get “The Best.” I prefer the approach of getting the “The Best” later.

Was there better than Wakely early, or better than Allard later? I really don't think so.
But my point in this case, is I think banked points is much more important than the possibility of a marginally better talent being available that might not fit 15-20 games later into the schedule.

 

[frontsfan67]

Same old same old. Hoping the second line can wake up. Lines 1 and 3 have been FAR better the last 2 games

 

[OMG67]

Was there better than Wakely early, or better than Allard later? I really don't think so.
But my point in this case, is I think banked points is much more important than the possibility of a marginally better talent being available that might not fit 15-20 games later into the schedule.

If you are trying to win a championship, you want the best players in the playoffs.

We can agree that Wakely is the best player. No doubt. But, if rumours are accurate, he wouldn’t go to Kingston. So, does Kingston then pivot to the best available RIGHT NOW and call it a day? Or, do they wait for the best to become available? If they can add a stop gap OA for peanuts, similar to what Ottawa did last eyar with Lawrence for an 8th round pick, then I am all for it. Jsut replace him at the deadline. But, if they have to pay two 2nds, and a 3rd for another player of the calibre of Guindon only to pass up on (insert whatever name you want here) at the deadline for an additional 4th round pick added to the package, then yes, I do believe it is more valuable to wait.

Additionally, it gives the Front an opportunity to uncover a hidden gem in their lineup they either didn’t know they had or didn’t think would step up this quick. That alone may alter the decision on which OA is most valuable.

I understand your point regarding who they play makes a difference but if you are shooting for a Championship, at some point you need to play the best teams. I’d rather play the best teams with the best possible lineup as opposed to getting an easier 1st round and head into the 2nd round with less bullets in my gun.

 

[dirty12]

If you are trying to win a championship, you want the best players in the playoffs.

We can agree that Wakely is the best player. No doubt. But, if rumours are accurate, he wouldn’t go to Kingston. So, does Kingston then pivot to the best available RIGHT NOW and call it a day? Or, do they wait for the best to become available? If they can add a stop gap OA for peanuts, similar to what Ottawa did last eyar with Lawrence for an 8th round pick, then I am all for it. Jsut replace him at the deadline. But, if they have to pay two 2nds, and a 3rd for another player of the calibre of Guindon only to pass up on (insert whatever name you want here) at the deadline for an additional 4th round pick added to the package, then yes, I do believe it is more valuable to wait.

Additionally, it gives the Front an opportunity to uncover a hidden gem in their lineup they either didn’t know they had or didn’t think would step up this quick. That alone may alter the decision on which OA is most valuable.

I understand your point regarding who they play makes a difference but if you are shooting for a Championship, at some point you need to play the best teams. I’d rather play the best teams with the best possible lineup as opposed to getting an easier 1st round and head into the 2nd round with less bullets in my gun.

After Wakely, Allard is arguably the best OA to become available for Kingston; and available now as far as I know. I think Allard would be a good 2-way player for Kingston on any line 1-3.

 

[OMG67]

After Wakely, Allard is arguably the best OA to become available for Kingston; and available now as far as I know. I think Allard would be a good 2-way player for Kingston on any line 1-3.

Personally, I think Kingston needs a pure scorer. They already have Guindon as their 2-way guy. Having two 2nd line centres isn’t going to get them anywhere they want to go. Wakely without a doubt would have been the difference maker they needed. I am not sure there will be another OA that comes available as a forward. I think they will more likley need to upgrade their defence with the OA slot and then look at the 19 year old scoring wingers for the scoring boost they need.

EDIT: Note Ben Pickle. He is a strong example where if a team makes a ton of moves early, a kid like Pickle ends up on the 4th line with no opportunity to show anything. If he continues to play well on the 3rd line with McNamara, that is potentially one less player they feel they need.

 

[frontsfan67]

Personally, I think Kingston needs a pure scorer. They already have Guindon as their 2-way guy. Having two 2nd line centres isn’t going to get them anywhere they want to go. Wakely without a doubt would have been the difference maker they needed. I am not sure there will be another OA that comes available as a forward. I think they will more likley need to upgrade their defence with the OA slot and then look at the 19 year old scoring wingers for the scoring boost they need.

EDIT: Note Ben Pickle. He is a strong example where if a team makes a ton of moves early, a kid like Pickle ends up on the 4th line with no opportunity to show anything. If he continues to play well on the 3rd line with McNamara, that is potentially one less player they feel they need.

Pickell is an 05. He’s just happy to be there after being cut from barrie a year or two ago he will be fine with 4th line mins

 

[OMG67]

Pickell is an 05. He’s just happy to be there after being cut from barrie a year or two ago he will be fine with 4th line mins

That’s not the point. The point is he is showing to be a capable 3rs line player. He can play top 9. If you aren’t in a situation where you need to play him in that role to see what he has, he never gets the opportunity.

Sometimes playing what you think are depth player in key roles, they step up and perform.

This is one of the reasons why you wait to acquire players because you need to first see what you have.

 

[frontsfan67]

That’s not the point. The point is he is showing to be a capable 3rs line player. He can play top 9. If you aren’t in a situation where you need to play him in that role to see what he has, he never gets the opportunity.

Sometimes playing what you think are depth player in key roles, they step up and perform.

This is one of the reasons why you wait to acquire players because you need to first see what you have.

I get it’s not the point however I think pickell getting reduced minutes won’t be the end of the world. He’s 19 he’s not going to get much better and he definitely will not be back next year. If they have to make a trade, they have to make an and not worry about what a 19 year old first year on the team player thinks. Now if this was Buttar playing like Pickell and he will be around in the future- I’d say don’t make a move but there’s a big difference between a 16year old and a 19year old development wise.that 16 year old has 3 years to develop into the player the 19 year old is.

 

[frontsfan67]

VERY frustrating weekend for the fronts 0/3 in OT.

They need to break up that second line clearly Battaglia soto and Hopkins isn’t working right now. Teams are catching on and as a result they aren’t producing and we are losing games- those are the guys that need to be scoring not guys like Ben Pickell no offence to him but my standards are not as high for him.

3 points is better than 0 points however they could’ve had potentially 4, 5, or even 6.

 

[dirty12]

Personally, I think Kingston needs a pure scorer. They already have Guindon as their 2-way guy. Having two 2nd line centres isn’t going to get them anywhere they want to go. Wakely without a doubt would have been the difference maker they needed. I am not sure there will be another OA that comes available as a forward. I think they will more likley need to upgrade their defence with the OA slot and then look at the 19 year old scoring wingers for the scoring boost they need.

EDIT: Note Ben Pickle. He is a strong example where if a team makes a ton of moves early, a kid like Pickle ends up on the 4th line with no opportunity to show anything. If he continues to play well on the 3rd line with McNamara, that is potentially one less player they feel they need.

Pickell on L4 with two rookies and able step up to L3 if needed is good thing, I think.
I was thinking Allard would be PK1, add speed and ~ppg to a checking as a LW/C with MacNamara that could play the dying minutes

 

[OMG67]

I get it’s not the point however I think pickell getting reduced minutes won’t be the end of the world. He’s 19 he’s not going to get much better and he definitely will not be back next year. If they have to make a trade, they have to make an and not worry about what a 19 year old first year on the team player thinks. Now if this was Buttar playing like Pickell and he will be around in the future- I’d say don’t make a move but there’s a big difference between a 16year old and a 19year old development wise.that 16 year old has 3 years to develop into the player the 19 year old is.

You are still missing the point. They may need to make a trade but they don’t need to make TWO…. Pickle represents as a player capable of playing top 9 minutes; therefore, you don’t need to find another one.

Additionally, if they want to add an OA, they need to make room for that player which likely means Hayes is the odd man out. That is a top 9 forward gone. Having Pickell doing what he is doing allows them the flexibility to make that type of move WITHOUT also having to add another forward to replace Hayes in the top 9. So, yes, it make a very big difference in approach and flexibility.

If Pickell continues to prove capable, the Fronts could go into the deadline looking for an OA upgrade on defence (replacing Hayes), and then add a scoring winger. The defence is better and the depth in the top 9 is unaffected.

 

[frontsfan67]

You are still missing the point. They may need to make a trade but they don’t need to make TWO…. Pickle represents as a player capable of playing top 9 minutes; therefore, you don’t need to find another one.

Additionally, if they want to add an OA, they need to make room for that player which likely means Hayes is the odd man out. That is a top 9 forward gone. Having Pickell doing what he is doing allows them the flexibility to make that type of move WITHOUT also having to add another forward to replace Hayes in the top 9. So, yes, it make a very big difference in approach and flexibility.

If Pickell continues to prove capable, the Fronts could go into the deadline looking for an OA upgrade on defence (replacing Hayes), and then add a scoring winger. The defence is better and the depth in the top 9 is unaffected.

They need a centre and a 1st/2nd pairing rhd man so they do need 2 trades. if pickell gets pushed out he gets pushed out