Kingston Frontenacs 2023-24 Season Thread (Part 2)

[ScoutLife4]

Savvy!

The only issue I have is we keep circling back to the acquisition of Schmidt. We need to remember that he would not have been an acquisition if not for Budnick demanding out of Kingston. Budnick was a +9 when he was traded. He was succeeding while the rest of the team was not. I am not calling the Schmidt/Budnick deal a wash but as I pointed out earlier, from mid-November (a couple weeks prior to the Schmidt addition), the Fronts are still regularly giving up 4+ goals per game. They gave up 10 goals over 3 games to a hobbling 67’s squad over the christmas break that had no business scoring any goals at all!

I have not seen anything to suggest the Kingston goal suppression has improved in any measurable way. They did nothing at the deadline that would suggest goal suppression will be improved. Dubois is a good player but one player will not make enough of a difference Over the half season.

Throw out anything any other team has done and simply only look at Kingston. There seems to be a lot of hope and prayer that things will simply come together. They acquired Chromiak on Nov 1. They acquired Schmidt (for Budnick) on Dec 12. The coaching change came around the last week of October. That was when the main difference happened. That and Chromiak happened pretty much at the same time. Things turned around then.

I can see Kingston run at around that .575 clip but their poor goal suppression will likely hurt their ability to be competitive against the top teams. This is still a good team. No doubt. Can it win the division? Yes it can. Is it likely at this point? Probably not.

I do agree that the team is probably better built to be successful in the playoffs. They do have a lot of guy that can lean on you. I think that is a very valid point. But, regular season goal suppression is not good. It is well below average. Not enough was done at the deadline to address it.

The part about Budnick is not really an accurate representation of what actually happened at all.
Budnick was very undisciplined both on and off the ice. He was taking an extreme amount of poorly timed penalties affecting the game. Budnick was regressing and not a coachable kid.
There were a couple off ice incidents that involved him being disciplined as well. Once he started to be held accountable by an actual proper Coach he shutdown and requested a trade.

 

[OMG67]

The part about Budnick is not really an accurate representation of what actually happened at all.
Budnick was very undisciplined both on and off the ice. He was taking an extreme amount of poorly timed penalties affecting the game. Budnick was regressing and not a coachable kid.
There were a couple off ice incidents that involved him being disciplined as well. Once he started to be held accountable by an actual proper Coach he shutdown and requested a trade.

It doesn’t matter what the reason is. It only matters that Schmidt wasn’t an addition to a vacant or under performing roster spot. You then have to look at it from the perspective of replacement value. What is the replacement value between Schmidt and Budnick?

This is one thing that I highlighted for Ottawa‘s transactions. The replacement value of the players coming in vs the ones they replaced was very significant. I cannot see (as an outsider) the replacement value between Schmidt and Budnick being exceptional. Sorry, I cannot see it. I there a positive replacement value? Yes. Of course. But how significant is it?

Dubois replaces Poole. I am assuming Ludwinski and Frasca will maintain their spots ahead of Dubois. So the replacement value between Dubois and Pool is perceived to be greater than the replacement value between Schmidt and Budnick. Adding Chromiak was also a good add from the perspective of replacement value. That is all I am saying.

I’m not saying you are doing this but many people look at player acquisitions and don’t consider replacement value. This is of particular value to factor in. There is a difference between a marginal upgrade and a complete game changer. This is why I pointed to Ottawa’s deals this deadline. The replacement value of the guys they added vs the guys they replaced was massive.

 

[ottsabrefan]

Apologies for the long winded post below but it takes some words to explain where I am coming from. Easier to do it this way than in five separate “Yeah, but what about…” Posts.


From my perspective, Kingston caught Ottawa on a three game stretch over the holiday break where they were hobbled. In all honesty, we were just about getting by with the roster we had the first half and even with that deficient roster, we still managed to win close games Because of solid goal suppression.

I’ve always said there are eight key positions that need to be filled competently. They don’t need to be elite in any way, but they do need to be filled by players capable of handling those positions. You need three centres, four D-Men and a starting goalie. Again, they don’t need to be great, just competent. Ottawa was running with One Centre, Three D-Men (two of them 17 years old), and the goalie. They did acquire Lawrence on the cheap early on but he really is a winger and a depth winger at that! the rest are what you consider depth pieces and your top 6 wingers. You do need some solid wingers but wingers aren’t key positions.

So, when Ottawa acquired the two pretty good centres and the top pairing D-Man this week, that completed the top 8 positions. What Ottawa did have is significant winger depth with talent. Guys with a varying skill set that can score. The top 5 wingers returned from last year accounted for 110 goals. The centres counted for 19. Our depth came from the wings. Now that we have the centres, we add all the goals that they will account for PLUS the wingers will have a centre so they can return to form. That is the point that was lost on the outsiders looking in.

Going into the Christmas break, Ottawa was 6 games above .500 with a deficient group. Kingston was 4 games above after the coaching change. I think those teams with no injuries were relatively close. Same with Oshawa and Brantford. When Ottawa made the three pretty big adds in the key positions and the other teams made one add and Brantford sold some pieces, I do feel the team that made the bigger additions combined with their elite starting goalie returning soon created a separation.

If Ottawa had only added Dubois, we’d be screwed. Royally. And I am not exaggerating. I would have agreed fully with the comments on here regarding Ottawa’s chances. However, I knew they would at minimum add the two centres and D-Man. It was more a matter of whether they were going to also add an impact Import. It did look like they were going to for a while yesterday. Looks like that deal fell through. Regardless, they did fill the remaining three key positions.

So, all that said, I do feel Ottawa is in the drivers seat. If they do not win the division, they will have no one to blame but themselves (barring significant injury). Some of that will depend on how much longer MacKenzie is out.

Playoffs? Errrr. I don’t know. They have a strong mix of players but not really heavy bodies. If they win the division and capture the #2 seed, I think they will be fine. Second round? 50-50 Maybe? Not sure. We will have to wait and see.

From a Kingston perspective, I don‘t feel you addressed your goal suppression in a meaningful way. The adds that were made earlier helped to reduce the goals against but even against a hobbled Ottawa team with one competent centre, you gave up 10 goals over three games. The other three games in that six game stretch, we scored 6 (Missy and NBx2).

If I were to ignore all the games through mid-Nov and only include games after the coaching change and Chromiac addition etc, Kingston will have surrendered 4+ goals in 11 games. If I take away the last six games for Ottawa and run through the first game of the season, Ottawa had 10 games with 4+ goals surredered. Ottawa’s stretch in that sample size was 30 games. Kingston’s stretch in that sample size was only 18. You can see from my perspective that even after the coaching change and the addition of Schmidt and Chromiac, Kingston still gives up too many goals.

Kingston has five key experienced players at 19 or 20 years old (Ludwinski, Dubois, Hemstrom, Schmidt and Holmes). Ottawa has seven (Kressler, Maillet, Gerrior, Stonehouse, MacKenzie, Mayer, and Mayich). Ottawa slants older in the key positions. For example, Kingston willbe strong next year with returning players. Ottawa? Ummmm, not so much. Ottawa graduate a lot of players.

This is why I don’t feel (post-deadline) Kingston and Ottawa are on the same tier. It would not be fair to place them on the same tier based on many of the metrics used to evaluate the leading indicators. If the expectation of Kingston fans is to win the division in light of the changes made at the deadline, I think it is unrealistic. I do agree that Kingston is right there with Oshawa and probably a half step ahead of Brantford. Brantford sold off Donovan and that will hurt them badly.

Again, apologies for the long post. This is my thought process on the topic. We will see how it all plays out.

I think we all would agree that Ottawa has addressed areas of concern and improved.

What is debatable seems to be how close were Kingston and Ottawa before those moves and how much does Kingston improve with Dubois.

Given how Kingston continues to get stronger with their new coach, new system and systematically making those moves throughout to address the D weaknesses, I believe Fronts fans felt that going into the deadline that Kingston was considerably better than Ottawa, which was also on display in the 5-1 record between the teams (which also consisted of a stretch when Kingston had issues and Ottawa didn’t).

So, with more additions at the deadline than Kingston, is Ottawa better than Kingston, and if so, a lot better? That we don’t know though I know your crystal ball says otherwise. I think it is too early to say those moves for the 67s pay off, and how much better the team will be, and how much the Fronts continue to improve with their gradual D additions and Dubois. All this to say, it needs to play out so saying the 67s are considerably ahead of the Fronts based on many metrics, seems silly at this point, especially with all the changes that have been made in both sides recently. Both teams are good and have made considerable efforts to address their weaknesses. Time will tell.

 

[Logosarejusttargets]

It doesn’t matter what the reason is. It only matters that Schmidt wasn’t an addition to a vacant or under performing roster spot. You then have to look at it from the perspective of replacement value. What is the replacement value between Schmidt and Budnick?

This is one thing that I highlighted for Ottawa‘s transactions. The replacement value of the players coming in vs the ones they replaced was very significant. I cannot see (as an outsider) the replacement value between Schmidt and Budnick being exceptional. Sorry, I cannot see it. I there a positive replacement value? Yes. Of course. But how significant is it?

Dubois replaces Poole. I am assuming Ludwinski and Frasca will maintain their spots ahead of Dubois. So the replacement value between Dubois and Pool is perceived to be greater than the replacement value between Schmidt and Budnick. Adding Chromiak was also a good add from the perspective of replacement value. That is all I am saying.

I’m not saying you are doing this but many people look at player acquisitions and don’t consider replacement value. This is of particular value to factor in. There is a difference between a marginal upgrade and a complete game changer. This is why I pointed to Ottawa’s deals this deadline. The replacement value of the guys they added vs the guys they replaced was massive.

Well none of it matters in the end because according to the people I sat near on both of the Saturday games in Ottawa, the only reason 67's lose is because of the refs like Reid and Beer -- apparently they are only ever calling penalties or bad penalties against the 67's.

 

[ottsabrefan]

The part about Budnick is not really an accurate representation of what actually happened at all.
Budnick was very undisciplined both on and off the ice. He was taking an extreme amount of poorly timed penalties affecting the game. Budnick was regressing and not a coachable kid.
There were a couple of ice incidents that involved him being disciplined as well. Once he started to be held accountable by an actual proper Coach he shutdown and requested a trade.

For OMG (can’t seem to quote his post)…but please tell me we aren’t basing Budnick playing great based solely on plus/minus! Budnick wasn’t playing any better than any other Dman that you would criticize. It was definitely a huge improvement to get Schmidt. One which is VERY similar to how you improved your centres.

As well, if we are digging deep into excuses the Fronts were without their number 2 Center for the first two months (Frasca). As you know, missing centres hurts the offence. Just thought I’d add that.

 

[nelli27]

Let me rephrase that for you….

”If the Petes make the playoffs, I will chew my left arm off live on the Internet.”

There you go. You are welcome!

Are you left handed?

 

[OMG67]

I think we all would agree that Ottawa has addressed areas of concern and improved.

What is debatable seems to be how close were Kingston and Ottawa before those moves and how much does Kingston improve with Dubois.

Given how Kingston continues to get stronger with their new coach, new system and systematically making those moves throughout to address the D weaknesses, I believe Fronts fans felt that going into the deadline that Kingston was considerably better than Ottawa, which was also on display in the 5-1 record between the teams (which also consisted of a stretch when Kingston had issues and Ottawa didn’t).

So, with more additions at the deadline than Kingston, is Ottawa better than Kingston, and if so, a lot better? That we don’t know though I know your crystal ball says otherwise. I think it is too early to say those moves for the 67s pay off, and how much better the team will be, and how much the Fronts continue to improve with their gradual D additions and Dubois. All this to say, it needs to play out so saying the 67s are considerably ahead of the Fronts based on many metrics, seems silly at this point, especially with all the changes that have been made in both sides recently. Both teams are good and have made considerable efforts to address their weaknesses. Time will tell.

You make the point that Ottawa didn’t have issues. They’ve had issues all season. They’ve been rolling with one top 9 Centre and one experienced top 4 D-Man. Mews and Marrelli are 17 years old and are or were counted on to anchor the blueline Supported by Mayich and a bunch of depth D-Men. We wee all pretty much clamouring for Chromiak when he was available and Uronen went down with a season ending injury.So, jsut as you are pointing to me missing the point regarding momentum on behalf of Kingston, you are also missing the point that this Ottawa team shouldn’t have been doing anything other than losing all season but they won. The reason? Twofold. First, they have goaltending. Second, they have a solid team structure. The two things that Kingston is searching for now. The difference is, Ottawa had those tow elements the whole time. We jsut didn’t have the horses to execute it. Now we have the horses. We now have the top 9, Top 4 and always had the goalie (when he returns from injury that is).

Well none of it matters in the end because according to the people I sat near on both of the Saturday games in Ottawa, the only reason 67's lose is because of the refs like Reid and Beer -- apparently they are only ever calling penalties or bad penalties against the 67's.

LOL,. Classic. Gotta love the fans that rag on refs like they affect the outcome one way all season. It is crazy talk of course. Ottawa benefits some games and is disadvantaged others. I think that is the same for all teams. Fans aren’t’ willing to acknowledge the games where they are advantaged. Silly really.

 

[OMG67]

More for OMG (can’t seem to quote his post) but please tell me we aren’t basing Budnick playing great based solely on plus/minus! Budnick wasn’t playing any better than any other Dman that you would criticize. It was definitely a huge improvement to get Schmidt.

Budnick had serious value as evidenced by his trade return. he went to a franchise that has strong management.

Are you suggesting Budnick is no better than below average replacement D-Men like say, Smyth or McGowan? That would be a pretty hot take form my perspective.

Are you left handed?

Gawd no! I would never risk my throwing arm!

 

[ScoutLife4]

For OMG (can’t seem to quote his post)…but please tell me we aren’t basing Budnick playing great based solely on plus/minus! Budnick wasn’t playing any better than any other Dman that you would criticize. It was definitely a huge improvement to get Schmidt. One which is VERY similar to how you improved your centres.

As well, if we are digging deep into excuses the Fronts were without their number 2 Center for the first two months (Frasca). As you know, missing centres hurts the offence. Just thought I’d add that.

Budnick is a 19 year old undrafted Dman with discipline issues that needed a fresh start.
He likely will struggle to stay in the league as an OA as he's not good enough to use the spot for.

Schmidt is an oversized NHL Drafted dman that can pretty much do it all, He defends well, Has a good shot, Plays disciplined and will stick up for his team mates as Kaleb Lawerence learned a couple weeks ago.

I think OMG needs to take into account Budnick likely wont make it through an OA year in the O.
So Kingston upgraded their D-man in Schmidt as an OA bringing in someone they could trust that fit their needs, moved out a 19 year old that wont be good enough in an OA roll. and also got a third round pick for free. -I'm not sure why their is questions or concern regarding the IN VS OUT on this upgrade at all.

 

[OMG67]

The whole concept of replacement value is huge. It is something that needs to be highlighted.

Every time a team adds a player, that player is inserted into the roster and it creates a ripple effect through the lineup and depth chart. If we consider a team having 14 important positions (9 forwards, 4 D-Men and a goalie), the replacement value is measured against the player that moves out of that group and into the group of 6 below them that comprise the 4th line, the bottom pair D-Men and backup goalie. Each of which get low minutes.

If a completely stacked team acquires the top player and the domino affect in the lineup pushes a point per game 19 year old centre from 3rd line centre to 4th line centre, what is the impact of that vs a team that acquires the same player but is moving a 16 year old .3 PPG centre tot he 4th line? Clearly the impact is greater for the team that replaced a 16 year old 1/3 point per game player.

Dubois pushed Poole out of the top 9 as a centre. I assume that is the case but if I am wrong, that’s fine. Could be Hmstrom or Hopkins depending on different factors that game. The point being that Kingston didn’t likely have a set top 3 centres. They rotated some guys in that they were less comfortable in. That acquisition is great when it comes to replacement value. It ensures Hemstrom can play the wing where he is better suited and Hopkins can slide back to the 4th line where he has more sheltered minutes. It is a win throughout the lineup.

I don’t view the Schmidt - Budnick situation in the same way. I don‘t feel it was as impactful as some suggest. To me, it is more of a better fit.

 

[ottsabrefan]

Budnick had serious value as evidenced by his trade return. he went to a franchise that has strong management.

Are you suggesting Budnick is no better than below average replacement D-Men like say, Smyth or McGowan? That would be a pretty hot take form my perspective.


Gawd no! I would never risk my throwing arm!

Agreed that the return was high. But Schmidt costs more based on the picks being close to a wash and Schmidt being an OA.

Budnick wasn’t playing great. I was shocked that the return was that high. I expected him to be a top 2 or top 4 Dman but he wasn’t playing great.

I think you underestimate McGowen. I would rather have him than Budnick and would have been quite upset if he was dealt. The guy hits, plays fearless, can skate like the wind and skates the puck out of the zone. But, had you said Uens, and not McGowen, I would have agreed that I would have preferred Uens to move over Budnick.

 

[OMG67]

Budnick is a 19 year old undrafted Dman with discipline issues that needed a fresh start.
He likely will struggle to stay in the league as an OA as he's not good enough to use the spot for.

Schmidt is an oversized NHL Drafted dman that can pretty much do it all, He defends well, Has a good shot, Plays disciplined and will stick up for his team mates as Kaleb Lawerence learned a couple weeks ago.

I think OMG needs to take into account Budnick likely wont make it through an OA year in the O.
So Kingston upgraded their D-man in Schmidt as an OA bringing in someone they could trust that fit their needs, moved out a 19 year old that wont be good enough in an OA roll. and also got a third round pick for free. -I'm not sure why their is questions or concern regarding the IN VS OUT on this upgrade at all.

When a team with the reputation of Guelph trades a 2nd and two 3rds for a bottom pairing d-Man with discipline and off ice issues that is not capable of playing as an OA, I think your assessment needs to be more measured agaisnt the Guelph organizations assessment of him more than mine To be honest.

Agreed that the return was high. But Schmidt costs more based on the picks being close to a wash and Schmidt being an OA.

Budnick wasn’t playing great. I was shocked that the return was that high. I expected him to be a top 2 or top 4 Dman but he wasn’t playing great.

I think you underestimate McGowen. I would rather have him than Budnick and would have been quite upset if he was dealt. The guy hits, plays fearless, can skate like the wind and skates the puck out of the zone. But, had you said Uens, and not McGowen, I would have agreed that I would have preferred Uens to move over Budnick.

I could not in all good conscience have stated Uens with a straight face. I think I would hav lost all credibility had I used him as a measuring stick. I said below average, not amongst the worst int he league level…

 

[ottsabrefan]

When a team with the reputation of Guelph trades a 2nd and two 3rds for a bottom pairing d-Man with discipline and off ice issues that is not capable of playing as an OA, I think your assessment needs to be more measured agaisnt the Guelph organizations assessment of him more than mine To be honest.



I could not in all good conscience have stated Uens with a straight face. I think I would hav lost all credibility had I used him as a measuring stick. I said below average, not amongst the worst int he league level…

I think Guelph traded for him based on potential and possibly what he was. He should have been a top 2 Dman this year and moved up the ladder, but he hadn’t played like a top pair Dman this year (or even top 4 at times). Is it in him? Yes. Would he have gotten there with Kingston? Not sure. Was he there now? Definitely not.

So, Guelph paid a high price believing they could get him to that level.

And in terms of your replacement value that is huge when you get a guy that is actually playing the way that the other player should have been playing, but isn’t.

 

[ScoutLife4]

When a team with the reputation of Guelph trades a 2nd and two 3rds for a bottom pairing d-Man with discipline and off ice issues that is not capable of playing as an OA, I think your assessment needs to be more measured agaisnt the Guelph organizations assessment of him more than mine To be honest.



I could not in all good conscience have stated Uens with a straight face. I think I would hav lost all credibility had I used him as a measuring stick. I said below average, not amongst the worst int he league levI

The first 9 games are already starting to tell the story.
9 games, 1 pt, 6 PIM, -3
He's taking less Penalties but not really contributing much.
Once he gets comfortable i wouldn't be shocked if the penalties will start to increase.

Schmidt - 8 games, 9PTS, even +/-
So yea, I'd question Guelph too.

 

[OMG67]

The first 9 games are already starting to tell the story.
9 games, 1 pt, 6 PIM, -3
He's taking less Penalties but not really contributing much.
Once he gets comfortable i wouldn't be shocked if the penalties will start to increase.

Schmidt - 8 games, 9PTS, even +/-
So yea, I'd question Guelph too.

It still doesn’t address replacement value. The Chromiak deal had a higher positive replacement value because you didn’t have a top 4. I can accept that Budnick’s performace wasn’t’ worth of top 4. Fine. But at the same time, after Schmidt was acquired, Kingston still gave up a lot of goals. 6 of 12 games with 4+.

The issue in Kingston isn’t the individual players. It is their ability to play the game as a team. Mann has done a pretty good job thus far. They may continue to improve but it is a work in progress. The kind of change they are making usually takes a full season and then you carry that into the next season. It is then where you start to see the full benefit of the hard work…especially a younger team like Kingston.

 

[ScoutLife4]

It still doesn’t address replacement value. The Chromiak deal had a higher positive replacement value because you didn’t have a top 4. I can accept that Budnick’s performace wasn’t’ worth of top 4. Fine. But at the same time, after Schmidt was acquired, Kingston still gave up a lot of goals. 6 of 12 games with 4+.

The issue in Kingston isn’t the individual players. It is their ability to play the game as a team. Mann has done a pretty good job thus far. They may continue to improve but it is a work in progress. The kind of change they are making usually takes a full season and then you carry that into the next season. It is then where you start to see the full benefit of the hard work.

Players that play as individuals make it impossible to play the game as team. (selfish players)
That's why several of the moves that have been made were made.

They are still working through this with Chris Thibodeau as well, He's so small that he gets bumped off the puck easy and has a habit of trying to do to much along the boards and gets knocked off the puck.
This team is setup to be pretty good next year.

Ottawa's additions got them closer to competing with Kingston, may of even made them better but Ottawa has a very soft team this season from what i have seen. -There's not a lot of physicality or toughness there and when teams come out physical they don't respond well to it.

 

[OMG67]

Players that play as individuals make it impossible to play the game as team. (selfish players)
That's why several of the moves that have been made were made.

They are still working through this with Chris Thibodeau as well, He's so small that he gets bumped off the puck easy and has a habit of trying to do to much along the boards and gets knocked off the puck.
This team is setup to be pretty good next year.

Ottawa's additions got them closer to competing with Kingston, may of even made them better but Ottawa has a very soft team this season from what i have seen. -There's not a lot of physicality or toughness there and when teams come out physical they don't respond well to it.

No softer than they were last season…. Showed int he playoffs but regular season play is different. Ottawa will pick up all the easy wins and will win a lot of the close games because of goal suppression. It will be the top 4-5 teams int he league they will potentially struggle against. They have seven games against teams that i think are better than they are. Three of them at home.

I think Kingston will have the same issues against the same teams. Kingston also has seven games against those teams. The difference will be on goal suppression against teams in the same tier (Missy, Oshawa, Brantford, OS, Guelph, Erie). This is where I believe Ottawa holds the upper hand with goal suppression and goal differential metrics. Their team system is superior when they have all hands on deck. If they get into significant injury trouble or MacK ends up out for a long period, then that is a disaster but other than that, it shouldn‘t be an issue.

Ottawa played at nearly .800 clip last year. We lost some players but with some of the new additions, the net loss in players is not nearly as bad as it would look at first glance.

 

[ktownfan]

Budnick is a piece that will help Guelph on their playoff run. He was a bit of a different guy to like off the ice, but he can add value and I think this is what guelph needed. Mcgowan is a 5-6 guy and if he plays smart is also a value guy

 

[Bra Wavers]

Let me rephrase that for you….

”If the Petes make the playoffs, I will chew my left arm off live on the Internet.”

There you go. You are welcome!

As a Petes' fan I'm looking forward to a lottery pick come April, but this statement may change my thinking

 

[OMG67]

As a Petes' fan I'm looking forward to a lottery pick come April, but this statement may change my thinking

LOL. Yes. I think it will be VERY unlikely for the Petes to manage to hold down a playoff spot. There is a chance but I think Niagara has a better roster right now. Thornton will make a big difference for them in net too. I am assuming he reports. I would not be surprised at all if Niagara passes them in the standings. I think Barrie will easily pass them.

 

[OMG67]

Tired of the ”My Dad can beat up your Dad“ conversation now.

Only thing left now is to prove it! Best of luck guys! I will be back in March with the “I told you so!” Mostly because that’s the kinda guy I am….

you guys are great BTW. Good convo. Productive and considerate/polite.

Oh, and so you know, I will be sacrificing a chicken before tomorrow’s first game for the 67’s post-deadline. Voodoo is helpful.

 

[ottsabrefan]

Tired of the ”My Dad can beat up your Dad“ conversation now.

Only thing left now is to prove it! Best of luck guys! I will be back in March with the “I told you so!” Mostly because that’s the kinda guy I am….

you guys are great BTW. Good convo. Productive and considerate/polite.

Oh, and so you know, I will be sacrificing a chicken before tomorrow’s first game for the 67’s post-deadline. Voodoo is helpful.

Best of luck to you guys as well, and your keyboard, which has no doubt taken a pounding in the last few days!

We’d expect nothing less than to hear back from you in March!

 

[frontsfan67]

Honestly Chromiak hasn't really impressed me - for someone who at times had been projected as a top 2 round pick, he hasn't really stood out in a way (not necessarily bad for a D man) and taking away his 5 point game, he's only got 6 points in 20 games in Kingston.

11 pts in 21 games as a third pairing d man on kingston for 80% of the games is very good numbers. His numbers will only increase as he gets bigger faster and stronger for next year. Next year he will be our second best d man after burns to start the year barring them getting a really good import d

Also about his numbers it’s important to note he doesn’t play much powerplay time at all. Only that one game with Schmidt. They often play burns, Schmidt, Holmes and even uens (for whatever reason LOL) above Chromiak on the powerplay. Which is where he would get some points I’m sure.

The point I am making is there was an opportunity cost for Schmidt and that was Budnick. That is far different than adding Schmidt for draft picks without moving Budnick. You cannot suggest adding Schmidt was a game changer when the cost to do so was essentially Budnick. That is mor eof a wash than it is an addition. It would be like the Leafs trading for Connor MacDavid and not highlighting the fact they traded Mathews to get him….

Schmidt has vastly improved our powerplay by the looks of it, has a point a game while playing a shutdown role, protects players etc. the only thing I’ll say budnick does better is blocking shots- he is without a doubt one of the best in the league at that and for the coaches polls I assume he will be up there again.

 

[frontsfan67]

No softer than they were last season…. Showed int he playoffs but regular season play is different. Ottawa will pick up all the easy wins and will win a lot of the close games because of goal suppression. It will be the top 4-5 teams int he league they will potentially struggle against. They have seven games against teams that i think are better than they are. Three of them at home.

I think Kingston will have the same issues against the same teams. Kingston also has seven games against those teams. The difference will be on goal suppression against teams in the same tier (Missy, Oshawa, Brantford, OS, Guelph, Erie). This is where I believe Ottawa holds the upper hand with goal suppression and goal differential metrics. Their team system is superior when they have all hands on deck. If they get into significant injury trouble or MacK ends up out for a long period, then that is a disaster but other than that, it shouldn‘t be an issue.

Ottawa played at nearly .800 clip last year. We lost some players but with some of the new additions, the net loss in players is not nearly as bad as it would look at first glance.

Ottawas goal suppression hasn’t been very effective vs kingston this year LOL. No way is Ottawa a different tier from kingston.

 

[leafs4life94]

Based on the scorer's sheet looks like Salajko getting the start tonight - smart decision and I hope they continue to rotate him more frequently against some of the weaker teams on the schedule.

Interestingly - McGowan not listed at all, they've got Williamson as the 6th D and Cavallin as the reserve.

11 pts in 21 games as a third pairing d man on kingston for 80% of the games is very good numbers. His numbers will only increase as he gets bigger faster and stronger for next year. Next year he will be our second best d man after burns to start the year barring them getting a really good import d

Also about his numbers it’s important to note he doesn’t play much powerplay time at all. Only that one game with Schmidt. They often play burns, Schmidt, Holmes and even uens (for whatever reason LOL) above Chromiak on the powerplay. Which is where he would get some points I’m sure.

His numbers are inflated though with the 5 point game against Peterborough - take that away and it's 6 in 20 which isn't nearly as impressive for where his NHL draft stock was at the start of the year. If he was a consistent 0.5 PPG I'd be ecstatic with that from a 3rd pair D, but his statline is a little deceiving with that first game after being cut from the WJC.

It could've just been inaccurate expectations but I was also hoping for a little more dynamicism from him.

I do agree though - it's a little odd that he doesn't get much PP time. I get having Schmidt/Holmes because they both have cannons, but it's tough to argue with their PP success considering it's 5th in the league, and first in the Eastern conference by over 3%.