Kingston Frontenacs 2023-24 Off-Season Thread (Part 4)

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beastintheeast

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Mar 27, 2013
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Pieniniemi confirmed sent back to Kingston by Pittsburgh today as expected.

Realistically if there was any chance he'd stick in the AHL I can't imagine they would've signed him so early.
This means that he needs a fair amount of training the good thing.

Hopefully, this is an omen that this team is going to do something good this year.

I just hope Springer does not go nuts and demand major trades.
 

frontsfan67

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Dec 3, 2022
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This means that he needs a fair amount of training the good thing.

Hopefully, this is an omen that this team is going to do something good this year.

I just hope Springer does not go nuts and demand major trades.
Was told early on they’re going for it. Think they’re going all out this year regardless of other teams adding too and a big rebuild year next year- trading valuable OA’s and building around the ‘09 group (2FRP- 3 when they trade Battaglia)
 

OMG67

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Was told early on they’re going for it. Think they’re going all out this year regardless of other teams adding too and a big rebuild year next year- trading valuable OA’s and building around the ‘09 group (2FRP- 3 when they trade Battaglia)

1726973867805.gif
 
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beastintheeast

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Was told early on they’re going for it. Think they’re going all out this year regardless of other teams adding too and a big rebuild year next year- trading valuable OA’s and building around the ‘09 group (2FRP- 3 when they trade Battaglia)
And yet people on here keep asking why the fan base is so low.

Cany anyone really sees this team, with the offense, goaltending, and defence, competing for first place.

Let me guess you are going to trade Buttar, MCuaig, Soto, Moore and all your picks next year and tghe year after for 5 ringers that will elevate this team to a championship at the deadline.

Desoto, a 2nd and a 3rd for player X
Buttar, MCCuaig and 4 picks 3 2nd round picks and a 3rf for Player Y and Z
trade picks for a so-so player
Then trade for 2 defencemen that will anchor your team using draft picks.

Yeah it is a great plan Sounds good

How did it work out in 2018

I actually think Helvig was a better goalie than Vaccari is
 

frontsfan67

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And yet people on here keep asking why the fan base is so low.

Cany anyone really sees this team, with the offense, goaltending, and defence, competing for first place.

Let me guess you are going to trade Buttar, MCuaig, Soto, Moore and all your picks next year and tghe year after for 5 ringers that will elevate this team to a championship at the deadline.
No lol why would they trade the young guys. They need to go young next year after having one of the oldest teams in the league this year. Every team has to rebuild. Atleast they’ll be going though a rebuild year with Mann and not Caputi.


No point in going for it next year when half the team is graduating including your top 2 d man- #1 centre (right now) and an NHL drafted goalie- if they went for it next year they would be worse off than this year. Best thing to do is restock the picks you use this year, go younger and push for 2026/27(manns last year with the team and the year the OHL gets to host the mem cup)


Soto however would be a coveted veteran some team would love and pay top dollar for. Same with McNamara
How did it work out in 2018
Went the furthest the teams ever been
I actually think Helvig was a better goalie than Vaccari is
Well I’d certainly hope so- helvig won goalie of the year, leads the franchise in wins, shutouts and games played.
 

beastintheeast

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No lol why would they trade the young guys. They need to go young next year after having one of the oldest teams in the league this year. Every team has to rebuild. Atleast they’ll be going though a rebuild year with Mann and not Caputi.
That is what you gave up in 18
No point in going for it next year when half the team is graduating including your top 2 d man- #1 centre (right now) and an NHL drafted goalie- if they went for it next year they would be worse off than this year. Best thing to do is restock the picks you use this year, go younger and push for 2026/27(manns last year with the team and the year the OHL gets to host the mem cup)

WHY DO YOU HAVE TO GO FOR IT AT ALL. This team should be looking at putting together a consistently entertaining and competitive team. Yes you may get a few more butts in seats for the last part of the season BUT you are gong to lose those butts and more next year when the team sucks. That was the probelm with the 19 team the 18-19 was pathetic.


Soto however would be a coveted veteran some team would love and pay top dollar for. Same with McNamara

Went the furthest the teams ever been

But what have they looked like since.
Well I’d certainly hope so- helvig won goalie of the year, leads the franchise in wins, shutouts and games played.
My point is do you see Vaccari as a star that can play in tough games like Helvig did
 

ScoutLife4

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Nov 28, 2023
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That is what you gave up in 18





But what have they looked like since.

My point is do you see Vaccari as a star that can play in tough games like Helvig did
I don't think anyone is going to argue that they see Vaccari as a star goalie someday.
It's great to see the 67s boys with a bit of confidence after beating Kingstons JR A squad though.

I also can't make much sense starting Vaccari 2 nights in a row on less the 24h hours rest in pre season.
 
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leafs4life94

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I don't think anyone is going to argue that they see Vaccari as a star goalie someday.
It's great to see the 67s boys with a bit of confidence after beating Kingstons JR A squad though.

I also can't make much sense starting Vaccari 2 nights in a row on less the 24h hours rest in pre season.
If I had to guess it's because they wanted to make sure Betts stayed healthy? I know he was hurt most of last year, plus it helps that Vaccari did the back to back quite often last year so unfortunately he's used to it.
 

frontsfan67

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That is what you gave up in 18
They went for it all the year before and ended up getting wright. Then a Covid year happened who knows what would’ve happened
But what have they looked like since.

My point is do you see Vaccari as a star that can play in tough games like Helvig did
I think it depends on defence which they need to improve.

I’ve seen vaccari win games that he shouldn’t have. If he can do it consistently is the big question
 

beastintheeast

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They went for it all the year before and ended up getting wright. Then a Covid year happened who knows what would’ve happened

I think it depends on defence which they need to improve.

I’ve seen vaccari win games that he shouldn’t have. If he can do it consistently is the big question
My point is that if you look at the teams that always at the top it is because the develop players and have a cosistent sysem that does not drain them causing the Kingston cycle.

It's not just about appeasing a few people. It's about building a strong, supportive fan base in our city.


Most families that are going to come out on a regular basis do so for entertainment. TBH most don't care about the M Cup.

They just want to know that when they renew their season tickets, the product on the ice is going to entertain them.

If you want to attempt to get to the cup then keep selling the future.

If Kingston wants to be considered a city with a good team and host the M Cup then develop a system that is not so obviously flawed
 

ScoutLife4

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Nov 28, 2023
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My point is that if you look at the teams that always at the top it is because the develop players and have a cosistent sysem that does not drain them causing the Kingston cycle.

It's not just about appeasing a few people. It's about building a strong, supportive fan base in our city.


Most families that are going to come out on a regular basis do so for entertainment. TBH most don't care about the M Cup.

They just want to know that when they renew their season tickets, the product on the ice is going to entertain them.

If you want to attempt to get to the cup then keep selling the future.

If Kingston wants to be considered a city with a good team and host the M Cup then develop a system that is not so obviously flawed
Not every team can be a London, Oshawa, Brantford , Peterborough and have continued success like they do.

I’d say the last couple seasons Cooper has been in learning mode trying to find his place and learn the league.
He has also had a AGM that’s been learning the league with him so the experience the last couple years combined with a budget / low experience coach like Caputi was not a good combination.

I think the learning phase is done and he likely needs to show some results now to the Springers.

Especially after convincing the Springers to pay Mann which was not easy from what i understand.
 
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frontsfan67

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Dec 3, 2022
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My point is that if you look at the teams that always at the top it is because the develop players and have a cosistent sysem that does not drain them causing the Kingston cycle.

It's not just about appeasing a few people. It's about building a strong, supportive fan base in our city.


Most families that are going to come out on a regular basis do so for entertainment. TBH most don't care about the M Cup.

They just want to know that when they renew their season tickets, the product on the ice is going to entertain them.

If you want to attempt to get to the cup then keep selling the future.

If Kingston wants to be considered a city with a good team and host the M Cup then develop a system that is not so obviously flawed
So you think it would be a better idea to waste the years of Soto, Battaglia, McNamara next year just to get a bottom 5 spot in the conference and go out in the first round? You think that is more logical rather than doing a full on rebuild around a bunch of 09s, a few decent 08’s? That is what’s best for the team and gives them the best shot at a championship which is every teams goal.

They can do those trades and still probably make the playoffs. Will they be a team making it on to the second round next year though? Absolutely not

would be better building around 08s, 09s and then not next year but the following season so 2026/2027 mem cup is in the OHL. Either go for it that year in Troy’s final year as coach or trade Hopkins get picks and push for the 2027/28 season when your 2/3 09 first round picks are 18 and guys like McQuaig, Kelly, Buttar are 19- Moore 20, weir 20 (if he doesn’t get drafted and is in the AHL by then)
 

beastintheeast

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Mar 27, 2013
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Not every team can be a London, Oshawa, Brantford , Peterborough and have continued success like they do.

I’d say the last couple seasons Cooper has been in learning mode trying to find his place and learn the league.
He has also had a AGM that’s been learning the league with him so the experience the last couple years combined with a budget / low experience coach like Caputi was not a good combination.

I think the learning phase is done and he likely needs to show some results now to the Springers.

Especially after convincing the Springers to pay Mann which was not easy from what i understand.

So you think it would be a better idea to waste the years of Soto, Battaglia, McNamara next year just to get a bottom 5 spot in the conference and go out in the first round? You think that is more logical rather than doing a full on rebuild around a bunch of 09s, a few decent 08’s? That is what’s best for the team and gives them the best shot at a championship which is every teams goal.

They can do those trades and still probably make the playoffs. Will they be a team making it on to the second round next year though? Absolutely not

would be better building around 08s, 09s and then not next year but the following season so 2026/2027 mem cup is in the OHL. Either go for it that year in Troy’s final year as coach or trade Hopkins get picks and push for the 2027/28 season when your 2/3 09 first round picks are 18 and guys like McQuaig, Kelly, Buttar are 19- Moore 20, weir 20 (if he doesn’t get drafted and is in the AHL by then)
From what I remember of Springer and yes he offered me a job looking after the mascot when they were at the M Center. He wants to make money. he wants to add value to his product.

There is prestige being the M Cup winner but can you buy a coffee at Tims with a M Cup ring.

People on here have complained about the lack of marketing and about the fact that the team is not a draw.

It should be it is the only real game in town for sports.

Why it isn't is because of the price location and the need for a consistent product.

Let's be honest with the Gens: Brampton, Barrie, and possibly Brantford all have good teams. The top 3 positions in the conf are filled.

Looking at this team it is not a contending team.

I understand that there are some people who think winning the M Cup is the be-all and end-all of a franchise's success.

I look at it from the perspective of the fan that puts his money down and wants to be entertained and see a consistent product.

Imagine that you loved a restaurant for 3 years it goes all out to build it's brand and get a 5 star rating. however, it only gets a 4 star, and the following year, the restaurant's food sucks because they are trying to reinvent the menu and have hired a new chef.

Would you still go to it.

If you want to get a fan base tht pays the money be it university, military corrections or the normal Joe you need to provide the people with an entertaining property.

You have to go back to what it was for many people when it was at the M Centre. It was Friday night hockey, cheering on the team as they won or as they fought (in the early years) . It was getting some of the Browns fries and coffee. It was meeting friends on a weekly basis to check in.

But it was knowing that in or lose the product on the ice was going to entertain you.

That doesn't happen with the 3 year rebuild.

FF
you are wrong you are not wasting anyone. These guys are here to develop into men, and some of them will be lucky enough to develop into good hockey players.

Next year, if you develop the players properly, you will not be a bottom 5 team. You will have a strong defence. Goaltending will be the same, and you will have great offence. I would suggest that next yers team if drafted and developed will be stronger than the on ice product you have ow minus Pie and possibly Burns
 

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