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Confirmed with Link: Kings aquire Bishop, 2017 5th rd pk for Budaj , Erik Cernak, 7th & cond pick

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BigKing said:
Should of clarified that I mean with the top picks, not 4th-7th rounders. To look at the 2nd round picks the past little bit here and be happy about it would take some mind tricks.

I know if you get x NHL players out of a draft, it is considered a success. Just because the Kings might squeeze out a couple of 4th liners in a single draft doesn't make it cool to consistently miss on 2nd rounders when those have often been the team's first choice in the draft due to trades.

Basically compounds losing the 1st round picks to trades.

As for this trade in particular, I get that it adds excitement and all and some people here are having visions of 2012 and '14 in regards to going on a late season tear.

I've seen this team live 27 times this season. I need more than one good win over Anaheim and a better back up goalie to get excited about being a buyer at the deadline.

If giving up Cernak--so soon after being drafted--for an impending UFA goalie is such an easy move to make, then it was a horrible pick.

Same goes for Zykov for Versteeg. With the seeming lack of top-end prospects in the system, continually missing on high or high-ish picks is a problem, no? Especially for a cap strapped team that needs some high performance from guys on ELCs.

I'm not expecting Simmonds and Toffoli with every 2nd round pick, but look at them since the Toffoli selection:

2011 - Gibson
2012 - No 2nd
2013 - Zykov (traded up)
2014 - McKeown (traded Vey to get pick); Lintuniemi
2015 - Cernak
2016 - Clague

Clague is the only exciting one because he hasn't had a chance to bust yet like the others. Not saying he will, but just saying it is still very early with him.

Just imagine if they could be as good in the 2nd round during these years as they have been in like the 4th, 5th and beyond. Exclude Clague because it is early on him and that is 0-5 on 2nd round picks. That's pretty rough when you factor in the position the Kings are in cap wise.
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Ok, but it's early for those other guys, too. How many people were calling Forbort a bust? Zykov may be on the opening lineup next year. McKeown isn't a stud but he got surpassed by absolute monster youth in Carolina's d-core. Cernak has developed slowly-ish but he's crossed the pond and dealt with a wrist injury. Clague looks very promising but it's early. Everyone hated that Gibson pick from the get-go though, that one I'll grant every day and twice.

I definitely get what you're saying with the top picks and I don't really disagree. My bigger problem with it is making trades for non-long-term fixes. I have zero problem (in theory, obviously it doesn't look like it's working out right now) with assets for a Gaborik and re-signing him or the Carter deal. The ones that chip away are the Versteegs (who I thought we should have signed), where they walk. To me, it's not problematic to give up a 2nd for a player because that's what you're hoping the second turns into anyway--the problem is letting that player walk.

And I'm not sure I agree with you re: picking so well late. Just because LaDue is likely to be better than Cernak doesn't mean Cernak was a bad pick. LaDue is likely to be better than 100 players picked before him, they're not bad picks. Jamie Benn, etc. But I agree with you on the 'conversion' rate in that those picks turned into players who walked. Though I have much less of an issue with it because of the context (trying for a cup).

Face Wash said:
Someone's gunna have to explain to me how Bishop makes the Kings a better offensive team. Obviously he shores up the team defensively a little bit more for the 10 games he might play for the Kings and asset-wise it was no big deal, but to use up most of your remaining cap space to get him when you didn't NEED him is still a little puzzling.
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He doesn't directly. MAYBE confidence but that's a stretch. but a #1 goalie for AT LEAST 5 games (10 on b2b) is important. The way DL put it is "no margin for error" so that takes away that excuse from the guys.
 
RJ-

Cernak is a bad pick, IMO, if it is that easy to move him two years after being drafted for a back up goalie rental on a flawed roster.

Now, maybe DL does a forward deal and they go on a run with this team. As a fan, I hope they catch lightning in a bottle again. Just as far as the Cernak pick goes, they are already sour enough on him to flip him for what seems like a very low chance at making a significant run.

This all seems like a mandate from ownership that missing the playoffs is unacceptable. Wouldn't blame them with the amount of cash they are spending on this roster.
 
Look at it this way, if Vegas signs Bishop during the pre-expansion draft UFA negotiating period on June 17-20, (draft results announced on the 21st) then the Kings will not lose anyone in the expansion draft that are part of next year's team or lose a potential asset to trade in the off-season.
 
Maybe DL found his old magic

He will sign Bishop, make a deal with Vegas to take Gabby in the draft, then trade Bishop to Vegas for a late pick or defensive bottom pairing depth.
 
BigKing said:
RJ-

Cernak is a bad pick, IMO, if it is that easy to move him two years after being drafted for a back up goalie rental on a flawed roster.

Now, maybe DL does a forward deal and they go on a run with this team. As a fan, I hope they catch lightning in a bottle again. Just as far as the Cernak pick goes, they are already sour enough on him to flip him for what seems like a very low chance at making a significant run.

This all seems like a mandate from ownership that missing the playoffs is unacceptable. Wouldn't blame them with the amount of cash they are spending on this roster.
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I don't like that logic. If that's the case, Colin Miller was a bad pick. Hudson Fasching was a bad pick. I mean, I sort of get what you're saying--Cernak didn't make himself indispensable--but we don't know the circumstances. Could be as easy as TB really had their sights set on him. Maybe they did sour on him. Maybe they didn't want to wait around for him because of LaDue. Etc. I don't think the only conclusion is "Cernak is a waste," imo.

I do fully agree with you on the last part--though I think the next move, if there is a next move, will tell us a lot about what the organizational mandate is. I.e. if we move significant assets for a rental forward.
 
If the prospect was used to better your team, it's not a bad pick.

A bad pick is someone like Joey Ryan at 48th overall. That's a BAD PICK.

Couldn't trade him, didn't set foot on NHL ice, let alone AHL ice for the Kings.

That's an awful pick.
 
damacles1156 said:
If the prospect was used to better your team, it's not a bad pick.

A bad pick is someone like Joey Ryan at 48th overall. That's a BAD PICK.

Couldn't trade him, didn't set foot on NHL ice, let alone AHL ice for the Kings.

That's an awful pick.
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I agree.

I don't think Cernak was a bad pick. I just think Lombardi is failing to address organizational needs and is making a desperation run for the playoffs AGAIN.
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
I don't like that logic. If that's the case, Colin Miller was a bad pick. Hudson Fasching was a bad pick. I mean, I sort of get what you're saying--Cernak didn't make himself indispensable--but we don't know the circumstances. Could be as easy as TB really had their sights set on him. Maybe they did sour on him. Maybe they didn't want to wait around for him because of LaDue. Etc. I don't think the only conclusion is "Cernak is a waste," imo.

I do fully agree with you on the last part--though I think the next move, if there is a next move, will tell us a lot about what the organizational mandate is. I.e. if we move significant assets for a rental forward.
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But Miller and Fasching were traded for much different players and under different circumstances than Cernak.

Also were not the Kings first selection in the draft.
 
damacles1156 said:
If the prospect was used to better your team, it's not a bad pick.

A bad pick is someone like Joey Ryan at 48th overall. That's a BAD PICK.

Couldn't trade him, didn't set foot on NHL ice, let alone AHL ice for the Kings.

That's an awful pick.
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Not to rub salt in the wound but Lucic was taken at 50th overall.
 
It is already know, what are conditions for the conditional draft pick?

There was talk, that is too complicated. But im sure, it is not so complicated, that we cant understand it.
 
Knight of the Realm said:
I hope Bishop doesn't lay an egg tomorrow against Calgary. No pressure man.
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Loved having fiery Quick back yesterday, but I'm looking forward to seeing what Bishop can do tonight. Minnesota-Kings games used to be snoozefests, but we got an exciting game yesterday. Should be a good one against Calgary tonight. It's going to be a long summer, but today we get another day of Kings hockey.

Game night!

 
BigKing said:
But Miller and Fasching were traded for much different players and under different circumstances than Cernak.
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Maybe they were better prospects then, than Cernak is now?

Also were not the Kings first selection in the draft.
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How does that inherently matter? If the first pick was in the 7th round, would you expect that guy to be good because he was the team's first pick?
 
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