Kent Hughes & Jeff Gorton General Discussion Thread - The Honeymoon Is Over

[salbutera]

Lapointe and Bobrov are both clowns.
Nothing changed.

The trade deadline was perfect and yet the overall draft like i explained in the other trade has been completely awful in my regards.

No vets traded. Traded a def who was getting better to a center struggling for 3 years. Picked a fast player with no hands as 1st OA. Would rather picked Cooley or Nemec at this point.

Wow the bitterness..

 

[Takeru]

Not sure yet.....they do want a quick turnaround though and not a strong rebuild....that is obvious

Kind of seems like it.

One caveat is those are not exactly the most surefire moves for a quick turnaround.
Plus we still have a looooong way to go.
Even with Slaf/Dach in next season, which probably make our offense more well rounded, we're still lacking decent D and goaltending.

The day they start signing complimentary UFAs long term or trading for rentals will be the day the rebuild is considered over in their mind. We'll see how soon we get there....

 

[The Last Red]

We will have a top 5 pick next year too, I'm pretty confident of that.

 

[WinterLion]

I really like Bobrov! He's obviously smart and thoughtful. I think he and Lapointe will make a good tandem. That was a really interesting draft. Learned a lot about the direction the team is headed.

Yet he's the GM who finally picked Caufield.

and made Suzuki the key part of his most important trade.

We will have a top 5 pick next year too, I'm pretty confident of that.

I would say top 10, but yes... it will be another good pick. Plus who knows what happens with the FLA pick.

 

[Nedved]

I don't know.

If just Slaf and Dach deliver we've improved immensely and we'll be calling Hugo geniuses. You have two huge fast and skilled forwards. How can you go wrong? Well, let me tell you. Dach does his best imitation of KK and never progresses and Slaf becomes a mirage.

Hugo gambled and gambled big. I think they're trying to build The Avs north. I'm divided. I don't know if they fleeced or were fleeced.

I just don’t see game changing talent or guys you build around. Wright offered The closest thing to a franchise Center. Feels like over thinking it, but I’m probably wrong and I hope I’m wrong, and I see why we traded for Dach. I also had the identical feeling about Gomez and drouin trade though too.

i think we need, not want, to be bottom 3 next year.

 

[DAChampion]

One might argue that this is a tanking draft, as none of these moves will improve the team next year. In contrast, drafting Wright and keeping Romanov would have.

I guess they can get another top-5 pick next year, and maybe trade Petry and Dvorak for picks at next year's draft.

 

[Hacketts]

Lapointe and Bobrov are both clowns.
Nothing changed.

The trade deadline was perfect and yet the overall draft like i explained in the other trade has been completely awful in my regards.

No vets traded. Traded a def who was getting better to a center struggling for 3 years. Picked a fast player with no hands as 1st OA. Would rather picked Cooley or Nemec at this point.

I believe your avatar needs a changing.

 

[Takeru]

There's no way this team is finishing above Toronto, Tampa, Boston (with Bergeron returning) or Ottawa in our own division and I think, depending on what Detroit and Buffalo do.. unlikely we pass them either.

We've got a bottom 10 finish coming up unless Dach and Slaf are hitting 60 pts next year.,

Even if they do, with our D, we'd need 2014-15 Price all season to hope for anything above bottom 10

 

[yianik]

I have watched Hughes give several interviews/ PCs and he talks a lot about how players answer his questions and he puts a lot of value in it.

I was just thinking if he is being a bit of an egg head and getting too cerebral about things. When he talked about Dach he said they spoke to people around Chicago to get an idea of how Dach thinks etc. Well I mean swell, and interviews are important, but what about other stuff ?

 

[Takeru]

One might argue that this is a tanking draft, as none of these moves will improve the team next year. In contrast, drafting Wright and keeping Romanov would have.

I guess they can get another top-5 pick next year, and maybe trade Petry and Dvorak for picks at next year's draft.

That's kind of the way I interpret it. Not a clear win at forward right away (though with mid term potential) and our D got even worse (who thought such a thing was possible)

The hope is they'll be patient and not force Slaf to the NHL right away to his detriment.
And consider the best place to play Dach (2-3 C or in Laval, if at all possible).

 

[Suzuki x 14]

Mesar prefers playing center.

No he doesnt.
He said last night, I played C when I was younger but I prefer wing now and think my game is better suited for the wing.

 

[morhilane]

No he doesnt.
He said last night, I played C when I was younger but I prefer wing now and think my game is better suited for the wing.

I read he said the exact opposite thing last night.

 

[bopeep]

It sure seems like it. A lot of the draft went against what HUGO stand for.

It was exactly like a Bergevin draft.

The thing is, I actually liked the Habs draft years 2018 - 2021; I thought there were some astute selections and a perceived direction shift from years prior. In those 4 drafts, it seemed as though a couple of the picks at a minimum would eventually become NHL players - not necessarily impact players, mostly due to draft position - though a number of top 9 forwards / 3 - 7 dmen.

 

[Saxon]

I have watched Hughes give several interviews/ PCs and he talks a lot about how players answer his questions and he puts a lot of value in it.

I was just thinking if he is being a bit of an egg head and getting too cerebral about things. When he talked about Dach he said they spoke to people around Chicago to get an idea of how Dach thinks etc. Well I mean swell, and interviews are important, but what about other stuff ?

But the person selling me the car said it was in good shape .......

 

[Heffyhoof]

Way too many people obsessed with being right, don't even want to make the pun because it's honestly kinda gross at this point.

 

[Takeru]

I almost fainted when Bobrov sais it’s hard to find C’s that play the right way, a 200 feet game… geeeezzzzzussss Shane Wright and Cooley were right there….

To be fair, he mentioned other things as well: all the little things well, take care of business in big moments.

Looks like they weren't impressed enough by those two in these regards... whether they were right is another story though

 

[Suzuki x 14]

I read he said the exact opposite thing last night.

I just went back to listen again, he 100% said he played C younger but last 2 years was moved to the wing and his game right now against men is suited for the wing

 

[dcyhabs]

He also had an obsession with size though (Tinordi, McCarron, Kassian, Bourque)

It didn't start with him, the habs have picked a lot of big guys who didn't work out. Beaulieu, Stevenson, Komisarek, and Hainsey are probably their best big guys picked first since 1980. No stars, but acceptable players for a while.

So many failures: Wilkie and Juulsen were injured, but Pederson, Vallis, Bilodeau, Brown, Ward, Chouinard, Chipchura, Fischer, Tinordi and McCarron were their other top picks 6'2 and over. The "if he can fix his hockey playing we'll have a big hockey player" drafting strategy hasn't done very well.

Hmm, Sergachev was bigger than that, so at least they got one right. Jury is out on Mailloux and Slafkofsky, hope they have turned a corner.

 

[Takeru]

I have watched Hughes give several interviews/ PCs and he talks a lot about how players answer his questions and he puts a lot of value in it.

I was just thinking if he is being a bit of an egg head and getting too cerebral about things. When he talked about Dach he said they spoke to people around Chicago to get an idea of how Dach thinks etc. Well I mean swell, and interviews are important, but what about other stuff ?

My two cents:
I wouldn't read too much into it. You don't want to give away too much intel in those interviews.

Let's say he says, "We got that player because we identified X/Y/Z that other teams didn't". Then he just gave away his strategy and what's valuable to him and opposing teams will not underrated players they deal to him.
Going with general statements about interview implies they've done background check, while keeping the most important cards close to his vest.

But he might also just overvalue those interviews, being a former agent and all. We'll find out soon enough.

 

[sampollock]

Next Petry
Maybe at the trade deadline.

 

[Mackiaveli]

Not sure yet.....they do want a quick turnaround though and not a strong rebuild....that is obvious

I would argue strong rebuilds are predicated around teams with little to no prospects in the cupboards. Something like we will see out of Washington or Pittsburgh in 3-5 years. Montreal has been in "half-rebuild" mode for a few years now, but this year we saw a bunch of impactful additions.

For Montreal, coming into this draft we had

In the NHL:
Romanov (will miss him) - Top 4D - 22 years old
Caufield - Future 40 goal scorer - 21 years old
Suzuki - Legitimate 1C - 23 years old (as of next month)

NHL Ready:
Harris - likely NHL talent - T4D - 22)
Guhle - likely NHL star (T4D) - 20
Barron - NHL ready prospect - T4D - 20

Future NHLers:
Mailloux - likely NHLer in next 2 years (T4D) - 19
Xhekaj - likely NHLer in next 2 years (T4D) - 21
Roy - likely NHLer in next 2 years (Middle 6 forward) - 18
Kidney - likely NHLer in 2-3 years (Middle 6 winger) - 19
Mysak - likely NHLer in 2-3 years (Middle 6 winger) - 20
Farrell - likely NHLer in 3 years (Middle 6 forward) - 20

We had 4 NHL ready guys U22, and thus one needed to go. Romanov was the correct choice given what he could return, with Guhle being likely the most valuable asset but also the one with the most upside.
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Wright was definitely my pick, and until I saw two other teams passed on him felt like we might have made a mistake. There's something more to that situation that we obviously don't know as outsiders.

Slaf gives us something desperately missing in our prospect pool aside from Tuch - a power forward. Dach also fills the same void by giving us a big body who has skills and tons of potential. Mesar, Beck and Hutson join a group that is already pretty deep.

Going into next season, even if Slafkovsky spends time in the AHL, our team will have 3 forward and 3 defencemen who are U23 and all who have big upside. If the Habs manage to add a top 5 pick next year, they will have the prospect core to build for years of deep playoff runs. Moving Dvorak, Anderson or Petry during the season likely yields a more fruitful return than doing it at the draft when our team already loaded up this draft.

I think the Habs will be competitive as early as 2023-2024. If two of Barron/Guhle/Harris can develop into solid Top 4 guys, Slafkovsky pans out, and Dach revitalizes his career, the Habs are in really really good shape, and all of those players are capable of being impactful as early as this season or the next.

 

[Gustave]

To be fair, he mentioned other things as well: all the little things well, take care of business in big moments.

Looks like they weren't impressed enough by those two in these regards... whether they were right is another story though

Your comment is true yes. What makes me pause is that he went out of his way to say, just like Bergy, that getting C’s that have all the traits said above are almost impossible to get.

But when presented with the possibility to take the top 2 C’s, he balks? But Owen beck fits the bill though… I’m really hoping that Slaf becomes the Jagr Ovy quality that his fans say he is. Even though both of them were already a finished product that came in and dominated right away. Because we stopped short of getting that elusive 200 feet right way centerman.

 

[Mackiaveli]

When he talked about Dach he said they spoke to people around Chicago to get an idea of how Dach thinks etc. Well I mean swell, and interviews are important, but what about other stuff ?

Anecdotally, the most successful competitors I have seen (in team based stuff) are the ones who are solid between the ears. A player who can think at a high level (not even just the game, but in general) will usually have a more successful and fruitful career ... being a good teammate, being able to break out of slumps, being able to show humility to improve your weak areas, acknowledging your shortcomings so you can improve upon them etc.

I think the big reason they went Slaf over Wright had to do with something between the ears. Slaf seems very charismatic in a way I never really got from Wright. One feels like they are speaking from their heart, and the other from the hockey handguide for talking to the press. The on-ice product is only one component of a player; and you can see that the most successful stars in the NHL are ones with robust personalities, otherworldly talent, or something in between. You really need that swagger but it needs to read as confidence as opposed to conceitedness, and I think while Slaf's reads as the former, Wright clearly rubbed people the wrong way.

 

[Takeru]

Next Petry
Maybe at the trade deadline.

More likely during this summer I'd say.

Good thing either way, let's go grab those sweet 23 1st rounders !

 

[Jee]

They kept mentioning that the main profile they were looking for in this draft was players who play the right way, yet they passed on Wright, who is exactly that. I don't understand.

Also, Nick Bobrov is a very good speaker, love having him at the table. Lapointe on the other hand, feels like I'm hearing Bergevin when he speaks, it's horrible. We need to move from him IMO.