Speculation: Kaliyev trade...

[GoldenBearHockey]

Come on I was only teasing. I doubt anyone here is really sour about letting Amadio go. Its just he isnt the only one there is a long line of mishandling here

I keep asking...who? Kaliyev is the only one who MIGHT fit into that

I agree but that’s where GM’s need to get creative… as a hypothetical swap
Kaliyev for Sang. Maybe both get the needed fresh start. I accept there needs to be a deal out there somewhere for any asset and it’s not as easy as some seem to think. However I find it hard the believe they couldn’t have done a struggling prospect swap with Bjornfot for example, a year ago, given he was deemed valuable to be claimed off waivers twice. I wouldn’t expect a 1st back a year ago, but they could have gotten something.

Waivers twice, by the last few teams, meaning 26 plus other teams passed on him for free....

 

[theMajor]

Yea some get lucky and get drafted by a team that puts them in the top 6 with Malkin or Crosby like Rust.
Others get drafted by LA and put on the 4th line with Matt Luff.

or play 5 shifts a game with lizzo/lewis. the kings really mismanaged Kaliyev this season in particular and i think it had a negative impact on him mentally. his transition game is awful as hes not a fast skater but he was top on the team in GF/60 based on his ice time. this team has a habit of neutering goal scorers by forcing them to fit a system instead of working to their strengths. i was a little bit hopeful that hiller would see things differently but i have a nagging feeling he feels the same way todd did and kaliyev is just not in the picture anymore. watch him get traded and put up 30 goals with a coach who uses him the right way

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

or play 5 shifts a game with lizzo/lewis. the kings really mismanaged Kaliyev this season in particular and i think it had a negative impact on him mentally. his transition game is awful as hes not a fast skater but he was top on the team in GF/60 based on his ice time. this team has a habit of neutering goal scorers by forcing them to fit a system instead of working to their strengths. i was a little bit hopeful that hiller would see things differently but i have a nagging feeling he feels the same way todd did and kaliyev is just not in the picture anymore. watch him get traded and put up 30 goals with a coach who uses him the right way

Except this is wrong as well, he didn't start off that way, he PLAYED his way there,

October - Averae Ice time - 14:21
November Average Ice Time - 14:07
December - 12:47
January - 11:19
February - 10:08
March - 6:58

He was put in a position to show he belonged and he could not do that.

If by mismanage, you mean they lost faith in him, sure.....

 

[kilowatt]

Yea he wasnt very good. But looking back at his time here he played mostly with Torrey Mitchell, Andreoff, Wagner, Luff and late NHL career Clifford.
So pretty much played with AHLers on a 4th line after he spent his whole life as a goal scorer.

Amadio played 168 games for LA. Kaliyev has played 188. In that time frame, Amadio played 188 minutes on the power play while Kaliyev played 194. Amadio was actually given more power play opportunities on a per game basis than Kaliyev.

I’m not sure you can argue that Kaliyev was given much more of a chance than Amadio was, given most of Kaliyev’s games have been spent on the fourth line with Lizotte.

 

[Surf Nutz]

Come on I was only teasing. I doubt anyone here is really sour about letting Amadio go. Its just he isnt the only one there is a long line of mishandling here

I wouldn't count Amadio as a mishandled.

He came into the league , learned, adapted and was given an appropriate role on an overcompensated newer franchise at the right time.

Good for him.

I think Bjornfot will never make it and go home to Europe.

I would like to see Kaliyev given a shot at redemption but Blake and Hiller seems to be burnt bridges.

Regardless, there is a shipload of decisions to make and more players may be lost to waivers.

The Kings roster has been backed into a corner and has little space to pivot away from the walls.

 

[theMajor]

Except this is wrong as well, he didn't start off that way, he PLAYED his way there,

October - Averae Ice time - 14:21
November Average Ice Time - 14:07
December - 12:47
January - 11:19
February - 10:08
March - 6:58

He was put in a position to show he belonged and he could not do that.

If by mismanage, you mean they lost faith in him, sure.....

he was getting regular 2nd line minutes early on and Tmac was going to bat for him in the media. Arty played okay up until december which was when PLD was shifted up and down the lineup and just before the team shit the bed in january - hes been a sub 10 minute guy since then. idk if its his attitude thats bad or if its compete level or what. i guess its fair to say that he played his way there (though he wasnt really given much chance to succeed this year) but i absolutely believe he will be very good on a team that doesnt force him to play a 1-3-1 style or with a coach that knows how to use his strengths. hes only 22 fwiw

 

[tny760]

Amadio played 168 games for LA. Kaliyev has played 188. In that time frame, Amadio played 188 minutes on the power play while Kaliyev played 194. Amadio was actually given more power play opportunities on a per game basis than Kaliyev.

I’m not sure you can argue that Kaliyev was given much more of a chance than Amadio was, given most of Kaliyev’s games have been spent on the fourth line with Lizotte.

and kaliyev's pp minutes have been

a) with sean durzi who (literally) refused to pass to him
b) <30 seconds on pp2 where they fail to even enter the zone

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

These guys are gonna sign Toffoli and Amadio and trade Kaliyev and Spence

 

[Seattle King]

These guys are gonna sign Toffoli and Amadio and trade Kaliyev and Spence

4D Chess grandmasters, our front office is.

 

[johnjm22]

Kaliyev botched a lot of his scoring chances.

Classic case of a guy "gripping his stick too tight".

He never could get into a groove, but I absolutely believe he's capable.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

Kaliyev botched a lot of his scoring chances.

Classic case of a guy "gripping his stick too tight".

He never could get into a groove, but I absolutely believe he's capable.

That happens when you bench a guy for 12 minutes at a time then send him out for a dzone faceoff with 4th liners/3rd pairing and say "score and we MIGHT let you play again later"

 

[AbsentMojo]

Either the Kings drafted poorly or developed poorly with Kaliyev and the other 2 top 3 2019 picks... either way they get an F overall. Would love to see an alternate reality with someone other then BLuc/Koala regime and process with the same players.

 

[MonkeysUncle]

Either the Kings drafted poorly or developed poorly with Kaliyev and the other 2 top 3 2019 picks... either way they get an F overall. Would love to see an alternate reality with someone other then BLuc/Koala regime and process with the same players.

Unfortunately doesn't seem like it will change as management thinks they are in doing things the right way and it's on the players and not them. It would be interesting to see Mark Yannetti Draft for let's say a Dallas or Carolina and see what happens after.

 

[JJDrums]

Either the Kings drafted poorly or developed poorly with Kaliyev and the other 2 top 3 2019 picks... either way they get an F overall. Would love to see an alternate reality with someone other then BLuc/Koala regime and process with the same players.

Completely agree ... with all the misses .. is it drafting or development? When was the last time the Kings' scouting department found a jem? or when they draft highly rated players, the last one they developed into an above average NHLer?

 

[Lt Dan]

Completely agree ... with all the misses .. is it drafting or development? When was the last time the Kings' scouting department found a jem? or when they draft highly rated players, the last one they developed into an above average NHLer?

Matt Roy had to be described as a gem 7th rounder in to a serviceable dman

Spence was a 4th and might turn in to a gem

We will see how he develops, but Laferriere in the 3rd might end up being one

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

They would never know if they had a gem because they'd never play them before they went somewhere else to succeed.

It's development, deployment. Drafting is at worst above average with some of the best NHL placement/games-played of any franchise in the last 15 years, especially with late round picks.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

They would never know if they had a gem because they'd never play them before they went somewhere else to succeed.

It's development, deployment. Drafting is at worst above average with some of the best NHL placement/games-played of any franchise in the last 15 years, especially with late round picks.

Again, this is FALSE....

Name someone.....who HAD to go elsewhere to succeed.....

 

[King'sPawn]

They would never know if they had a gem because they'd never play them before they went somewhere else to succeed.

It's development, deployment. Drafting is at worst above average with some of the best NHL placement/games-played of any franchise in the last 15 years, especially with late round picks.

And to combine this with Lt Dan's post above... people say "how can you say they have development issues when they've returned players like Roy and Spence?"

Not everyone benefits from the same curriculum. Some benefit from the slow boil approach. Others don't.

It's like a classroom that focuses on lectures. There are students who "get it." Others are visual learners. Some need more "hands on" for things to click.

Plenty of failed schools and teachers blame the students for not learning concepts the one way they are being taught. Somehow we forget that learning is an ongoing process that continues into adulthood.

 

[damacles1156]

When you have Veterans littering the Lineup, you have to PLAY your way into a successful role. Just about every NHL team does this because coaches get fired when they don't show progress or win.

It's rare for a GM to override a coach and say "You have to play X player or else"

Arthur so far has not been able to do this, it's a shame because he does have talent.

 

[Schmooley]

When you have Veterans littering the Lineup, you have to PLAY your way into a successful role. Just about every NHL team does this because coaches get fired when they don't show progress or win.

It's rare for a GM to override a coach and say "You have to play X player or else"

Arthur so far has not been able to do this, it's a shame because he does have talent.

He didnt play worse than PLD. Laferriere had a long leash and I think dragged the numbers of any line he was on a little bit.
Danault was not good for a stretch of the year. Fiala at one point in the year was turning it over leading to goals against so much he got benched but only once.
Kaliyev did himself no favors but there is a big double standard here with the consequences for playing poorly. Thomas looked better than anyone on the bottom line and couldnt get on the roster. Vilardi had to spend a year in the minors while Tmac played worse players.

 

[Lt Dan]

Again, this is FALSE....

Name someone.....who HAD to go elsewhere to succeed.....

Johnny Brodzinksi
Michael Amadio

And to combine this with Lt Dan's post above... people say "how can you say they have development issues when they've returned players like Roy and Spence?"

Not everyone benefits from the same curriculum. Some benefit from the slow boil approach. Others don't.

It's like a classroom that focuses on lectures. There are students who "get it." Others are visual learners. Some need more "hands on" for things to click.

Plenty of failed schools and teachers blame the students for not learning concepts the one way they are being taught. Somehow we forget that learning is an ongoing process that continues into adulthood.

Post of the year right here

 

[Steve Zissou]

Johnny Brodzinksi
Michael Amadio

Erik Černák

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Johnny Brodzinksi
Michael Amadio


Post of the year right here

Amadio had success in Toronto and Ottawa right?

Brodiziski....we may have different definitions of success lol

Erik Černák

Cernak for sure, he didn't HAVE to go anywhere, he was traded.....you can argue it was a shitty trade (it was) but he was used as an asset, to gain something.

 

[RayMartyniukTotems]

I'm maybe the biggest Kaliyev guy on here but he was given opportunities to "be fed" and his best attribute, his shot, has completely failed him for a bit now.

People wanted Toffoli run out of here when he went ice cold but Bowlby was actually smart enough to wait and Toffoli found his game again.

They should do the same here. They aren't getting anything for him at this point so the smart move would be for both parties to reconcile and go for it next season. If he really wants out, let him know that playing better will help that: Kings just need to play him.

And where do they play Kaliyev...LWing? He's a Natural RWinger and he's going to play with Dubois,Kopitar or Danault?

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

He didnt play worse than PLD. Laferriere had a long leash and I think dragged the numbers of any line he was on a little bit.
Danault was not good for a stretch of the year. Fiala at one point in the year was turning it over leading to goals against so much he got benched but only once.
Kaliyev did himself no favors but there is a big double standard here with the consequences for playing poorly. Thomas looked better than anyone on the bottom line and couldnt get on the roster. Vilardi had to spend a year in the minors while Tmac played worse players.

Laferriere played head and tails better than Kaliyev, not sure how we make that comparison to be honest, as far as everyone else you named, they have a past to dwell on,

You mention a double standard, but everyone knew Fiala and Danault would play out of it, PLD, I think they just kept expecting him too,

Thomas looked good once healthy...took him a while to get there and if he's not on the roster next year, you probably have a valid example, right there.

Vilardi played himself too the minors as well, let's not act like he didn't. He also played himself OUT of the minors, Kaliyev isn't doing that.