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Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko

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Machinehead said:
Prior to this year, Lafreniere had trouble driving play. He still sucks at defense but at least his offensive metrics are good now. He always produced at a top six level and I've always said that. Over their careers:

Points per 60:

Lafreniere - 1.69
Kakko - 1.31

On-ice goals per 60:

Lafreniere - 2.67
Kakko 2.19

And no, that gap doesn't close if you take out this year. They're not the same caliber of producer. Never have been.

The biggest problem I had with Lafreniere prior to this year is that prior to this year, he was the worst powerplay player pretty much ever. He's done a 180 on that to become above average.
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It closes substantially if you remove kakkos atrocious rookie season that he spent on a line with Brett Howen and defenseman Brendan Smith.

Your problems with lafreniere were so beyond this characterization, this is just disingenuous. Why would you waste so many words on a player bc he sucks on the power play when he's destined not to play more than 20 seconds at the end of any power play anyway? You had a lot more to say about lafreniere, his riding a high shooting percentage, his basically being a player capable of producing at a middle six rate and nothing else. And he's proven you completely wrong.
 
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TheDirtyH said:
It closes substantially if you remove kakkos atrocious rookie season that he spent on a line with Brett Howen and defenseman Brendan Smith.

Your problems with lafreniere were so beyond this characterization, this is just disingenuous. Why would you waste so many words on a player bc he sucks on the power play when he's destined not to play more than 20 seconds at the end of any power play anyway? You had a lot more to say about lafreniere, his riding a high shooting percentage, his basically being a player capable of producing at a middle six rate and nothing else. And he's proven you completely wrong.
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Yeah, that's pretty much it.

I was hopefully wrong about Laf (one half of a season, let's see) and even if I wasn't, I'm still a moron and I'm on camera being humiliated for things I've said on thi site.

I'm still waiting for Kakko to make me say I was a moron about that too.

Point is, different players with different problems.
 
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TheDirtyH said:
It closes substantially if you remove kakkos atrocious rookie season that he spent on a line with Brett Howen and defenseman Brendan Smith.

Your problems with lafreniere were so beyond this characterization, this is just disingenuous. Why would you waste so many words on a player bc he sucks on the power play when he's destined not to play more than 20 seconds at the end of any power play anyway? You had a lot more to say about lafreniere, his riding a high shooting percentage, his basically being a player capable of producing at a middle six rate and nothing else. And he's proven you completely wrong.
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Yes 100%. How disingenuous. 8000 of MH’s 200,000 posts were about Laf sucking in every facet of the game.
 
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Machinehead said:
Yeah, that's pretty much it.

I was hopefully wrong about Laf (one half of a season, let's see) and even if I wasn't, I'm still a moron and I'm on camera being humiliated for things I've said on thi site.

I'm still waiting for Kakko to make me say I was a moron about that too.

Point is, different players with different problems.
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Lmao ok ok same
 
Machinehead said:
Prior to this year, Lafreniere had trouble driving play. He still sucks at defense but at least his offensive metrics are good now. He always produced at a top six level and I've always said that. Over their careers:

Points per 60:

Lafreniere - 1.69
Kakko - 1.31

On-ice goals per 60:

Lafreniere - 2.67
Kakko 2.19

And no, that gap doesn't close if you take out this year. They're not the same caliber of producer. Never have been.

The biggest problem I had with Lafreniere prior to this year is that prior to this year, he was the worst powerplay player pretty much ever. He's done a 180 on that to become above average.
Click to expand...

I gotta call you out on this. You have numerous times said "at least I can see what Kakko does well, what does Lafreniere do well?"
 
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Machinehead said:
The biggest problem I had with Lafreniere prior to this year is that prior to this year, he was the worst powerplay player pretty much ever. He's done a 180 on that to become above average.
Click to expand...

In his first 3 seasons, Lafreniere averaged under 20 seconds per power play. It hasn’t changed this season. We really have no idea what type of power player he is yet.

Kakko has the same lack of opportunity, but admittedly I wouldn’t bet on him becoming a dynamic PP1 guy. Laf certainly will at some point in his career.
 
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Machinehead said:
On the occasions Kakko does get benched, it's because he doesn't do anything.

I think there's a tendency to assume most benchings are do to "bad defense" or other things n stuff (fair enough, coaches do that to themselves), but you have to produce also.

Kakko's game is absolutely bereft of offense in a very high scoring era of NHL hockey.

You can disagree that it's the correct approach to better the situation, but asking "why?" just seems disingenuous at this point.

Say what you will about Wheeler being ass, but he somehow found 17 points down the couch. At a certain point, it matters.
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Wheeler having 17 points this year is frankly astonishing. I thought he had like 5.
 
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Paulie Walnutz said:
Lisa Andersson, Krapsoft, Suckvist, Cocko, it’s a giant conspiracy I tell ya! This is why I never listen to couch potatoes hype up prospects.
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The conspiracy is that prospects dont always work out, and teams miss on draft picks sometimes. Thats a better pill to swallow on Hockey's Future Message board
 
B17 Apricots said:
100% would have no problem taking a gamble like the Kotkaniemi deal on Kakko
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I don't know if I would take a gamble like that. 4 Million for a guy bounced around and then finding himself on the 4th line isn't ideal. If there was a plan to stick to it and keep him in the top 6, maybe.
 
SnowblindNYR said:
I gotta call you out on this. You have numerous times said "at least I can see what Kakko does well, what does Lafreniere do well?"
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Yes and I think a lot of that is still true. Lafreniere still has holes whereas Kakko, even now, is a positive influence on play.

You still have to put the puck in the net. You don't see how Lafreniere taking a bump in scoring and Kakko's production caving changes opinions?
 
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Harbour Dog said:
The kid never magically forgot how to create offense as soon as he put on a Rangers sweater. We neutered him from the get go, and we continue to neuter him. It turns my stomach.

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The biggest difference I see from this video and his NHL play is that in the video he frequently turns into the slot/traffic with possession.

In the NHL he really only ever turns away from the slot/traffic when he has possession.
 
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Profet said:
The biggest difference I see from this video and his NHL play is that in the video he frequently turns into the slot/traffic with possession.

In the NHL he really only ever turns away from the slot/traffic when he has possession.
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His lack of NHL speed & the smaller ice surface hasn't done him any favors.
 
Profet said:
The biggest difference I see from this video and his NHL play is that in the video he frequently turns into the slot/traffic with possession.

In the NHL he really only ever turns away from the slot/traffic when he has possession.
Click to expand...
Slot PSA.jpg
 
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Boris Zubov said:
His lack of NHL speed & the smaller ice surface hasn't done him any favors.
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The ice surface is probably a factor, the speed too, though I think that's overstated. The Finns are reknown for playing a tightly structured team game, and on that team he was used like the single superstar they had. His NHL experience couldn't be more the opposite, both in terms of the structure and discipline of the team, and his particular role within it.

Like, imagine a teenage kakko being locked into the RW of Bergeron-Marchand.
 
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Machinehead said:
On the occasions Kakko does get benched, it's because he doesn't do anything.

I think there's a tendency to assume most benchings are do to "bad defense" or other things n stuff (fair enough, coaches do that to themselves), but you have to produce also.

Kakko's game is absolutely bereft of offense in a very high scoring era of NHL hockey.

You can disagree that it's the correct approach to better the situation, but asking "why?" just seems disingenuous at this point.

Say what you will about Wheeler being ass, but he somehow found 17 points down the couch. At a certain point, it matters.
Click to expand...
Ok and at what point do you say "hmmm well when he's on the ice and high in the lineup we win the goal share 60/40 and xG share 56/44 so I think that's pretty elite and I'm going to stick with it"?

A good coach would stick with that.
 
Machinehead said:
Prior to this year, Lafreniere had trouble driving play. He still sucks at defense but at least his offensive metrics are good now. He always produced at a top six level and I've always said that. Over their careers:

Points per 60:

Lafreniere - 1.69
Kakko - 1.31

On-ice goals per 60:

Lafreniere - 2.67
Kakko 2.19

And no, that gap doesn't close if you take out this year. They're not the same caliber of producer. Never have been.

The biggest problem I had with Lafreniere prior to this year is that prior to this year, he was the worst powerplay player pretty much ever. He's done a 180 on that to become above average.
Click to expand...
Conveniently leaving out how Lafreniere's on-ice goals AGAINST per 60. Atleast Kakko has a positive for-against differential. Isn't that the point of hockey??
 
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