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Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko

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SA16 said:
Here are Vatrano's 5v5 goal rates among forwards with 400+ mins each year:

15/16 - 42 out of 378
16/17 - 122 out of 377
17/18 - 40 out of 389
18/19 - 47 out of 389
19/20 - 189 out of 371
20/21 - 54 out of 341
21/22 - 62 out of 410

He's been a top line quality goal scorer almost his entire career. One down year in 19/20. He is the exact type of complementary wing you want in the top six with good playmakers. He also has solid play driving numbers his whole career. I don't know why we're going out of our way to bash the guy or to demote him for top prospects who are currently inferior players. They can take his job next season when we cannot afford to extend him. He's no more/less streaky than any other player of his style. Kakko is currently a defensive third line player who over three years has shown little offense. It makes no sense to move him up to start in the playoffs.
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Not bashing him but for his career he is basically a 35 point guy not a top line guy.
 
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haohmaru said:
I think Kakko had a pretty good season, all things considered.
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His points per game ticked up despite again getting no PP time, no consistent line mates, and no consistent playing time due to injury.
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Kocur Dill said:
When we acquired Vatrano FLA fans said we will love his motor but don't fall in love with his office because he is streaky and when he isn't scoring he isn't useful in the top 6.

I like the kid a lot, but he hasn't been here all that long and is starting to prove those FLA poster's point.

You don't derail a kid like Kakko who is so much more important to this team long term for a guy like Vatrano.

Kakko is the future. A cornerstone. Vatrano is a top 9 guy who you let play up when he is hot and move down when he is cold.

Vatrano doesn't replace, displace, or make Kakko redundant one iota. He is what Gauthier should have been, nothing more. And defiantly not a long term Top 6 RW for this team. Think more along the lines of Pouliot or Grabner.
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And with Vatrano getting just 3 points in 8 games (after 10 in his first 14 games), he’s starting to go cold. He should be moved down now but the gray heads on here won’t entertain a word of actually playing the kids in important roles so I guess they’ll have to see him turn to ice for a couple games against Pittsburgh first.
 
mas0764 said:
His points per game ticked up despite again getting no PP time, no consistent line mates, and no consistent playing time due to injury.
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And with Vatrano getting just 3 points in 8 games (after 10 in his first 14 games), he’s starting to go cold. He should be moved down now but the gray heads on here won’t entertain a word of actually playing the kids in important roles so I guess they’ll have to see him turn to ice for a couple games against Pittsburgh first.
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You are evaluating based on points per games over 14 and 8 game stretches and we're the donks?
 
NickyFotiu said:
Not bashing him but for his career he is basically a 35 point guy not a top line guy.
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He said top line quality goal scorer at 5v5. Vatrano is not a great playmaker and I don't think he's ever really been used heavily on the PP which is why his total production is not substantial.
 
I believe Kakko will be fine and will be very good. It's unfortunate that a series of freak injuries kept him from having a full year of development this season. But when he's in the lineup you can sense he's ready to break out. We need him healthy, consistently, so he can develop.

Like Lafreniere, these guys are very young. Give them 1 to 2 years more. Patience.
 
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Had some good plays last night and I thought the kids line was our most dangerous line for most of the game.

Unfortunately, personally, I just can't shake the impression that Kakko for whatever reason plays scared. And for a guy who's supposed to play a dominating, power game that worries me. I know he's delivered in international tournaments and should be used to playing against men, but there's just something there when I watch him play that somewhat often makes me think, "oh, he doesn't want to risk getting hit."

🤷‍♂️ oh well
 
that play was amazing last night. drives the net and has the presence of mind to find the puck and pass it to the open man while on his ass. he should've been the man responsible for the game winning goal, what a huge confidence booster that would've been.
 
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zlev11 said:
that play was amazing last night. drives the net and has the presence of mind to find the puck and pass it to the open man while on his ass. he should've been the man responsible for the game winning goal, what a huge confidence booster that would've been.
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I think this is what's way more upsetting about the overturn. Kakko is obviously still a bit cold from when he was out but what a boost this would've been to him and that whole line.
 
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ponzu4u said:
Had some good plays last night and I thought the kids line was our most dangerous line for most of the game.

Unfortunately, personally, I just can't shake the impression that Kakko for whatever reason plays scared. And for a guy who's supposed to play a dominating, power game that worries me. I know he's delivered in international tournaments and should be used to playing against men, but there's just something there when I watch him play that somewhat often makes me think, "oh, he doesn't want to risk getting hit."

🤷‍♂️ oh well
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He can look like playing scared because he’s not playing with confidence

I keep saying every year confidence is everything for kids
 
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ponzu4u said:
Had some good plays last night and I thought the kids line was our most dangerous line for most of the game.

Unfortunately, personally, I just can't shake the impression that Kakko for whatever reason plays scared. And for a guy who's supposed to play a dominating, power game that worries me. I know he's delivered in international tournaments and should be used to playing against men, but there's just something there when I watch him play that somewhat often makes me think, "oh, he doesn't want to risk getting hit."

🤷‍♂️ oh well
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Watching him last night I couldn't help but think he looked more like a Jesper Fast that was drafted late and works hard and is outperforming his draft position/skill.
 
Scor said:
Do you mean 40 goal scorer Rick Nash or playoff ghost Rick Nash?

If Kakko can turn into the former I'll take it.
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Probably somewhere in between which is where Rick Nash actually was tbh.

Nash never broke 80 points and only scored 40 goals because he was put in a position to do so. In Columbus in particular, he got ridiculous TOI. Two franchises (more so Columbus) treated him like a savior. In reality, he was never that level of offensive star.

He was a surefire 30-30 who did everything and couldn't be moved off the puck. I definitely see that in Kakko.

Nash shot a lot more and Kakko (hot take alert) is already better defensively than Nash ever was, but I think you have consider role on both accounts.
 
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JohnC said:
I basically still see Rick Nash
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Wish he had Nash's offensive game right now. 50-60 points would be fine with the rest of his game. But for a physical guy, he doesn't hit and he doesn't stop pucks. He still manages to play well defensively. But as someone else mentioned, he avoids confrontation on offense and defense and that's not a good sign for the player hes supposed to be. It's kind of amazing he manages to play so well without the puck while avoiding physicality, so I imagine if he got over that, he'd really be a heck of a player. Same with getting in front of some pucks. Cause it's not like he's playing like Pan or Kreider and we need him for his offense.

Not saying hitting is the end all be all of being a terrific player. But "power forwards" usually make contact. 8 registered hits the entire season makes no sense for a player like him.

And frankly, if he did play with more physicality, he'd probably score more, get himself in better position and create more space for himself and teammates. Sometimes I feel like Laf is doing all that kind of work on the line. And Chytil just looks useless out there sometimes, especially on offense. Laf has to do a lot of the dirty work. Not surprised Laf doesn't have more points in the situation. But Kakko needs to get himself embedded in situations and fight for the puck and just use his physical presence more.
 
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Kakko has been good. No reason to think this wasn't what he was going to be during the season if he does not get hurt. You saw it took a game or two after coming back the first time and it was the same the 2nd time. It was beginning to happen and he basically had to sit out for 3 months for an injury as well.

The key to him is believing in his shot. Everything else will come into play as soon as he starts to do that more and more. The best thing is that the three young guys seem to feed off each other. Sometimes that is tough, but they mesh pretty well.
 
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