Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko

[Black Tank]

Both with Kakko and Laf there's this desire among Rangers fans to be disappointed and demand they be traded for shit because they are stuck on their mental model of what a high draft pick should be. If they could change their understanding to "will these players be cost controlled and help the Rangers contend for and win at least one Cup" then they would probably align better with reality.

 

[Peltz]

What? And Mika didn’t deal with COVID disrupting his development. That’s also irrefutable, so? My point is it’s way too early to give up on 21 year old Kakko. I didn’t extrapolate his totals based off Mika. Youre arguing against something I didn’t say. I maintained that we’d be making the same sort of mistake Ottawa did. Other people started saying there was no comparison, I merely showed that there IS a comparison. I didnt say he’d be the the scorer that Mika is, in fact I said I thought he WOULDN’T but that he had other attributes in tandem that make me see him as an excellent future NHLer. Nothing you’ve said address that or gives me reason to reconsider. If you don’t think Kakko can score 65-70 points (as I already suggested he had a good chance to be a .8-.9ppg scorer) when he has developed, in addition to his defense and possession, and it’s no big deal to trade him, that’s no less opinion than my take.

The thing is… COVID’s shortened seasons even affected zib’s production rather noticeably by every measure (other than perhaps defensively). And that’s after emerging as one of the best, most offensively gifted, centers in the NHL.

Of course it can easily affect someone with far less experience from acclimating to the league. These seasons are extremely unique. And when you factor in how much Kakko has missed within these seasons, then you’re giving up on a player way WAY too early after he’s flashes a couple of dominant periods through the last two years.

You gotta be patient with these forwards. You don’t need them to be top 6 players on this team yet considering where the rest of the roster is. So I don’t understand the desire to move on.

 

[bhamill]

The thing is… COVID’s shortened seasons even affected zib’s production rather noticeably by every measure (other than perhaps defensively). And that’s after emerging as one of the best, most offensively gifted, centers in the NHL.

Of course it can easily affect someone with far less experience from acclimating to the league. These seasons are extremely unique. And when you factor in how much Kakko has missed within these seasons, then you’re giving up on a player way WAY too early after he’s flashes a couple of dominant periods through the last two years.

You gotta be patient with these forwards. You don’t need them to be top 6 players on this team yet considering where the rest of the roster is. So I don’t understand the desire to move on.

Yes. Of course it affected all players. But not all players were in their development years. Those that were had their development affected to varying degrees. It’s just common sense. Even the players we might look at and say “ hey, HE didnt have his development impacted” because he had a good season... of course he was impacted. We have no idea how good the player might have been that season without the disruptions.

 

[chosen]

I'm not saying he's ahead, I'm saying there are a multitude of young winger options in the organization. Its also pretty likely Othmann starts next season in NY

Not sure how you came to the conclusion that Othmann will be a Ranger next season. It's possible, but far from a sure thing.

Kakko was obviously thought of far more highly by the Rangers when they selected him, and I bet he still is.

 

[chosen]

Carcillo better than Panarin

I think you missed the point.

 

[JohnC]

You gotta be patient with these forwards. You don’t need them to be top 6 players on this team yet considering where the rest of the roster is. So I don’t understand the desire to move on.

We went so long without young promising forwards that people don’t know what to do with them so they act like we need to make tough roster decisions with them as if they’re 27 year old upcoming UFAs.

I find myself being guilty of this at times w/r/t Filip Chytil.

 

[Inferno]

There are things you either see...or you don't.

Everything I see from kakko makes me think there's absolutely nothing to worry about with him..you just need to be patient.

Lafreniere was a little more concerning but that goal he scored made me feel more at ease, as well as the more pep in his step he had that game.

It tells me his game is there...he just hasn't found it consistently.

Kakko is much closer to busting out...

 

[mas0764]

There are things you either see...or you don't.

Everything I see from kakko makes me think there's absolutely nothing to worry about with him..you just need to be patient.

Lafreniere was a little more concerning but that goal he scored made me feel more at ease, as well as the more pep in his step he had that game.

It tells me his game is there...he just hasn't found it consistently.

Kakko is much closer to busting out...

We just need a long term center or two and Kravtsov back and we're set.

 

[Anthony5967]

There are things you either see...or you don't.

Everything I see from kakko makes me think there's absolutely nothing to worry about with him..you just need to be patient.

Lafreniere was a little more concerning but that goal he scored made me feel more at ease, as well as the more pep in his step he had that game.

It tells me his game is there...he just hasn't found it consistently.

Kakko is much closer to busting out...

Could it have something to do with the guy playing 13-14 mins a game while his peers like Zegras and Raymond are playing 18-20 and getting PP1 on brutal teams? Confidence is important. His skills didn't just evaporate the minute he put on a Rangers jersey. A lot more goes into this than meets the eye. Some guys take time to mature and gain experience and confidence. These two guys are on a 50-win team with six to play. They have had some season. Their time will come, but for now, they are here to learn and gain valuable experience on how to win, something Zegras and Raymond won't be doing this year, Stutzle, as well. Very confident with both guys.

 

[IDvsEGO]

There are things you either see...or you don't.

Everything I see from kakko makes me think there's absolutely nothing to worry about with him..you just need to be patient.

Lafreniere was a little more concerning but that goal he scored made me feel more at ease, as well as the more pep in his step he had that game.

It tells me his game is there...he just hasn't found it consistently.

Kakko is much closer to busting out...

The game he was having in the first against WPG he was flying. His confidence looked sky high and thats exactly what we want to see and he becomes a huge threat for us on a third line that way.

 

[mas0764]

I will say the fact that Kakko and Lafreniere may not end up the Huberdeaus or MacKinnons of the league is a reason why we still need more young talent.

I'm not down on either of them overall, and I'm definitely not trading either of them, but it's certainly still a very possible outcome that Kakko ends up a defensively proficient 60 point wing and Lafreniere a well rounded, tough to play against 70 point wing, but that neither are your 90-100 point Patrick Kane type star wings.

In which case it's more important than ever to get more and quality young center depth.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I will say the fact that Kakko and Lafreniere may not end up the Huberdeaus or MacKinnons of the league is a reason why we still need more young talent.

I'm not down on either of them overall, and I'm definitely not trading either of them, but it's certainly still a very possible outcome that Kakko ends up a defensively proficient 60 point wing and Lafreniere a well rounded, tough to play against 70 point wing, but that neither are your 90-100 point Patrick Kane type star wings.

In which case it's more important than ever to get more and quality young center depth.

we're at the point where we literally could not acquire young high end talent without giving up a massive piece.
Our draft picks for probably the next 5-6 years will be in the 20's at best.
We need to maximize the windows we have, but we're in a window.
If the cap goes up as scheduled, we'll be in another window once it does.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I think you missed the point.

Nah, just keeping this going:

Goodrow has won two Cups. Panarin has won zero. McDavid.

Ergo, Goodrow is a better and more valuable player than Panarin in the playoffs.

 

[McRanger92]

Not sure how you came to the conclusion that Othmann will be a Ranger next season. It's possible, but far from a sure thing.

Kakko was obviously thought of far more highly by the Rangers when they selected him, and I bet he still is.

Kakko probably is more highly regarded than Othmann but circumstances (injury/lack of production/contract status) have made trading him a viable option. I really don’t think that’s an outlandish idea.

 

[bhamill]

Kakko probably is more highly regarded than Othmann but circumstances (injury/lack of production/contract status) have made trading him a viable option. I really don’t think that’s an outlandish idea.

I don’t think there’s much disagreement among hockey people about who is more highly regarded. Othmann isnt even a sure fire NHLer, though I’d be shocked if he wasn’t in a couple of years. I really like his game from my limited viewing.
I dont think a lot of people consider Kakko untouchable. So yeah, it’s viable to trade him if you are getting equal or better value. He ‘s far from a “disposable” asset. This team would be f***ing stupid to trade him for anything less than a young (21ish) NHL player with stud potential. And there’s not a WHOLE lot of those available, for GOOD reason. The same reason we shouldn’t be looking to trade Kakko. Trading him to make room or save cap would be a TERRIBLE waste… and I’m confident Drury won’t do that.

 

[mas0764]

we're at the point where we literally could not acquire young high end talent without giving up a massive piece.
Our draft picks for probably the next 5-6 years will be in the 20's at best.
We need to maximize the windows we have, but we're in a window.
If the cap goes up as scheduled, we'll be in another window once it does.

I think you could quite realistically get a high end piece for two firsts, Nils, and a roster add.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

I don’t think there’s much disagreement among hockey people about who is more highly regarded. Othmann isnt even a sure fire NHLer, though I’d be shocked if he wasn’t in a couple of years. I really like his game from my limited viewing.
I dont think a lot of people consider Kakko untouchable. So yeah, it’s viable to trade him if you are getting equal or better value. He ‘s far from a “disposable” asset. This team would be f***ing stupid to trade him for anything less than a young (21ish) NHL player with stud potential. And there’s not a WHOLE lot of those available, for GOOD reason. The same reason we shouldn’t be looking to trade Kakko. Trading him to make room or save cap would be a TERRIBLE waste… and I’m confident Drury won’t do that.

I think Drury proved he is not a fool and understands the big picture by what he did at the deadline. There is no way in hell he is trading Kakko unless it brings back a young 1C/2C cost controlled center. I think Kakko would have broke out this year if he didn't miss 40 games. There is no doubt in my mind he is going to be a very good player.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I think you could quite realistically get a high end piece for two firsts, Nils, and a roster add.

Yeah that sounds like a “massive piece”

 

[mas0764]

Yeah that sounds like a “massive piece”

Well if that was the cost to go up in the draft and get a center we love and we think is a future 1C, that's the move to make.

 

[Hockey Gamer]

I think it's more likely his problem (if it's even a true problem or not, hard to tell at the moment) is that he seems to be injury prone and may just be one of those players that for whatever reason, has a higher risk for injury.

I don't think his problem is related to any skill deficiency. It would track that as he plays more, he looks more confident and I think that's clearly being displayed this year. We all remember a few games back where he scored two goals and was blasting slap shots on net like a madman. He looked unhinged like never before. I think it's hard to say that he lacks the hands and skill. Much more likely his lackluster career thus far has been due to a combination of intersectional factors that have all played on one another. Yes, it's true that other players have also had to deal with similar or the same issues but not everyone is a carbon copy of one another and the list goes on as to why some people may be more sensitive to certain conditions where as others aren't, yet it doesn't really hold much significance in the final outcome when the dust settles.

 

[chosen]

Nah, just keeping this going:

Sure

 

[JohnC]

This talk of Kakko being injury prone after playing in 68/70 and 48/56 games reminds me of when people called Derek Stepan injury prone because he hopped on the ice and broke his leg.

Crappy injury riddled seasons happen and I never understood why people hop to the injury prone narrative when a lot of the time it’s never regarding a player that is habitually injured.

 

[mas0764]

Ends season with a respectable 0.42 points per game despite no power play time and missing vast swaths of time.

Any idea we should trade this guy is laughable.

 

[ThirdEye]

I think he's just scratching the surface of what he's capable of. Still looks clumsy out there but producing at a respectable clip. He's going to get like 50% stronger

 

[cheech70]

The pressing issue is where does K2 fit in the lineup. No way kids line in playoffs. 13-72-21 was very good so no messing there. K2 with Rooney and Reeves/Hunt?? not feeling it...