JVR at the deadline

[Walshy7]

If he ever did anything worthwhile defensively, I would have remembered it.

**** memory then, he saved a goal last night

 

[Apotheosis]

If he ever did anything worthwhile defensively, I would have remembered it.

You just choose not to see it. Positionally, he was amazing last night. Making multiple interceptions because of said positioning.

OT: Trade him ASAP. I love his offensive contributions, but the fact that one of our longest tenured vets is this bad defensively is pathetic.

 

[hotpaws]

Man, these are a struggle. I would encourage you to read the entire conversation, but I'll help you out.

The one dude mentioned that guys fall off a cliff starting at 26. I asked do we use that same rule for our other players, or for some reason does it only apply to players the dude wants to trade.

he didn't say they fell off a cliff at 26 , he said they've peaked by 26/27 which most have

the same rule should apply to our players as well and if they aren't aging well i wouldn't be interested in locking them up long term if they shows signs of decline

I agree though think asset management is complicated.

Age is a number and there are inherent risks with that number. Skills decline with age. Injury risks increase.

But there's not a hard line as to what age makes sense to keep on a team. Clearly, vets help. And you don't just jettison a guy because he's 29.

For me, the line depends on the status of your core. If your core is good and young you want players that can supplement and support that. To be peaking when they are peaking and you probably want to be thinking of the next replacement crop.

For the Leafs, probably not contenders for 3-4 years.

Which means JVR will be over 30 when it matters. Probably not worth taking the long term risk on at this point. If we need a 30+ year old to play the role he will be playing at that point, we can get a free agent.

That's asset management.

If you buy that, it's worth noting that a contentious player is about 7 months younger than JVR and might be worth looking at too.

I think people forget that time moves on and the value a player has today isn't the same value they will have when it matters.

I agree , i was just trying to make a point about how some on this board never want to trade any player before they completely fall off the cliff and when they do ***** about re signing them to a long term contract .

 

[Willchel Marlynder]

If he ever did anything worthwhile defensively, I would have remembered it.

Guess you didn't watch last nights game when Willy rushed back to knock the puck off Nash's stick in the dying seconds of OT?

 

[Kiwi]

Nylander possibly

Nylander has been engaged hard working and probably our best forward recently
JVR wishes he could defend like Nylander

 

[Walshy7]

Guess you didn't watch last nights game when Willy rushed back to knock the puck off Nash's stick in the dying seconds of OT?

in regular time he did a similar play stick checked to the puck off the players stick then rushed up ice. It was a cross ice pass the ranger player had a wide open net and it went from that to a shot on goal for the leafs. JVR couldn't even dream of a play like that

 

[ObscureAlien]

would people rather have manson or montour?

 

[WilliamNylander]

would people rather have manson or montour?

Manson for me. Not close.

 

[Walshy7]

another nylander play last night

 

[The CyNick]

Guess you didn't watch last nights game when Willy rushed back to knock the puck off Nash's stick in the dying seconds of OT?

One play in sixty games, sweet argument.

 

[WilliamNylander]

One play in sixty games, sweet argument.

Best possession player on the Toronto Maple Leafs for the first 60 games this year.

 

[Walshy7]

One play in sixty games, sweet argument.

there were at least 3 last night alone, sweet argument

 

[Menzinger]

Best possession player on the Toronto Maple Leafs for the first 60 games this year.

Exactly.

Nylander is by just about any metric you like the better two way player of him vs JVR

 

[ShaneFalco]

Exactly.

Nylander is by just about any metric you like the better two way player of him vs JVR

To be fair though, a pylon rated higher on defensive metrics than JVR

 

[Walshy7]

Exactly.

Nylander is by just about any metric you like the better two way player of him vs JVR

there inst one metric that shows JVR to be better 2way player between them. OH found one JVR is -2 while willy is -3, but we all know how heavily sheltered the bozak line is so really its just more proof of how useless JVR is unless scoring

 

[Pookie]

Best possession player on the Toronto Maple Leafs for the first 60 games this year.

There are better arguments than a ranking on the concept of possession.

Possession is a debate I won't get into but in terms of a ranking that produces the best, we don't even know if the data within the ranking range is significant from a statisical perspective.

Ie is the difference between 50.8 and a 50.6 statistically significant? If not, you can't rank one ahead of the other and use it to prove a point.

 

[WilliamNylander]

There are better arguments than a ranking on the concept of possession.

Possession is a debate I won't get into but in terms of a ranking that produces the best, we don't even know if the data within the ranking range is significant from a statisical perspective.

Ie is the difference between 50.8 and a 50.6 statistically significant? If not, you can't rank one ahead of the other and use it to prove a point.

I'm not using it to rank them.

Just using it as a proxy to show that when Nylander is on the ice, he must be doing something right, as his team gets the majority of the shots.

Its even more impressive when you consider the fact that he's been in a match-up style role for half the year.

 

[Nooodles]

So the Stars just got a 2nd (which can be a 1st) for Eaves. Trade JvR right now...1st + good prospect easily.

 

[Phion Keneuf]

So the Stars just got a 2nd (which can be a 1st) for Eaves. Trade JvR right know...1st + good prospect easily.

I agree.

LAK 1st + Cernak (big RHD prospect who is defence first)

 

[Defense]

If JVR is traded...

Can Kapanen replace JVR's roster spot or is Kapanen injured still?

Or does Leivo replace JVR when Marner is back?

 

[Nithoniniel]

I've become rather convinced that JVR will be moved, based on his situation, usage and market value. It's becoming clear that Babcock doesn't value him very highly as he's not even in the top 6 among forwards for TOI. As a valuable trading piece at his age, who will soon need a new contract, it just doesn't seem likely that we'll want to keep him.

Wouldn't be surprised to see both him and Bozak moved out in the summer. Don't think it'll happen now at the TDL. Polak is the only one I can see get moved, really.

 

[Kurtz]

If JVR is traded...

Can Kapanen replace JVR's roster spot or is Kapanen injured still?

Or does Leivo replace JVR when Marner is back?

It'd be Leivo/Sosh. Kapanen's injury was pretty significant.

 

[The Caveman]

Shame Anaheim pickled up Eaves.. was hoping they would take JVR in a package for Montour. I guess they still can this summer, but who else would need him...

Kings? Islanders?

 

[080]

If JVR is traded...

Can Kapanen replace JVR's roster spot or is Kapanen injured still?

Or does Leivo replace JVR when Marner is back?

We don't need anyone to replace JVR at this point:
Nylander
Marner
Leivo
Komarov
Hyman
Brown

Some combination of those guys are our top nine wingers.

 

[The CyNick]

If JVR is traded...

Can Kapanen replace JVR's roster spot or is Kapanen injured still?

Or does Leivo replace JVR when Marner is back?

Kapanen is an AHL player. He still hasn't proven he can even play in the NHL, let alone in a top line. On top of that, he doesn't play JVRs game, so if you put him with Marner and Bozak's its likely they will struggle to score. Kapanen is likely a future candidate to play with Matthews. But that's likely not until next year at the earliest.