Juraj Slafkovsky - Year Two

[BehindTheTimes]

It's interesting that Slafkovsky is the only prospect that this organization is rushing.

Hutson, two years in NCAA.
Beck, two years in CHL.
Mesar, two years in CHL.
Engstrom, two years in SEL
Roy, two years in CHL and then AHL.
Farrell, playing in the AHL in his D+4
Reinbacher, playing in the Swiss league in his D+1

Which could be fine, I believe everyone should be approached on a case by case basis and there is no one size fits all approach, however, after 56 games of minimal growth the burden of proof lies with those who chose his path.

It’s hard to imagine that going through the AHL last year and even this year would have him further behind. If this is a case of development at the NHL level working I’d hate to see it fail.

Imo, this is not the optimal path, he would be further along in his development if he was playing heavy minutes in a lesser, but still very good league. The kid is 19, the truth is, most of the time the cream will rise to the top anyway, but not always. He looks way behind the play, too slow to get his shot off, poor reads and reactions etc. All things he looks to struggle with just the same as he did 56 games ago.

 

[Tripledeke333]

It's interesting that Slafkovsky is the only prospect that this organization is rushing.

Hutson, two years in NCAA.
Beck, two years in CHL.
Mesar, two years in CHL.
Engstrom, two years in SEL
Roy, two years in CHL and then AHL.
Farrell, playing in the AHL in his D+4
Reinbacher, playing in the Swiss league in his D+1

Rushing Slaf is what makes me question picking him first overall. He is/was a very intriguing prospect with potential, but if management thought he was ready to play in the NHL as an 18yo than they erred in assessing him.

In my opinion it is much much better for development for a prospect to get more ice time in a lesser league where they can work on creativity and try new things. The NHL is not a development league.

Both Suzuki and Pacioretty also were not rushed to the NHL. I wish we let Slaf develop in Europe and the AHL. Failing to pick and develop a 1OA pick should cost management their jobs IMO.

 

[Lshap]

Which could be fine, I believe everyone should be approached on a case by case basis and there is no one size fits all approach, however, after 56 games of minimal growth the burden of proof lies with those who chose his path.

It’s hard to imagine that going through the AHL last year and even this year would have him further behind. If this is a case of development at the NHL level working I’d hate to see it fail.

Imo, this is not the optimal path, he would be further along in his development if he was playing heavy minutes in a lesser, but still very good league. The kid is 19, the truth is, most of the time the cream will rise to the top anyway, but not always. He looks way behind the play, too slow to get his shot off, poor reads and reactions etc. All things he looks to struggle with just the same as he did 56 games ago.

Nobody's denying Slafkovsky has had a lousy start. The numbers reflect it. Most agree with you that starting him in the NHL was a mistake. I wanted him in the AHL, but whether or not that was the right move is irrelevant right now, because what's done is done. Time was lost, and I think we have to reset our expectations for Slaf this season. That doesn't mean ZERO expectations. He needs to show SOME concrete improvement, just not the kind of season totals we were hoping for. I pulled an arbitrary number out of my ass – 20 points – because I need to see something on the scoresheet, but I understand that he's on a slower developmental path. How slow is too slow? Not sure, but we're nowhere near declaring him to be a bust.

Half the people here are imagining he won't improve at all; the other half are imagining he'll become Joe Thornton. Best advice is to stop expecting a 19 year old to play like a 25 year old. Other young players figure it out at 19 or 20, Slafkovsky isn't one of them. Others take a few years more. Right now we have no idea what his future holds.

 

[Gustave]

Nobody's denying Slafkovsky has had a lousy start. The numbers reflect it. Most agree with you that starting him in the NHL was a mistake. I wanted him in the AHL, but whether or not that was the right move is irrelevant right now, because what's done is done. Time was lost, and I think we have to reset our expectations for Slaf this season. That doesn't mean ZERO expectations. He needs to show SOME concrete improvement, just not the kind of season totals we were hoping for. I pulled an arbitrary number out of my ass – 20 points – because I need to see something on the scoresheet, but I understand that he's on a slower developmental path. How slow is too slow? Not sure, but we're nowhere near declaring him to be a bust.

Half the people here are imagining he won't improve at all; the other half are imagining he'll become Joe Thornton. Best advice is to stop expecting a 19 year old to play like a 25 year old. Other young players figure it out at 19 or 20, Slafkovsky isn't one of them. Others take a few years more. Right now we have no idea what his future holds.

Great post.

I think the polarizing comes in part from this particular front;

Look, a lot of time was passed assessing the top 5 prospects from that draft year around here. It's all we had to do with our time from that SHIT season. Conclusion: "FFS, there are no clear #1, and worst of all, there are no guaranteed superstars there." Some wanted to cling to "Wright will regain his exceptionnal status" + worst comes to shove and he'll still be a 30+30 C, others went with "pick a D" if that's how it's gonna be, others went go with motor and great development program with Cooley... and others figured this weird gigantic W player who caught fire in two subpar tourneys might turn out to be a unicorn. Size, bursts of skill, killer goal scorer, ultimate puck protector on the boards.

Now, alot comes from how the Habs sold him, notably from the VERY disputed Bobrov. That speech put the bar to something around exceptionnal status and people saw the bullshit. There were some comparables to the way Jagr protected the puck... That irked the f*** out of people. Because at the same time, consensus said he was a project no matter what. Usually, projects require patience. Patience "usualy" comes in the form of letting a player cook longer in junior/lower pro leagues and leaving him be. It rarely comes in the form of KNOWING he's not ready to contribute in the NHL and leaving him there in the deep end to cheer every small improvements for a 5 year period. That's what's so contentious, I think. It's not a development path for projects that happen often. Plus, fans around here seem to like the traditional patient way (junior+lower pro leagues) so it's very conflicting.

 

[NORiculous]

Nobody's denying Slafkovsky has had a lousy start. The numbers reflect it. Most agree with you that starting him in the NHL was a mistake. I wanted him in the AHL, but whether or not that was the right move is irrelevant right now, because what's done is done.

So no one is accountable?

Half the people here are imagining he won't improve at all; the other half are imagining he'll become Joe Thornton.

How about he gets sent to the AHL for a while. Some people are arguing that he is progressing so he can stay.

I’m arguing that if we want to make sure he becomes an offensive weapon, he needs to work on his offensive tools and he could do that on the first PP and the first line in the AHL. (He can also work on the rest of his game to follow the « plan ». )

Once that is done, bring him up to work on translating his offensive tools to the big league with top 6 linemates and opportunities.

This process could be really quick or long. He has already lost some development time compared to Cooley and about every other prospect in his draft year. Let’s not waste more time because management wants to pr itself out of an awkward position.

 

[Miller Time]

You finally wrote something of substance. I knew you could do it.

But I used the word nuance... I thought that was a bad word

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Nobody's denying Slafkovsky has had a lousy start. The numbers reflect it. Most agree with you that starting him in the NHL was a mistake. I wanted him in the AHL, but whether or not that was the right move is irrelevant right now, because what's done is done. Time was lost, and I think we have to reset our expectations for Slaf this season. That doesn't mean ZERO expectations. He needs to show SOME concrete improvement, just not the kind of season totals we were hoping for. I pulled an arbitrary number out of my ass – 20 points – because I need to see something on the scoresheet, but I understand that he's on a slower developmental path. How slow is too slow? Not sure, but we're nowhere near declaring him to be a bust.

Half the people here are imagining he won't improve at all; the other half are imagining he'll become Joe Thornton. Best advice is to stop expecting a 19 year old to play like a 25 year old. Other young players figure it out at 19 or 20, Slafkovsky isn't one of them. Others take a few years more. Right now we have no idea what his future holds.

Most don’t agree that starting him in the AHL was ideal, hence the entire debate. Most are arguing everything is going according to plan, which is demonstrably false.

 

[Miller Time]

It's interesting that Slafkovsky is the only prospect that this organization is rushing.

Hutson, two years in NCAA.
Beck, two years in CHL.
Mesar, two years in CHL.
Engstrom, two years in SEL
Roy, two years in CHL and then AHL.
Farrell, playing in the AHL in his D+4
Reinbacher, playing in the Swiss league in his D+1

Perhaps because they aren't "rushing" him.

Perhaps they are, to the degree they can, seeking what they believe to be the best individual path for each top prospect they have based on each unique circumstance

Most don’t agree that starting him in the AHL was ideal, hence the entire debate. Most are arguing everything is going according to plan, which is demonstrably false.

Your "plan" is not the same as their "plan"... So odd that you would struggle to get that

 

[NORiculous]

Failing to pick and develop a 1OA pick should cost management their jobs IMO.

Management surely understands this.

So in the next draft they unanimously planned… to go with a safe pick that had a real high chance of playing in the NHL.

In comes Reinbacher.

The only problem is that building robotic plans like that without adjusting based on what is available is a huge mistake.

In comes Michkov.

Everyone understands he is a boom or bust pick. The risks are high but so is the reward. It turns out, you just can’t pass on this type of talent, specifically at #5.

Him busting would not cost management their jobs either. Although I am sure they figured that if Slafkovsky and Michkov both bust, they would be in trouble. Imagine busting two top 5 picks.

I do think people understood the Michkov situation though and they would have had some wiggle room.

So the weird way all this has played out is because some people in management are scared to lose their jobs. (I don’t think it’s Hughes, but that is just a guess. ) Because of this fear, they keep making mistakes as they have an impaired jugement.

All this also underlines something else. They aren’t sure Slafkovsky is going to make it(at the time of drafting Reinbacher). Add this with what Hughes said as to why they didn’t send Slafkovsky down last year (the press conference where he said something around the lines of « what if Slafkovsky doesn’t produce in the AHL ») and the picture of all this is becoming less blurry.

I like Hughes in general. I think he made a couple of bad decisions in his plan but you can’t always make the perfect decision.

I think Hughes needs to make some changes in his team though, before the shit hits the fan. You just can’t have a unanimous team in a such a debatable situation. I’m sure he understands that.

 

[leVENTduNORD]

It's interesting that Slafkovsky is the only prospect that this organization is rushing.

Hutson, two years in NCAA.
Beck, two years in CHL.
Mesar, two years in CHL.
Engstrom, two years in SEL
Roy, two years in CHL and then AHL.
Farrell, playing in the AHL in his D+4
Reinbacher, playing in the Swiss league in his D+1

Jordan Harris went straight from us College to the NHL, Ghule played THREE ahl games between Jr and NHL, Caufield played EIGHT ahl games between his college and NHL time, Suziki played 0 ahl games, straight from jr to NHL, even undrafter Xhekaj went straight from jr to the NHL.

based on that, Slafkovsky should be in jr right now where he would not need to dominate to graduate in a year or two, and the ahl would be used once or twice for a conditionning stint if need be.

Because that's what we have right right now, players who stayed longer in their jr calibre league before jumping to the nhl, and the players you mentionned havent played a single ahl game yet for the most part.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Jordan Harris went straight from us College to the NHL, Ghule played THREE ahl games between Jr and NHL, Caufield played EIGHT ahl games between his college and NHL time, Suziki played 0 ahl games, straight from jr to NHL, even undrafter Xhekaj went straight from jr to the NHL.

based on that, Slafkovsky should be in jr right now where he would not need to dominate to graduate in a year or two, and the ahl would be used once or twice for a conditionning stint if need be.

Because that's what we have right right now, players who stayed longer in their jr calibre league before jumping to the nhl, and the players you mentionned havent played a single ahl game yet for the most part.

All of the players you mentioned would’ve been in the AHL other then probably Jackeye and probably Caufield because of college if it wasn’t for the rule on the under 20 players not being eligible for the minors. We had a nice opportunity that lots of teams wish they had with Slafkovsky playing in the AHL because he was in Europe and we’re about to completely waste it.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Jordan Harris went straight from us College to the NHL, Ghule played THREE ahl games between Jr and NHL, Caufield played EIGHT ahl games between his college and NHL time, Suziki played 0 ahl games, straight from jr to NHL, even undrafter Xhekaj went straight from jr to the NHL.

based on that, Slafkovsky should be in jr right now where he would not need to dominate to graduate in a year or two, and the ahl would be used once or twice for a conditionning stint if need be.

Because that's what we have right right now, players who stayed longer in their jr calibre league before jumping to the nhl, and the players you mentionned havent played a single ahl game yet for the most part.

Jordan Harris lmao. You couldn’t pick a worse argument. He’s 23, was 22 last year. He has already been developed. Four seasons with Northeastern. He’s a case of not rushing a prospect. Suzuki and Cole showed they belonged.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

They worry now that if they send Slaf to the AHL and he still doesn’t perform

Management surely understands this.

So in the next draft they unanimously planned… to go with a safe pick that had a real high chance of playing in the NHL.

In comes Reinbacher.

The only problem is that building robotic plans like that without adjusting based on what is available is a huge mistake.

In comes Michkov.

Everyone understands he is a boom or bust pick. The risks are high but so is the reward. It turns out, you just can’t pass on this type of talent, specifically at #5.

Him busting would not cost management their jobs either. Although I am sure they figured that if Slafkovsky and Michkov both bust, they would be in trouble. Imagine busting two top 5 picks.

I do think people understood the Michkov situation though and they would have had some wiggle room.

So the weird way all this has played out is because some people in management are scared to lose their jobs. (I don’t think it’s Hughes, but that is just a guess. ) Because of this fear, they keep making mistakes as they have an impaired jugement.

All this also underlines something else. They aren’t sure Slafkovsky is going to make it(at the time of drafting Reinbacher). Add this with what Hughes said as to why they didn’t send Slafkovsky down last year (the press conference where he said something around the lines of « what if Slafkovsky doesn’t produce in the AHL ») and the picture of all this is becoming less blurry.

I like Hughes in general. I think he made a couple of bad decisions in his plan but you can’t always make the perfect decision.

I think Hughes needs to make some changes in his team though, before the shit hits the fan. You just can’t have a unanimous team in a such a debatable situation. I’m sure he understands that.

i think there are a few things they are worried about if they send him down. 1: if he doesn’t perform there then that could impact his confidence. 2: it will have everyone second guessing the pick 3: if he doesn’t perform it will make it look like they took the wrong guy.

None of them matter because if he can’t produce there he will never produce here.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

If they are actually scared of sending him down to the AHL because he won't produce we are so screwed

I really don't believe that's the case but it would be sad

 

[DAChampion]

They worry now that if they send Slaf to the AHL and he still doesn’t perform

i think there are a few things they are worried about if they send him down. 1: if he doesn’t perform there then that could impact his confidence. 2: it will have everyone second guessing the pick 3: if he doesn’t perform it will make it look like they took the wrong guy.

None of them matter because if he can’t produce there he will never produce here.

Yes indeed, the fear that Slafkovsky won't perform in the AHL is irrational.

Is Seattle afraid that Shane Wright won't produce in the AHL?

 

[DAChampion]

Jordan Harris went straight from us College to the NHL, Ghule played THREE ahl games between Jr and NHL, Caufield played EIGHT ahl games between his college and NHL time, Suziki played 0 ahl games, straight from jr to NHL, even undrafter Xhekaj went straight from jr to the NHL.

Not one of those players hit the NHL at age 18. They started past age 20, ergo, they weren't rushed.

 

[Mrb1p]

 

[NORiculous]

If they are actually scared of sending him down to the AHL because he won't produce we are so screwed

I really don't believe that's the case but it would be sad

Hughes said so last year. Something like « We though of sending him down. But then he would expect to produce. What happens if he doesn’t. »

That’s pretty straight forward IMO.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Hughes said so last year. Something like « We though of sending him down. But then he would expect to produce. What happens if he doesn’t. »

That’s pretty straight forward IMO.

That was a baffling comment and I think it sums up what we’ve seen so far. It looks horrible for them to be wrong on this and my theory since he got injured last year is these guys are afraid to admit they were wrong in fear of the fans and media turning on them early in their tenure.

 

[DAChampion]

Hughes said so last year. Something like « We though of sending him down. But then he would expect to produce. What happens if he doesn’t. »

That’s pretty straight forward IMO.

Ouch, maybe Hughes isn't as smart as I thought.

 

[leVENTduNORD]

Not one of those players hit the NHL at age 18. They started past age 20, ergo, they weren't rushed.

Yet not a single one of them was developped in the AHL. Wich most of you insist is THE league Slaf should be playing in right now.

We can debate all we want about the how and why like @BehindTheTimes and @nhlfan9191 insist of doing, but this is factual, we can all go to the nhl website and see if four ourselves. 0 ahl games for Harris, 0 ahl games for WiFi, 0 ahl games for Suzuki, only 3 ahl games for Ghule, only 8 ahl games for Caufield. and they're all doing fine in the NHL right now.

so again, why do you all insist AHL is THE league ? how about ECHL, or 2nd - 3rd division league somewhere in Europe that would be more or less the same calibre as the US College or JR ?

worked for all of the players menionned, so that should be the way to go with Slaf too.

 

[DAChampion]

Yet not a single one of them was developped in the AHL. Wich most of you insist is THE league Slaf should be playing in right now.

Slaf should probably have stayed in Finland for another year, but that ship has sailed.

0 ahl games for Harris,

Slaf can't go to the NCAA.

 

[leVENTduNORD]

Most don’t agree that starting him in the AHL was ideal, hence the entire debate. Most are arguing everything is going according to plan, which is demonstrably false.

In your head maybe.

 

[nhlfan9191]

Yet not a single one of them was developped in the AHL. Wich most of you insist is THE league Slaf should be playing in right now.

We can debate all we want about the how and why like @BehindTheTimes and @nhlfan9191 insist of doing, but this is factual, we can all go to the nhl website and see if four ourselves. 0 ahl games for Harris, 0 ahl games for WiFi, 0 ahl games for Suzuki, only 3 ahl games for Ghule, only 8 ahl games for Caufield. and they're all doing fine in the NHL right now.

so again, why do you all insist AHL is THE league ? how about ECHL, or 2nd - 3rd division league somewhere in Europe that would be more or less the same calibre as the US College or JR ?

worked for all of the players menionned, so that should be the way to go with Slaf too.

I never accused you of giving incorrect information about the players you mentioned. I was only pointing out that they spent their D-1 and D-2 in different leagues and graduated into the NHL in their D-3. There was no graduation process with Slafkovsky. I also pointed out the AHL wasn’t an option for anyone you mentioned in their first two seasons, which is a luxury most teams would love to have with every prospect that’s good enough.

 

[leVENTduNORD]

Slaf should probably have stayed in Finland for another year, but that ship has sailed.



Slaf can't go to the NCAA.

Did not suggest Slaf should go play in the US.