In Memoriam Johnny Gaudreau & Matthew Gaudreau killed by drunk driver while cycling (MOD WARNING. No Flaming, Trolling, or Politics.)

[Caps8112]

Might have already been posted, but NHL network radio is doing a tribute to him right now

 

[Uberpecker]

First, you don’t get to tell other people what their statements mean.

Taking a bike ride in a rural area at sundown/night is a dangerous choice. It just is. Your desire for that to be a safe activity doesn’t supersede the plain fact that it is not safe.

Making a choice to do an inherently dangerous thing does not make you accountable for a crime committed against you.

That is just victim blaming of the most problematic variety.
It's like saying we've needlessly created a dangerous environment, now whoever doesn't adapt to it is doing so at his own risk.

I thought the US prides itself in being the land of freedom. Now obviously everyone and their granny knows that this is just a fairy tale for the most gullible amongst us.

But even here the freedom to ride a bike with no potential to harm anyone needs to supercede the "freedom" to drunkenly drive a 2000+ kilo machine.

 

[TheBeard]

That's a fair observation, but I'm still not sure it really applies to what I said. Consistency in application of the law and punishments for violating the law is certainly worth discussing and improving, but what I am saying is the kind of law that allows the police to charge you with a crime that never actually happened is dangerous territory that runs counter to the idea of a free society.

Agreed. It’s just bizarre you can get essentially the same punishment for being not intoxicated while driving as you can being on your second actual intoxicated driving charge in a month.

 

[Jared Dunn]

Sure, if your goal is to create a repeat offender.

Yeah letting him behind the wheel of a car again seems like a better idea after he killed two people


You're welcome to not ignore the rest of my comment, for the record. If his life is ruined he'll have no choice but to get drunk behind the wheel again? give me a god damn break

 

[nergish]

I can still remember the first time he played against my Canucks.
Turning to my Dad, "watch this little guy out there for Calgary, he was a superstar in college - they call him Johnny Hockey".

RIP

 

[Turin]

Sure, if your goal is to create a repeat offender.

Can’t repeat an offense if you’re dead.

 

[NyQuil]

RIP to Johnny Hockey and Matthew. Truly shocked and devastated to hear this.


I live in the Netherlands which, for those who've visited and especially any that've lived/spent significant time here, it's the gold standard for societies that have rejected the supremacy of cars.

I bike from my apartment 3 minutes on perfectly constructed bike lanes that are as extensive and exclusive as the actual roads in most other countries. I park in a 5 story bike garage and take an intercity train from one major Dutch city to another major Dutch city in a grand total of 20 minutes. Cars are banned from the city centers.

It revolutionizes your life and makes you never want to go back to North American, car-centric living.

The problem is, the Netherlands has phenomenal rail infrastructure connecting the entire country, flat terrain, and condensed cities. (Ottawa has the same population as Amsterdam but is geographically 10x larger).

I don't know how it could ever work in North America. They don't have good intra or inter city rail. Cities are too sprawling and distance between cities too great. Terrain is uneven and rarely flat.

Its also the climate.

When I see someone cycling in the winter with ski goggles on, while the road is 2m more narrow on either side thanks to massive snow drifts, it makes me wonder.

 

[Bacon Artemi Bravo]

What I can tell you is that as a life long resident of New Jersey, I fully expect the sentence for the accused killer to be way less than anyone thinks. This state does not justly punish severe crime. Expect 6-10 years and he’ll probably serve some fraction of that before release.

 

[Interior Cascadian]

Ugh, the details are so gut wrenching. RIP Johnny and Matthew. Jackets fans, hang in there everyone.

I hope the family finds solace in due time while the hockey community rallies around them.

 

[tarheelhockey]

That is just victim blaming of the most problematic variety.
It's like saying we've needlessly created a dangerous environment, now whoever doesn't adapt to it is doing so at his own risk.

I thought the US prides itself in being the land of freedom. Now obviously everyone and their granny knows that this is just a fairy tale for the most gullible amongst us.

But even here the freedom to ride a bike with no potential to harm anyone needs to supercede the "freedom" to drunkenly drive a 2000+ kilo machine.

But we HAVE created a dangerous environment for rural cycling. That’s an inescapable reality.

Also, the term “victim blaming” has a real meaning which is not at all applicable here. Everyone in the room understands that cyclists have the right to those roads. Simply having the right doesn’t mean it’s safe, which is why cyclists are hit on rural roads all the time.

 

[SJinNewJersey]

What a tragedy. I am still in shock.

 

[leafsfan5]

This is devastating beyond words

 

[Tobias Kahun]

No it's not. It's less safe for both because of the likelihood of collision.

There's a significant difference in speed between cyclists and pedestrians. Even a casual cyclist could be doing 10 mph past a pedestrian walking 2 mph. And at intersections drivers may be looking for pedestrians in a crosswalk, but a cyclist arrives into the intersection much quicker than a pedestrian.

In many places cycling on the sidewalk is in fact illegal for all those reasons.

The road doesn't belong solely to motor vehicles. If drivers actually obeyed traffic laws cyclists would be safe on the road except for circumstances that were truly an accident (the Gaudreaus getting killed was no accident. It was the result of drunk and unsafe driving). But many drivers don't want to deal with the inconvenience of having to wait a few seconds to pass a cyclist safely.

Lots of cyclists also think they’re above the rules of the road

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Lots of cyclists also think they’re above the rules of the road

As do a much larger number of drivers.

 

[Mestaruus]

It had to happen to a such nice guy and neither of them two survived. They didn't have any luck involved there.

 

[swiftwin]

It's amazing how people can't seem to separate the two.

Biking at night on the road is an inherently dangerous activity. Saying so does not mean you support someone going for a cruise and crushing beers

So if a girl gets raped, do you get to say "Well, she should know that wearing a short skirt might invite some people to do this".

You're still victim blaming. All these things can be true. The "advice" you're giving can be true, but that advice is still victim blaming.

 

[JPT]

It seems the easy solution is to make breathalyzer start ups mandator for life after the first or second DUI.

Or just make it a standard feature in all cars. Problem solved.

I said earlier that in a vacuum I agree with cars having breathalyzers in them, but then I thought about it. Going that route creates all new problems. Some of those problems could cause severe traffic accidents. These interlock systems aren't perfect. They can and have shut down people's vehicles mid-commute without a failed test. If all cars have them then that relatively uncommon occurrences suddenly happens a lot more. That's not the only safety concern. What happens when someone needs to rush a person to the ER, but they can't start their car because the interlock is malfunctioning? Or because they just finished rinsing with a mouth wash that contains alcohol? Or they simply are panicked and can't control their breathing enough to blow into the machine hard and long enough?

They are also expensive to have installed, monitored, and transferred, so attaching them to someone's car for life after one or two DUIs isn't going to fly. You're effectively sentencing someone to an unknown amount of fines that can never be completely paid. Legally, you're running into some pretty stiff obstacles.

We're never going to 100% cut out the risk of impaired drivers. Trying to find the silver bullet solution is wasting time, effort, and resources that could be directed towards multiple other things that could prevent more of these tragedies.

 

[sepHF]

such horrific news. As a father with a young child this just hits a chord. My boy constantly wants to ride bikes too, you just never know whats going to happen with idiots on the road.

I always had a soft spot for Gaudreau, growing up i was an undersized player too. I've always been a big fan of guys like Johnny, St Louis, Zucc etc who persevere in a contact sport due to sheer will, determination and skill. He was an absolute treat to watch. I'm just sick for the whole family and hockey community at large

today really sucks

 

[JPT]

Agreed. It’s just bizarre you can get essentially the same punishment for being not intoxicated while driving as you can being on your second actual intoxicated driving charge in a month.

For sure. There are a lot of inequities in the US legal system. They certainly don't help in getting people to trust the system.

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

That is just victim blaming of the most problematic variety.
It's like saying we've needlessly created a dangerous environment, now whoever doesn't adapt to it is doing so at his own risk.

I thought the US prides itself in being the land of freedom. Now obviously everyone and their granny knows that this is just a fairy tale for the most gullible amongst us.

But even here the freedom to ride a bike with no potential to harm anyone needs to supercede the "freedom" to drunkenly drive a 2000+ kilo machine.

Our judicial system in BC/Canada does nothing to offenders.

There was a toddler who was killed on the curb in downtown Vancouver by a guy who has had numerous charges and traffic infractions in 2021. Numerous witnesses said he was driving dangerously and ran a red light. The Judge threw out the case citing the plaintiff had a momentary lapse in judgement.

There's a clear precedence of escaping repercussions when you use a vehicle. I said this in our subforum but it should be a privilege to operate a motor vehicle, not a right.

 

[norrisnick]

First, you don’t get to tell other people what their statements mean.

Taking a bike ride in a rural area at sundown/night is a dangerous choice. It just is. Your desire for that to be a safe activity doesn’t supersede the plain fact that it is not safe.

Making a choice to do an inherently dangerous thing does not make you accountable for a crime committed against you.

But I do get to tell you what what your statement comes across as regardless of how many times you try to say that what you're saying is not what you mean.

But what does it make you? Irresponsible? Reckless? Not saying the words doesn't mean you aren't ascribing a measure of responsibility on the Gaudreaus.

You don't say the actual words, but you're doing an incredibly interpretive dance all around them.

 

[tarheelhockey]

So if a girl gets raped, do you get to say "Well, she should know that wearing a short skirt might invite some people to do this".

You're still victim blaming. All these things can be true. The "advice" you're giving can be true, but that advice is still victim blaming.

Absolutely nobody is suggesting that the Gaudreaus “invited” someone to kill them, and the rape parallel is absolutely disgusting.

 

[ChicagoBullsFan]

Why young athletes have to die in young age.
First Kobe Bryant and now Johnny and Matthew Gaudreau. These news SUCKS.

 

[Leafs1991]

People and their outrage these days. Is it really so bad to suggest that could be a lesson if it's the case? Lesson number 1. Don't drink and drive. 1b. Don't drive recklessly/aggressively 3. Do what you can to protect yourself from reckless drivers when on the road, especially if you're on a bike/motorcycle.

By the sounds of the story, they were heading in the same direction, so the impact would be limited.

*IF* is a key word in my statement. If they weren't wearing helmets and they died due to head injuries, it's a really tough reminder.

If they were wearing helmets and/or it wouldn't have mattered, my statement is null and void.

It's a tragedy regardless. I don't get what's so insane/evil to suggest that there's lessons to be learned from all perspectives about how this can be avoided. In fact it's really the only thing that can be done. And no I'm not victim blaming. I despise reckless driving, intoxicated or not.

We don't know if they were wearing helmets and until you hear differently, I am not sure that it is something to be considered. As a cyclist myself, it is almost impossible to know how close those cars are as MANY of them are superquiet and virtually silent when they drive by. I have been surprised so many times as I have to watch the road in front of me and can't be always watching the mirror that I do have.

You honestly sound super ignorant to cycling and to assume that a lesson can be learned here when you know nothing is insane. On a rural road, the speed is either 50km/h and up to 80km/hr depending on the road. There may also be a lack of a shoulder to ride on. Add on that you have extremely quiet cars and those speeds and it is a recipe for disaster for people to get hit suddenly and not have any chance to protect themselves.

It is extremely insensitive and unempathetic to make the assumptions you are here given you KNOW NOTHING. Do you lack compassion? Or in the event of any disaster do you just go straight to being a robot and learning "lessons". Honestly, my gosh bud.

 

[Patrik26]

What I can tell you is that as a life long resident of New Jersey, I fully expect the sentence for the accused killer to be way less than anyone thinks. This state does not justly punish severe crime. Expect 6-10 years and he’ll probably serve some fraction of that before release.

Of course not. The criminal has rights. The same as the victim. Consider the proponents.