Post-Game Talk: Jets hijack attack win 4-3

[Jet]

Poor clearing attempts are just that, I don't think those particular events are being blamed on system play. Blaming the system isn't an absoulute. Viewing the Jets as a whole, I think their positioning leaves a lot to be desired in the D zone and their options in transition are limited once they regain possession. Bad decisions are part of it but so are the decisions available to them pretty consistently. When we're going on 3-4 years of seeing this style of play, I don't think most of it is simply bad decisions.

I think it's a bit different this year, yet the same. Last year, I don't think our D was skilled enough to push quick zone exits, but we still saw chronic issues with bad clears and or passes. This year, we are still seeing the same bad clears and exit passes, from the D I think it's more new guys getting used to systems and partners, but from the forwards again it's just ill advised plays.

In order to confirm whether this is the main problem or just a bias in my mind that gets confirmed every time it happens, I am going to be mindful to remember every time the Jets get running around in their zone, what event allowed it to happen. We do struggle with breaking cycles and that could be (probably is) systemic, but if we can limit the event that allows that cycle to begin, then we can reduce the amount of time in our zone which should improve things significantly.

 

[Channelcat]

.......and gotta say, how good is Ehlers? Dude is a gdamn gamebreaker.

 

[White Out 902]

The reverse Minnesota

 

[Jet]

.......and gotta say, how good is Ehlers? Dude is a gdamn gamebreaker.

He's no Kyle Connor... but...

 

[EpicGingy]

Watched a highlight package, that was an incredible snipe by Ehlers to tie the game.

There were a lot of egregiously bad turnovers though, that really needs to start getting cleaned up.

 

[Snot Rocket]

Play the shyte out of Wheeler, Mo, everyone knows that Covid doesn't affect the endothelium in every single organ, and that it especially spares the lungs.

Let's hope that he was just testing positive but had no symptoms or very minor.
Guess we will find out soon enough.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

I understand people don't like the system but what I continually see in our zone is poor clearing attempts and bad decisions. That is not systems.

The players need to start executing better, plain and simple.

Yes, I'm sure there is a better schema for reducing time spent in our zone but even in the last minute we had two awful clearing attempts that luckily ended up on a Jets stick or we could have been going into OT. The one that drives me crazy is a forward has possession in our zone inside our blue line abs they make a cute little dish to the inside of the ice that gets picked off. If your up with less than 5 minutes left that needs to be chipped out.

I don't know if it's a system issue or just players that aren't good enough in defending. I wish I could know the game at that level to tell the difference. I just see a salary cap team that has lots of weapons, yet gets often outplayed by the opposition, and it is most striking when we're defending in our own zone. It's really frustrating to watch.

 

[kanadalainen]

Let's hope that he was just testing positive but had no symptoms or very minor.
Guess we will find out soon enough.

Exactly, my comment was a bit over the top. My hunch (only a guess and I have no data) is that as he was double vaccinated, his symptoms were minor. It will be nice to have him back. If they are green lighting him to play one would assume his physical condition is at minimum, very good.

 

[Royale With Cheese]

Poor clearing attempts are just that, I don't think those particular events are being blamed on system play. Blaming the system isn't an absoulute. Viewing the Jets as a whole, I think their positioning leaves a lot to be desired in the D zone and their options in transition are limited once they regain possession. Bad decisions are part of it but so are the decisions available to them pretty consistently. When we're going on 3-4 years of seeing this style of play, I don't think most of it is simply bad decisions.

Yep, the bolded is the key. Personnel changes but we look the same generally speaking.

 

[Jet]

I don't know if it's a system issue or just players that aren't good enough in defending. I wish I could know the game at that level to tell the difference. I just see a salary cap team that has lots of weapons, yet gets often outplayed by the opposition, and it is most striking when we're defending in our own zone. It's really frustrating to watch.

I think as Ducky10 so wisely pointed out, it's 2 seperate issues at play, here:

1> Our system is preventing us from breaking up the opponents possession in our zone, and allowing dangerous chances via open passing lanes and easy access to net front.
2> Our players are not making good decisions with the puck resulting in turnovers that extend our time defending in our zone. Whether it be a bad pass or a blocked clear, these are issues that players of our ilk should not be making regularly.

 

[surixon]

I think it's a bit different this year, yet the same. Last year, I don't think our D was skilled enough to push quick zone exits, but we still saw chronic issues with bad clears and or passes. This year, we are still seeing the same bad clears and exit passes, from the D I think it's more new guys getting used to systems and partners, but from the forwards again it's just ill advised plays.

In order to confirm whether this is the main problem or just a bias in my mind that gets confirmed every time it happens, I am going to be mindful to remember every time the Jets get running around in their zone, what event allowed it to happen. We do struggle with breaking cycles and that could be (probably is) systemic, but if we can limit the event that allows that cycle to begin, then we can reduce the amount of time in our zone which should improve things significantly.

As I've said we are fine if we get the puck out cleanly and quickly. It's when we don't get it out quickly that things fall apart.

I saw numerous instances last night of our M2M with all our players on an individual player and our guys were essentially all over the ice. If you force a T/O it has to be incredibly hard to know where to send your breakout pass as you have no idea where your teammates are going to be.

I think we need to switch to an overload system and have our players in predictable places for when we get the puck back.

 

[surixon]

The Jets' biggest problem continues to be turnovers in their zone, often when they are looking for zone exits. Some of it is just bad / soft plays (like the turnovers by Dubois), and some of it is just trying to fly into transition too quickly (something Connor / Scheifele have struggled with). But there is also just hesitation and trying to decide what to do, which I think comes from having a much too spread out structure and then D searching for the passing lane. On the Ducks' first goal, DeMelo made a bad D-to-D pass to Schmidt that Schmidt had to retrieve on the boards, but then Schmidt was too slow in moving the puck, so he got stripped and it was in the back of the net.

I think the mistakes (like Dubois') can be cleaned up fairly easily. But the Jets also need to develop a more compact structure, and then spend some time together as a team so that they aren't constantly thinking about the next pass. That has been exacerbated by having to mix up positions and lines at forward.

A positive aspect is that the Jets are finding some offense in the absence of Scheifele, which they really haven't had in previous years. A lot of that is by putting Connor and Dubois together to create a fast and dangerous line. Ehlers will always generate offense. Maurice likes to keep successful lines together (particularly from an offensive perspective), so I would bet he keeps Connor with Dubois, and moves Scheifele into a slot alongside Ehlers. Copp has firmly grabbed a top-6 forward role at this point. For all of the angst about his skill level, he's putting together another really strong season offensively. I have been pleasantly surprised by Stastny's strong play so far this season. I expected more of a drop-off in his play due to age and a lack-lustre pre-season. But he's been really strong in Scheifele's absence.

The D is still working out the kinks. I think Pionk and Dillon had a really rough start, but have been better in the past few games. A few of their chances against have been caused by bad forward play. Morrissey is having a strong bounce-back season. Schmidt brings really strong puck-moving, but he has had some problems with the details in his game, mainly inaccurate passes. I think that will likely stabilize.

Yeah I have noticed that our M2M system often has all our players spread out throughout the entire defensive zone as everyone is taking a man. It makes for a predictable transition play next to impossible if we recover the puck.

I'd be fine with a simple box like defensive structure (essentially what Anaheim was running last night) but co tinue to think the strong side overload would be the best system for this group.

 

[robertocarlos]

Ehlers lives at 222 Tudor Terrace.

 

[Howard Chuck]

I like that but I also like Svetchikov with Dubois, as he drives the net pretty good. Move Wheeler down to Lowry's line and you have a heavy checking line, with some talent.

I would like to see that tried but it would never happen. Not because it wouldn’t be good for the overall team, but because of the hierarchy on the team.

Sports is a ‘win however you can, within the rules’ kind of experience.

 

[surixon]

I would like to see that tried but it would never happen. Not because it wouldn’t be good for the overall team, but because of the hierarchy on the team.

Sports is a ‘win however you can, within the rules’ kind of experience.

It will be interesting to see what kind of shape Wheeler is in after his 2 week quarantine. We saw what that did to Dubois last year and PLD didn't have COVID or any symptoms unlike Wheeler.

It might be prudent to start Wheeler on the third with pp time to bring him up to speed. Do I think it will happen, not likely but it's how I would approach the situation.

 

[RustyCat]

Great win and all but how many years has Mark Wheeler been with the team and never even showed up on the scoresheet? Talk about a nobody....

 

[Atoyot]

Top 2 lines shouldn't be split up. Put Harkins or Ves with Scheif and Wheeler. I say this knowing full well that Connor will be back on their wing within 2 games of them being back.

 

[DRW204]

Is there any cases of legit nhl fwds coming back after covid(with symptoms) and how they faired?

 

[surixon]

Is there any cases of legit nhl fwds coming back after covid(with symptoms) and how they faired?

I'd look at Dallas and Vancouver last year and see how their players faired.

I know it took Mackinnon a number of games to get back up to speed this year as he was in the protocol for a bit.

 

[Whileee]

Yeah I have noticed that our M2M system often has all our players spread out throughout the entire defensive zone as everyone is taking a man. It makes for a predictable transition play next to impossible if we recover the puck.

I'd be fine with a simple box like defensive structure (essentially what Anaheim was running last night) but co tinue to think the strong side overload would be the best system for this group.

Really good point about the M2M and structure for transition. I think that regardless of the effectiveness of M2M defensively, it creates a really unpredictable structure if the Jets do get a stop and turnover, and it contributes to the chaos we've seen over the past few years with respect to zone exits and transition. If the Jets don't find a way to fix their zone exits, they are going to continue to suffer the consequences at both ends of the ice. Having a better D at puck retrieval and puck movement should help, but the forwards need to be better at this, and it might start with positioning. There are also some individual players that are just really bad at zone exits, including Connor, Wheeler and Scheifele. Until last night's gaffes, Dubois had been relatively effective.

So, it's a combination of systems and individual play. The system needs to make zone exits and transition more consistent, and players need to be more committed to getting zone exits.

 

[BoneDocUK]

Great win and all but how many years has Mark Wheeler been with the team and never even showed up on the scoresheet? Talk about a nobody....

Mam, you guys are so quick to dump on Mark Wheeler. Guy works his ass off, leaves it all out there on the ice, plays the right way and takes care of the details, and just because he isn’t some Fancy Dan with a shooter’s mentality, he takes the flack when things go wrong.

So what if he never shows up on the scoresheet — or, indeed, anywhere else beyond the kielbasa-addled ravings of Dennis B and opposing colour commentators who’ve never done that deep dive into the 22 guys on the Jets roster?

Come the playoffs, you’re gonna thank your lucky stars we got a warrior like Mark Wheeler in the lineup.

I endured this whole damn frustrating game, only to go on kid duty for the last 11 minutes and so missed most of what was good in it. Thanks, schoolyard flu!

 

[voyageur]

Top 2 lines shouldn't be split up. Put Harkins or Ves with Scheif and Wheeler. I say this knowing full well that Connor will be back on their wing within 2 games of them being back.

I can see Maurice going back to Connor-Scheifele-Wheeler, he trusts those guys. I'd be less inclined to break up Copp-Stastny-Ehlers because that's been a strong line consistently. But then you are left with Dubois and Lowry as the remaining two centres, and I'd be a little surprised to see them together. I think you will start to see some different combinations after a while.

I do like your idea of moving Harkins or Ves up especially with Scheif-Wheeler, but there is no way Adam Lowry is a 4th line centre. He's the heart of this team, with strong physical play in the defensive end, and momentum building shifts.

Be interesting to see how Maurice sees it.

 

[snowkiddin]

Maybe …

Ehlers Scheifele Wheeler
Connor PLD Copp
Stastny Lowry Vesalainen
Harkins Nash Svechnikov

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Well happy to get a win.

The single biggest issue with this team is defensive zone puck management. We don't manage it very well and don't break it out that well and it leads to chaos.

I'm not worried about our offense as we are starting to generate more and dangerous chances.

No individual reports today i was going to give everyone a pass given the news that came out. I'll just say what I liked.

I liked that Fly came alive late. That has to help his confidence.

Dubois flying like he can with the puck and his hybrid of speed, power and skill will be a big time addition by the team.

Ves showing more confidence is good

I have been a little conflicted about the need for a coaching change. Wanting it because after 8 years, Maurice is just not working, wanting a new voice, etc.

But you have been so right about D zone systems that I am fully on board now.

I think you have been wrong about 1 thing though. You have called our D zone system M2M, or some kind of hybrid M2M. I don't think it is M2M, zone, or a hybrid of those 2. It is just all 5 guys take turns chasing the puck until it is either in our net or the other team makes a mistake and the puck comes out.

I had hoped that with the personnel changes we would not be getting hemmed in like that so much anymore. Wrong! Just effing awful! It isn't the personnel. It is the system, or lack of a system.

Ducks are a team just nicely into a rebuild. They have some nice looking prospects who are already playing in the NHL. They are not a good team, not even close. What will our D be like against good teams?

I'll take the 2 pts. These things have a way of evening out. You lose some you deserve to win too. I enjoyed the last 1:20 of that game. The good parts were pretty much all once we finally got the puck out of the D zone.

Svech and Vesalainen are both getting better, PLD is our best player right now. Copp, Connor, Ehlers are all playing well.

 

[robertocarlos]

Lowry was all on his own one shift. Maybe more than the one, as I don't watch the game closely all the time.