Jeremy Roenick, Shea Weber and Pavel Datsyuk inducted into the Hockey Hall of Fame

[mr figgles]

Okay, so many people voted for him, and many people voted for him.

Sorry to break it to you, but these are not accomplishments.


An absolute joke that Weber is in, and decisions like these keep diluting the HHoF.

Your post is a joke. All of the major individual awards are voted on except the Ross and Richard. Take away those, and what does that leave most hall of famers with? What did Lidstrom and Datsyuk accomplish? I’m sure your next post will be they have team accomplishments like cup wins. I’ll save you the time and remind you that Spencer Knight is now a cup winner too.

 

[abo9]

Meh, idk about Weber.

Guys like Shea Weber & Ryan Getzlaf are the guys who I think work perfectly as the upper echelon of "hall of very good" and should demarcate where the HOF starts. I think Weber should be left out to hold the line of high standards. (I know the standards have already been badly compromised many times but no need to keep lowering the bar as a result).

Very good player with a very high peak no doubt. Was perennially a top 5 Dman for many years but no Norris, no cups. He has 3x Norris finalist but so does PK Subban (including a win). Mike Green finished 2nd two years in a row directly preceding Weber finishing 2nd two years in a row so it doesn't mean so much that it makes your HOF case on its own. Only 3x did he have 50+ points in a season as well (I know lower scoring era).

Really amazing defenceman but the kinda guy I'd like to use as the grocery stick between HOF and not.

lmao comparing Shea Weber to Mike Green and PK Subban, but especially Mike Green.

There's really not many defensemen +- 5 years of Weber that I would take ahead of him. Peak Erik Karlsson. Keith and Doughty have a case. Who am I forgetting?

 

[OKR]

Who would be a better induction today?

Haven’t thought about that, but you seriously think Weber should be a first-balot HHOF? If there were no better options, then don’t include anyone.

 

[Curufinwe]

It’s like the hall of very good. Roenick doesn’t belong and Weber isn’t a first ballot guy.

They already put Turgeon in.

 

[HFpapi]

lmao comparing Shea Weber to Mike Green and PK Subban, but especially Mike Green.

There's really not many defensemen +- 5 years of Weber that I would take ahead of him. Peak Erik Karlsson. Keith and Doughty have a case. Who am I forgetting?

I didn't "compare" I said they also have (in Green's case) back-to-back Norris runner up finishes much like Weber and (in Subban's case) three total Norris noms. I used it to illustrate that those accolades alone aren't HOF worthy and beyond that Weber doesn't have much to hang his hat on in terms of resume even though he was better than those two and had HOF talent.

Basically just preemptively rebuking any argument that despite never winning, 3 Norris noms should be enough. Weber simply doesn't have the stats, trophies, or awards IMO and a couple Norris noms and post-season all-star teams doesn't compensate.

 

[Curufinwe]

No issue with any of them getting in, but Weber as a first balot? Plenty of better and more deserving players had to wait for much longer.

As Jeff Marek said, Hockey Men love Shea Weber.

 

[MikeK]

Datsyuk is a no-brainer. But Roenick and a 1st ballot Weber over guys still waiting? Crazy

 

[Rebels57]

Datsyuk is a no-brainer. But Roenick and a 1st ballot Weber over guys still waiting? Crazy

Weber I agree with, but Roenick is in the 500+ goal, 700+ assist club. He also has good Playoff numbers, and was a superstar personality.

 

[MoneyManny]

Weber was the beloved #1D and team captain of the Montreal Canadiens. This is the hockey hall of fame, not the hall of points. That alone will usually tip the votes when players are on the fence.

Is he a first ballot HOFer if the Subban trade somehow never happens and he retires a Predator?

 

[MikeK]

Weber I agree with, but Roenick is in the 500+ goal, 700+ assist club. He also has good Playoff numbers, and was a superstar personality.

Fair point on Roenick.

 

[djeez]

Guys guys it's the HOCKEY Hall of Fame, not the NHL Hall of Fame. Weber is first ballot all day.

 

[Lshap]

Shea Weber was among the NHL's top defencemen for about 15 years and the captain for both his teams, and he was Team Canada's top-pairing D for two Gold Medal winning teams.

There was no doubt about his inclusion to the Hall.

 

[Bruins4Lifer]

Got no problem with the Datsyuk and Roenick picks. Datsyuk deserved to be in right away and Roenick's been waiting for 10+ years so I'm fine with his selection now.

Weber probably deserved to be in too but I'm a bit surprised he got in right away. Thought it'd be a 4-8 year wait for him.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Okay, so many people voted for him, and many people voted for him.

Sorry to break it to you, but these are not accomplishments.


An absolute joke that Weber is in, and decisions like these keep diluting the HHoF.

Being a 4x all star actually is a significant accomplishment. Weber’s AS awards are identical to HOF’er Marcel Pronovost.

I agree that he’s a very borderline choice, but credit where it’s due. He was one vote away from the Norris, twice, including a year where Lidstrom took it on a “career achievement” reputation vote.

His AS voting is a better indicator of his actual HOF credentials, which were a razor’s edge away from including “two time Norris winner” which is an auto-induction historically.

 

[MessierThanThou]

Fleury was 7th in points for the Flames, as a rookie, when they won the cup. I wouldn't call that a passenger by any stretch of the imagination. He's also finished his career as a 1.00 PPG player and is LITERALLY the only player in NHL history, maybe even professional hcokey history, that has a penalty kill hattrick.

The only player even close to his small stature with a similar career is Martin St. Louis, who spent most of his career playing in a less physical era than Fleury.

To be able to have the kind of career in the NHL with his size in that era is freakish to be honest.

He 100% deserves to be in the HHoF.

I'm sorry, but being 7th in points on your team as a forward doesn't exactly scream "integral part of the team." I mean if Clark Gilles, Bernie Federko, and Kevin Lowe are in the Hall, then Theo definitely deserves to go in, but it shouldn't be like that.

 

[Beukeboom Fan]

The HOF has really just diminished it’s glory over the years. Roenick? Weber? Really?

How many games did you see Roenick play in his prime?

 

[Ezpz]

Weber was the #1 D on team Canada that had Pronger, Doughty, Keith, and Niedermayer. Guys peaking in individual awards above Weber when he was better than them every other year of their career doesn't lessen his case. For the 2010s I don't think there's anyone you take above Weber. Doughty and Karlsson had consistency issues and Pietrangelo just isn't as good as Weber.

Like Giordano had an insane single-season and won a Norris but was worse than Weber in every other year of their careers head to head. Yet HF would argue Giordano has a better case.

 

[cptjeff]

Shea Weber was among the NHL's top defencemen for about 15 years and the captain for both his teams, and he was Team Canada's top-pairing D for two Gold Medal winning teams.

There was no doubt about his inclusion to the Hall.

Seriously, go back to any "which players playing now will be in the HOF" thread from the mid 2010s and Weber's name would be on every list. I'm genuinely mystified that so many people think that his inclusion is in any way out of line. I guess they only watched hockey seriously during the later part of his career when he was good but not that special, but man, if you saw him during the Nashville years? He could play skill stick and positional defense and shut you down that way, or he could blow you up and physically punish you like no one else in the league. Absolutely one of the best, and when he lost out on the Norris to Lidstrom's lifetime achievement award, the outrage 'round these parts was real.

 

[Soundgarden]

Based on my opinion of him as a player. I don't think he has the stats or hardware needed either.

He's closer to two norrises than several Norris winners and HHOFers. No hardware is basically a technicality, he has a legitimate case of being the best defenseman three different years.

He led defensemen in goals several times and one of the few defensemen to lead his team in goals multiple times.

 

[NotCommitted]

Congrats to all three on the honor. As someone who lived in Chicago and watched Roenick’s entire career, I’m a bit surprised as he never looked like a HHOF player and not even locally was he ever discussed as future HHOF guy, but times and standards change. I would have placed Zetterberg and Mogilny in before him.

If you had played NHL '94 you'd understand better just how good he was

 

[Voight]

Seriously, go back to any "which players playing now will be in the HOF" thread from the mid 2010s and Weber's name would be on every list. I'm genuinely mystified that so many people think that his inclusion is in any way out of line. I guess they only watched hockey seriously during the later part of his career when he was good but not that special, but man, if you saw him during the Nashville years? He could play skill stick and positional defense and shut you down that way, or he could blow you up and physically punish you like no one else in the league. Absolutely one of the best, and when he lost out on the Norris to Lidstrom's lifetime achievement award, the outrage 'round these parts was real.

It boggles my mind. Any discussion here or anywhere of the top defensemen during his prime had him either #1 or at worst, top 3. I get people have a what have you done for me lately mentality but holy crap, this guys prime wasn't that long ago.

He wasn't some star defensemen in the 70s that 85% of this site didn't see play.

 

[CanadienShark]

He's closer to two norrises than several Norris winners and HHOFers. No hardware is basically a technicality, he has a legitimate case of being the best defenseman three different years.

He led defensemen in goals several times and one of the few defensemen to lead his team in goals multiple times.

Sounds like we can agree to disagree. I think his inclusion (along with others already in there) really cheapens the meaning of Hall of Fame.

 

[GMR]

Shea Weber is the only one I kind of disagree with. Yes, he point up good numbers while playing well over 1000 games. However, no Cup or trophies.

I hate Weber but if Kevin Lowe is in the HOF why wouldn’t Weber be? He was a much better player even if the team accomplishments are missing.

 

[bleedblue94]

Weber was just as good as Keith was when he won his 2nd Norris, if not better. He has three years where he had a legitimate chance at a Norris. He played on a team with no offense, of course he doesn't have a cup.

Because at when playing, Weber was considered better or in debate of top 3 Dman along with those guys for 5-6 years.

What happened to the years of posters on here seemingly saying Cups don't matter or cups shouldn't matter!

2010-11 NHL Awards Voting | Hockey-Reference.com

www.hockey-reference.com

Idk how many exact voters got a vote, but Lidstrom had 8 more ballot votes than Weber. If 1 just notched Weber higher or had him top 2 at all, he wouldn't of lost a Norris he desevered over a 40 year old Lidstrom. To judge a player as not having a trophy is that minuscule of a factor. It's a really funny rationale to see online here.

Weber was one of the best d in the league but he was never the best, Norris aside. No one ever said that guy is the best in the entire league. He was a great player, I am not denying that, but the issue here is the Hall of Fame is turning into the Fame of great players, not the Fame of the elite of the elite. It isn't an issue with just this year's selections, this has been happening for awhile.

 

[SheldonJPlankton]

F

What was so wrong about one of the best centres of his era getting in right away....

FWIW, there is no centre designation for the HHOF. It's a player category. To argue that Sundin was deserving of a first-ballot selection, you have to argue that he was the best player eligible.

And then you have to ignore the revelations of game fixing in the 2006 Olympics.