Confirmed with Link: Jeff Skinner -- Bought Out 6/29/24

[Jim Bob]

Yes.

Even with his crappy deployment (for creating offense) he is still 10th in the NHL in individual HDCF/60 among 361 NHL forwards who’ve been played 100+ mins

But that isn't a "high event player" to me.

I thought his HDCA/60 numbers were good.

When I read the term "high event player", I think of a guy that has good HDCF/60 numbers and bad HDCA/60 numbers.

Basically, it is good chances both ways when said player is on the ice.

I thought part of the puzzling usage of Skinner right now is that his defensive numbers look pretty good.

 

[joshjull]

But that isn't a "high event player" to me.

I thought his HDCA/60 numbers were good.

When I read the term "high event player", I think of a guy that has good HDCF/60 numbers and bad HDCA/60 numbers.

Basically, it is good chances both ways when said player is on the ice.

I thought part of the puzzling usage of Skinner right now is that his defensive numbers look pretty good.

Oh ok. I say what your saying now. No, he hasn’t been an issue defensively.

 

[Caroline Says ll]

First the narrative was that Skinner has to commit to the system before moving up so that is why he was on the 4th line.

He produced chances and the line had no glaring issues D wise.

Now the narrative is shifted that Skinner is not a top 6 player as stated by Krueger.

For someone with the the credentials of a motivational speaker, surgery, life coach etc you would imagine that Krueger would see the value in clear and honest communication. At this point it is obvious that Krueger dislikes Skinner and there is not a single thing Skinner can do fix that.

The ridiculous thing is Skinner is overpaid but to create some fictional scenario about not being able to play in the top 6 is asinine. The guy scored 40 goals in the top six before Krueger came here. Since Krueger time I have seen Sheary, Thompson, Sheahan, Vesey etc in the top six..

 

[joshjull]

There seems to be something happening behind the scenes between Ralph and Skinner. That is the only logical explanation that I can think of.

I don’t know that it has to be about anything other than how Krueger perceives players and how that impacts his use of them. I say that because his view of Skinner has been consistent since taking over. No Jack, No PP1, not out much with goalie pulled, No OT, etc. None of this started this season.

We have over a years worth of him using players in roles/usages that either didn’t make sense or wasn’t working. But he stubbornly sticks with them.

If you’re perceived by Krueger as a low event, “safe”, defensive player you get favorable treatment that doesn’t match your performance level. If you’re a vet on top of that its even more ridiculous.

Given everything we've seen, there is no logical reason not to try pushing VO down the lineup at 5 on 5 and keeping him in his spot on PP1. On the latest PDOCast Dom talked about how Sam Gagner was used as a PP specialist as an example of the best way to use VO.

VO is a one trick pony. So, they need to maximize that one trick and use him less 5 on 5.

Putting Skinner with Eichel & Reinhart at 5 on 5 just makes sense if there isn't something else going on.

And leaving PP1 the way it is with VO in his office just makes sense, as well.

I agree with everything here.

 

[js31]

If you’re perceived by Krueger as a low event, “safe”, defensiver play you get favorable treatment that doesn’t match your performance level. If you’re a vet on top of that its even more ridiculous.

This 100%.

 

[Husko]

I'm pretty removed from closely following the team this year, but I've stayed up on what's happening through the board primarily, so forgive my ignorance, but:

Is there not a configuration of the lineup that can get Eichel, Staal, Hall, Skinner, Reinhart, and VO/Cozens all into the top six? I know sides matter, but given our darth of scoring, doesn't it at least seem worth it to force all our top players onto 2 lines and try to generate some scoring that way? Anyway, just my two cents. I'll head back to the happy Bills thread.

 

[Jim Bob]

I don’t know that it has to be about anything other than how Krueger perceives players and how that impacts his use of them. I say that because his view of Skinner has been consistent since taking over. No Jack, No PP1, not out much with goalie pulled, No OT, etc. None of this started this season.

We have over a years worth of him using players in roles/usages that either didn’t make sense or wasn’t working. But he stubbornly sticks with them.

If you’re perceived by Krueger as a low event, “safe”, defensive player you get favorable treatment that doesn’t match your performance level. If you’re a vet on top of that its even more ridiculous.

I guess I don't understand how a player like VO is somehow "safe" and Skinner is not.

Ralph is a smart guy. So, I don't understand how he can look at Skinner and VO and feel like VO is a "safe" player 5 on 5 and Skinner is not.

 

[Jim Bob]

I'm pretty removed from closely following the team this year, but I've stayed up on what's happening through the board primarily, so forgive my ignorance, but:

Is there not a configuration of the lineup that can get Eichel, Staal, Hall, Skinner, Reinhart, and VO/Cozens all into the top six? I know sides matter, but given our darth of scoring, doesn't it at least seem worth it to force all our top players onto 2 lines and try to generate some scoring that way? Anyway, just my two cents. I'll head back to the happy Bills thread.

Skinner-Eichel-Reinhart
Hall-Staal-Cozens

It isn't rocket science and someone as smart as Ralph should see the value in trying that top 6 for a few weeks and see what happens.

Drop VO down the lineup 5 on 5 and keep him on PP1.

Heck, giving Skinner more 5 on 5 ice time with Eichel and Reinhart also gives Jeff more chances to draw penalties. And given how the PP is humming, that helps the team even more.

 

[rangersblues]

The Skinner situation is just sad. It's like they are treating him like Play Now treated George Costanza and trying to get him to quit. I can't think of a comparable situation ever.

 

[Old Navy Goat]

I guess I don't understand how a player like VO is somehow "safe" and Skinner is not.

Ralph is a smart guy. So, I don't understand how he can look at Skinner and VO and feel like VO is a "safe" player 5 on 5 and Skinner is not.

I would say optics. Skinner likes to fly the zone while Olofsson at least appears to be in the right spot

 

[Paxon]

Skinner-Eichel-Reinhart
Hall-Staal-Cozens

It isn't rocket science and someone as smart as Ralph should see the value in trying that top 6 for a few weeks and see what happens.

Drop VO down the lineup 5 on 5 and keep him on PP1.

Heck, giving Skinner more 5 on 5 ice time with Eichel and Reinhart also gives Jeff more chances to draw penalties. And given how the PP is humming, that helps the team even more.

Yeah. It is easy to get them all (with only one of Cozens/Olofsson) in the top 6. Just replace Olofsson with Skinner, like you said. It is especially easy since Olofsson isn't good 5-on-5, anyhow, so introducing the chaos bomb that is Skinner likely has no negative impact on the line. It solves two problems in getting Olofsson out of the top 6 and giving Skinner a real chance to succeed. Line #2 is set unless and until they shit the bed.

 

[joshjull]

I guess I don't understand how a player like VO is somehow "safe" and Skinner is not.

Ralph is a smart guy. So, I don't understand how he can look at Skinner and VO and feel like VO is a "safe" player 5 on 5 and Skinner is not.

Is he though? I’m not trying to be snarky but Krueger’s flawed perceptions about players leading to poor usage goes well beyond Skinner/Olofsson.

-Last year Krueger said he was putting together a two way matchup 2nd line with a goal scoring winger, a two way center and a strong vet defensive conscience on the other wing. That sounds great in theory but in practice it was Skinner/Mojo/Sobotka. The only one that fit their description was Skinner.

-This year we have a 3rd line getting a balanced deployment (OZS% 48%) Which means they need to be providing some offense. They’ve not only not done that (only 1 goal). They’ve also been caved in every night. Yet they aren’t touched in part because of Krueger’s obsession with keeping PKers and vets in the lineup no matter their 5v5 performance.

- Krueger keeps giving chance after chance to Tage in the top 6 even after he keeps struggling/failing. Yet won’t do it for Mitts. Who got his first shot at it last night. Played only one shift between VO/Sam, drew a penalty and then sat the rest of the night in favor of a “safe” vet (Sheahan). Great message to a young player. Mitts also has a ridiculous OZS% of 28%. He’s not being put in a position to succeed but he’s played well despite that.

- Krueger favors what he feels are safer vet dmen in Irwin/Davidson over Borgen/Bryson

Those are just some examples. Krueger may be a smart man about the world in general. But his player evaluations are not representative of a smart hockey mind. All of the decision above have hurt the team he coaches.

 

[Bendium]

There is no way to spin it.....Krueger started and lost a staring contest with Jeff that he never should have been in. His refusal to blink has hurt the team and he will be fired for it......as he should be.

 

[debaser66]

it's a bit like in 2010 then when the Caps changed coaches and Ovechkin had his worst season because the coach didn't let him play.
A good example how much effect a coach can have on its players.
New coach, new goalie please

 

[Sabre the Win]

Report: Agent steps in after Buffalo Sabres' Jeff Skinner healthy scratch for third straight game - TSN.ca

"Play him or trade him" I would assume his agent is telling Kevyn with a Y Adams.

 

[joshjull]

Great open flow of communication between player and coach.

 

[joshjull]

 

[joshjull]

 

[joshjull]

 

[joshjull]

 

[Bones Malone]

*eyes narrow* well he is a bit taller than me...

 

[Fezzy126]

Now THAT is guy that sounds like a cancerous personality that's bad for the team, we need to get rid of him immediately...

 

[Royisgone]

I'm not sure if I believe Skinner when he says he wants to be in Buffalo.

I definitely don't believe his comments regarding seeing eye to eye with Ralph.

Are the Sabres doing all this to force Skinner to waive his no move clause so we can try to trade him? His K is not going to be easy to trade if that is the plan.

Did Ralph really not think Skinner was one his best 20 players last night, especially with Jack being out of the lineup?

How could the benching not be punitive in nature? But Ralph has said it isn't or at least it is based on play.

Yesterday Ralph said there is more to this behind the scenes that he can't be transparent about, and that he has to take all factors into consideration with these decisions, for the good of the team.

So what's the factor he doesn't want to talk about?

Does Skinner skip team meetings and tell Ralph "F U" when confronted about it in front of the team? Or what?

 

[brian_griffin]

I would say optics. Skinner likes to fly the zone while Olofsson at least appears to be in the right spot

I'd be far more trusting of Skinner on a 1-on-1, 1-on-2, 1-on-3 situation than VO. Nothing against Olofsson, but I think Skinner added to the top line makes the top line more dangerous 5v5 than the detraction of bumping Olofsson down the lineup. Moreover, Oloffson bumping Okposo down to the 4th line makes the 3rd line better and might even draw that line up to a close-to-net-neutral xG performance.

========
Good on Skinner for not wanting to negotiate or air grievances through the media.

 

[explore]

Now THAT is guy that sounds like a cancerous personality that's bad for the team, we need to get rid of him immediately...

Inside the Sabres' curious decision to keep Jeff Skinner as a healthy scratch – The Athletic

There was a blurb in Vogl's article in the Athletic that said:

"There are rumblings that the left winger has not embraced (or even attempted) the extra work being asked to shore up his deficiencies."

So while Skinner is competent, amiable, and professional in front of the mic I don't think that means that he isn't ignoring the coaches or being difficult behind the scenes

I think scratching someone like Skinner when the team isn't scoring is a very risky move for Krueger to make, and I don't think he'd make it if Skinner wasn't doing something egregious--despite both his and Skinner's statements about the other acting professionally