Jason Botterill Discussion 3

[Dubi Doo]

The point isn’t the cap, it’s that Botts thought Wilson was someone he needed to avoid arbitration with.

This is the same GM that thought Jordan Nolan belonged on an NHL roster.

Add Sobotka and Thompson to that list. Also, took him way too long to figure out Remi wasn't an NHL calibre player. The list of little annoyances has painted a picture of an incompetant GM.

I know some people want to give Botts the benefit of the doubt. They want one more offseason for him to prove himself. You know what? Maybe he does turn it around. Maybe he's evolved, and learned from all his dumb miscues over the past two years. I'm willing to give the average person a chance at redemption, but Botts isnt an average person. He's an NHL GM who can effectively alter the teams course with his decision making.

I'm a betting man who's played his share of Poker throughout the years. I ain't willing to go all-in on a pair of twos when there's a chance at a straight flush on the river just like I ain't willing to go all-in with the direction of this franchise with Botts at the helm. The odds of him turning it around are underwhelming to put it lightly.

 

[joshjull]

Add Sobotka and Thompson to that list. Also, took him way too long to figure out Remi wasn't an NHL calibre player. The list of little annoyances has painted a picture of an incompetant GM.

I know some people want to give Botts the benefit of the doubt. They want one more offseason for him to prove himself. You know what? Maybe he does turn it around. Maybe he's evolved, and learned from all his dumb miscues over the past two years. I'm willing to give the average person a chance at redemption, but Botts isnt an average person. He's an NHL GM who can effectively alter the teams course with his decision making.

I'm a betting man who's played his share of Poker throughout the years. I ain't willing to go all-in on a pair of twos when there's a chance at a straight flush on the river just like I ain't willing to go all-in with the direction of this franchise with Botts at the helm. The odds of him turning it around are underwhelming to put it lightly.

To me the biggest f*** up Botts made by far was hiring Housley as head coach. Its impact trickled through everything else. Complaining about insignificant things like Wilson’s deal or Remi Elie is somewhat pointless to me.

If he gets the coaching hire right it raises all boats within the organization. I hope Krueger is that guy but I’m in wait and see mode. Like you I don’t have a ton of faith right now. I‘ve been burned too much by this organization the last several years.

 

[DatGuy]

To me the biggest **** up Botts made by far was hiring Housley as head coach. Its impact trickled through everything else. Complaining about insignificant things like Wilson’s deal or Remi Elie is somewhat pointless to me.

If he gets the coaching hire right it raises all boats within the organization. I hope Krueger is that guy but I’m in wait and see mode. Like you I don’t have a ton of faith right now. I‘ve been burned too much by this organization the last several years.

I hope Krueger is the right man for the job. He has such a weird employment record, I don't know what to make of it; maybe that's why I'm sitting in my office posting on HFBoards and not GM of the Sabres.

 

[valet]

To me the biggest **** up Botts made by far was hiring Housley as head coach. Its impact trickled through everything else. Complaining about insignificant things like Wilson’s deal or Remi Elie is somewhat pointless to me.

If he gets the coaching hire right it raises all boats within the organization. I hope Krueger is that guy but I’m in wait and see mode. Like you I don’t have a ton of faith right now. I‘ve been burned too much by this organization the last several years.

I agree. We can't honestly evaluate last year's roster w Phil as coach. He didn't know what he was doing

We can sort of evaluate...... but not all the way

 

[Jame]

Add Sobotka and Thompson to that list. Also, took him way too long to figure out Remi wasn't an NHL calibre player. The list of little annoyances has painted a picture of an incompetant GM.

I know some people want to give Botts the benefit of the doubt. They want one more offseason for him to prove himself. You know what? Maybe he does turn it around. Maybe he's evolved, and learned from all his dumb miscues over the past two years. I'm willing to give the average person a chance at redemption, but Botts isnt an average person. He's an NHL GM who can effectively alter the teams course with his decision making.

I'm a betting man who's played his share of Poker throughout the years. I ain't willing to go all-in on a pair of twos when there's a chance at a straight flush on the river just like I ain't willing to go all-in with the direction of this franchise with Botts at the helm. The odds of him turning it around are underwhelming to put it lightly.

The people who dismiss all Botts small fails just don’t get it...

Of course the Housley fail is a bigger issue than Nolan/Eli’s/Wilson (and on and on).... but the point is that IF Kreuger gets this thing pointed and moving in the right direction, it will still be the guy who made all those shitty small moves who will still be building the roster.

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

I think Botts' main problem is that he undervalues his players he sells in trades.

He sells for current perceived market value, he doesn't trade for potential. He sells low and it's sickening.

For example, I can just imagine Botts getting royally ripped off selling Ristolainen, marketing him as a "50 point offensive d-man who's sh**y in his own end"....YES.... that may be CURRENT Risto, but you have to sell for MAXIMUM potential like Regier.

You want Risto? He's a future Norris 75 point D who's flawless in his own zone.
O'Rielly was used in a shutdown role and had less than 70 points,
You want O'Rielly? He's a future PPG two-way force if used in the right role.
You want Nylander? He's a future 80 point skill two-way winger. (I'm sure he'll sell for a cap dump instead)

If Botts is coming from the angle of ROR being a PPG 2-way center (which I called on this site BTW), we wouldn't end up with one of the worst trades of all time.

He sells low at current value when he can get so much more if he trades based on potential. Regier was routinely ripping off teams with this very philosophy.

He's good at buying though, give him that.

 

[old kummelweck]

My favorite part of the internet is people making shit up in their head, then getting mad about it. It's like when your wife has a dream about you cheating and is mad at you all day about it.

 

[Chainshot]

My favorite part of the internet is people making **** up in their head, then getting mad about it. It's like when your wife has a dream about you cheating and is mad at you all day about it.

Truer words were never spoken. And it doesn't even have to be cheating....

So I'm curious what came of the scouting meetings. We won't know of course, but will they be doing a Blue and Gold on the draft process this year? It's entertaining to get a glimpse into their process.

 

[Club]

I'm very soured by Botterill at the moment. He has to sign Skinner and bring in a couple key players to change this team going forward for me to be more on board with his tenure. (Along with seeing the product on the ice early next season) I'll admit, I've been one of the very few who thought this guy knew what he was doing (and even defended some of his moves) and right now, who knows. I like the Montour trade a lot, and have to see how the Krueger hiring fares..

But I'm not as comfortable with him at the helm. But let's see how the rest of June goes with the draft coming up. Hopefully it's a big off season for us, boys!

 

[Chainshot]

Per Botterill today on GR, they are having their pro scouting meetings.

 

[OkimLom]

Per Botterill today on GR, they are having their pro scouting meetings.

Regardless of the outcome of the Skinner saga, the teeth of the offseason for me was going to be what he does to fix/improve the rest of the team and how he replenishes the AHL team to keep it stable down there. This was an issue for me for Murray and continues with Botterill. After the the 2016-2017 season it was very obvious that needed to be fixed, and was ripe for reshaping with some role players leaving like Gionta, Franson, and openings for the the 4th line.

Then he traded away two forwards away in Ennis and Foligno, and created more opportunities to reshape the team. I've been disappointed since.

 

[Chainshot]

Regardless of the outcome of the Skinner saga, the teeth of the offseason for me was going to be what he does to fix/improve the rest of the team and how he replenishes the AHL team to keep it stable down there. This was an issue for me for Murray and continues with Botterill. After the the 2016-2017 season it was very obvious that needed to be fixed, and was ripe for reshaping with some role players leaving like Gionta, Franson, and openings for the the 4th line.

Then he traded away two forwards away in Ennis and Foligno, and created more opportunities to reshape the team. I've been disappointed since.

Rochester certainly needs a lot of work since almost all of the Sabre hopefuls at forward are in the running for roster spots, key offensive vets are some degree of UFA, and the goaltending is uncertain between injuries and free agency (and general average performance by those UFA's). I can't see them purely relying on their new defensemen down there either, that seems like a recipe for disaster.

That said, I continue to have reservations about the pro scouting staff and evaluation of players by Botterill. They've worn out my patience there, so even if they do sign or trade someone who could bounce back or be a surprise, my default setting is colored by Pouliot and Sobotka. I'm in the mind that they need to find guys who are demonstrably good at something now, which means I'm going to be less on the side of eye-test and more on the side of show me the metrics.

 

[Buffaloed]

My favorite part of the internet is people making **** up in their head, then getting mad about it. It's like when your wife has a dream about you cheating and is mad at you all day about it.

We implemented a Conjecture Outrage Tax in May Sabres Head Coach Search 2
Many posters haven't paid their tax bill. We're going to have to foreclose on their emotions.

 

[sabremike]

We implemented a Conjecture Outrage Tax in May Sabres Head Coach Search 2
Many posters haven't paid their tax bill. We're going to have to foreclose on their emotions.

Conjecture Outrage Taxation Is Theft!!!

 

[26CornerBlitz]

Jason Boterill on The Instigators (6/6/19)

 

[jc17]

Jason Boterill on The Instigators (6/6/19)

He said the same "until it's signed" line which makes it sound like it could be almost done, but its so hard to tell what it actually means.

Interesting that when Peters brings up Boldy, Turcotte, and Cauflield, Botts says "Oh you like the Americans"

 

[Jim Bob]

Jason Boterill on The Instigators (6/6/19)

For people that like YT

 

[Gabrielor]

For people that like YT

Sabres should put more content on YT. Super easy way to reach people.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

I don't see how it's possible to add 2-3 "core players" to this team. There isn't excess assets lying around waiting to be spent. There hasn't been since about 2015.

Maybe you can spin the 2nd 1st into a player, but trading #7 for immediate help would be a bad long term move. This team has been making poor long term moves since everyone ran DR out.

 

[Aladyyn]

I don't see how it's possible to add 2-3 "core players" to this team. There isn't excess assets lying around waiting to be spent. There hasn't been since about 2015.

Maybe you can spin the 2nd 1st into a player, but trading #7 for immediate help would be a bad long term move. This team has been making poor long term moves since everyone ran DR out.

There's this pretty good Swedish defenseman on the market...

 

[The Red Helmet]

Any chance the Pegulas bring the hammer down after the draft like they did with Whaley?

 

[Chainshot]

Any chance the Pegulas bring the hammer down after the draft like they did with Whaley?

Seems unlikely, especially if there isn't any other ex-Penguin regectamenta out there.

 

[Zip15]

Botts has to be feeling pretty embarrassed right now, doesn't he? And if you're one of the other GMs, you absolutely bust his balls about this the next time you see or talk to him, right?

 

[sabremike]

Honestly in terms of worst GM's in hockey history he's only behind Ed Johnson (the only GM so terrible he literally killed a team). He's even worse than Milbury because it took that clown more than 2 years to do the level of damage on LI that Botts did to us.

 

[Buffaloed]

Any chance the Pegulas bring the hammer down after the draft like they did with Whaley?

My dream scenario is Mike Vellucci is hired as associate head coach. Then Botts get the axe. Krueger is named president of hockey ops, Sexton is named GM, and Vellucci is named head coach. I think Botterill will be allowed one more screw up.