Value of: Jake Guentzel (with or without extension)

[Ledge And Dairy]

Yes, but Toronto would still have Matthews, Tavaras, and Marner, all of which are proven goal scorers. After Guentzel, we are fairly weak. Nylander is surplus in Toronto. Guentzel is NOT surplus in Pittsburgh.

If you want him in Calgary, you are coughing up more than Hanifin and Dube. Period.

Pass then, He's not worth more than that as a sole player. Your team may value him more because they lack any sort of replacement but other teams dont

 

[SEALBound]

Pass then, He's not worth more than that as a sole player. Your team may value him more because they lack any sort of replacement but other teams dont

Other teams won't value 28yo 40g scorers? Lol, ok. We'll keep him then.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Other teams won't value 28yo 40g scorers? Lol, ok. We'll keep him then.

Do you have reading comprehension problems? Where did I say that?

 

[SEALBound]

Do you have reading comprehension problems? Where did I say that?

Ummm...

Pass then, He's not worth more than that as a sole player. Your team may value him more because they lack any sort of replacement but other teams dont

So...yeah. Awkward. Move on dude.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Ummm...

So...yeah. Awkward. Move on dude.

Yeah you can't read.

I stated his value, I said your team may value him more because of team needs, and then repeated that other teams don't value him that high because your team needs are not relevant to them.

 

[SEALBound]

Yeah you can't read.

I stated his value, I said your team may value him more because of team needs, and then repeated that other teams don't value him that high because your team needs are not relevant to them.

Uh hu.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Okay not sure how that helps the Penguins really? After the 1yr he will presumably want more, no?

But really, the Pens would be in the same situation w/ Jake. He's going to want more (much more) after this season.
And if Brodie walks, then they have a ton of cap space the next year. Plus getting rid of Petry and his NMC would be beneficial. It's not going to be a great contract very soon.

I really like Jake, but I feel they need a different type of winger like Marner who can drive play for Sid. Jake isn't that player anymore.

I also know this is all fantasy land bc the Pens will NEVER trade Jake bc of the Crosby connection

 

[SEALBound]

But really, the Pens would be in the same situation w/ Jake. He's going to want more (much more) after this season.
And if Brodie walks, then they have a ton of cap space the next year. Plus getting rid of Petry and his NMC would be beneficial. It's not going to be a great contract very soon.

I really like Jake, but I feel they need a different type of winger like Marner who can drive play for Sid. Jake isn't that player anymore.

I also know this is all fantasy land bc the Pens will NEVER trade Jake bc of the Crosby connection

Yes and no, we have Carter coming off the books same time as Jake. You could pay Jake $8-9.5mil without much issue. And yeah, that's high but you're getting your comfy 1LW 40g scorer. I'd much rather than than a 6-7ish one for Brodie? Not sure what he wants.

I'll just recap this - trading Guentzel for a dman makes exactly ZERO sense. He's a 40g scorer for us. We can't get rid of that and replace it with...a dman.

If we are trading him, we need an effective forward coming back, likely with a different skill set. Think Neal for Hornqvist. You trade a 40g skill wing for a 25 guy who will provide the gritty, all out every shift, physicality that they were missing.

If Jake goes out, you want Matthew Tkachuck coming back (not today's MT but like a year or two ago).

 

[PensandCaps]

Yes and no, we have Carter coming off the books same time as Jake. You could pay Jake $8-9.5mil without much issue. And yeah, that's high but you're getting your comfy 1LW 40g scorer. I'd much rather than than a 6-7ish one for Brodie? Not sure what he wants.

I'll just recap this - trading Guentzel for a dman makes exactly ZERO sense. He's a 40g scorer for us. We can't get rid of that and replace it with...a dman.

If we are trading him, we need an effective forward coming back, likely with a different skill set. Think Neal for Hornqvist. You trade a 40g skill wing for a 25 guy who will provide the gritty, all out every shift, physicality that they were missing.

If Jake goes out, you want Matthew Tkachuck coming back (not today's MT but like a year or two ago).

Jake for Boone Jenner ? less production but more punch, you got your 3C and net front PP guy on a great deal.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Yes and no, we have Carter coming off the books same time as Jake. You could pay Jake $8-9.5mil without much issue. And yeah, that's high but you're getting your comfy 1LW 40g scorer. I'd much rather than than a 6-7ish one for Brodie? Not sure what he wants.

I'll just recap this - trading Guentzel for a dman makes exactly ZERO sense. He's a 40g scorer for us. We can't get rid of that and replace it with...a dman.

If we are trading him, we need an effective forward coming back, likely with a different skill set. Think Neal for Hornqvist. You trade a 40g skill wing for a 25 guy who will provide the gritty, all out every shift, physicality that they were missing.

If Jake goes out, you want Matthew Tkachuck coming back (not today's MT but like a year or two ago).

I thought the offer was Jake and Petry for Brodie and Marner? But I agree that I would not trade Jake for any defenseman in the league. Pens don't have any top flight wingers to replace him.

And I fully expect Jake to get $8-9M on his next deal.

Jake for Boone Jenner ? less production but more punch, you got your 3C and net front PP guy on a great deal.

Hard pass on that. If we're trading Jake, there has to be a top winger coming back to play with Sid

 

[PensandCaps]

I thought the offer was Jake and Petry for Brodie and Marner? But I agree that I would not trade Jake for any defenseman in the league. Pens don't have any top flight wingers to replace him.

And I fully expect Jake to get $8-9M on his next deal.



Hard pass on that. If we're trading Jake, there has to be a top winger coming back to play with Sid

You could probably make him into one. easily potting 30+ next to Crosby.

 

[SEALBound]

I thought the offer was Jake and Petry for Brodie and Marner? But I agree that I would not trade Jake for any defenseman in the league. Pens don't have any top flight wingers to replace him.

And I fully expect Jake to get $8-9M on his next deal.



Hard pass on that. If we're trading Jake, there has to be a top winger coming back to play with Sid

Oh yeah. I've been off on the Jake for Hanifin+Dube BS. More I think, I probably do that swap.

 

[Yepthatsme]

Because Guentzel and Hanifin are on respectively different levels in terms of their positional ranking in the league.

Guentzel was 36th in even strength scoring amongst forwards this season. Noah Hanifin was 29th in even strength scoring amongst defenseman this season. Last year Guentzel was 11th, and Hanifin was 20th. Once you account for Guentzel spending the majority of that time with Crosby, they actually line up almost identically in positional rankings. Noah Hanifin is just one of the most slept on players in the league because he doesn’t have a flashy bone in his body.

Guentzel is the better player, but Hanifin is younger and plays the more important position. Think their values are actually pretty even.

 

[SEALBound]

Jake for Boone Jenner ? less production but more punch, you got your 3C and net front PP guy on a great deal.

There would have to be a plus coming from CBJ. Not unlike Nashville adding Spaling - 3rd line player. Would love Roslovic but we'd have to add and I'm not sure what...

 

[PensandCaps]

If you're able to get Marner for Guentzel, you laugh all the way to the bank if you're the Penguins. Hell, I'd add something very good on top of Guentzel for Marner.

There would have to be a plus coming from CBJ. Not unlike Nashville adding Spaling - 3rd line player. Would love Roslovic but we'd have to add and I'm not sure what...

Would there be a + from Columbus? he's a very unique player and has scored at a 30 goal pace over the past two seasons, and plays centre. I wouldn't be mad at that swap tbh.

I don't think Roslovic is all that good, but certainly wouldn't mind him.

 

[SEALBound]

If you're able to get Marner for Guentzel, you laugh all the way to the bank if you're the Penguins. Hell, I'd add something very good on top of Guentzel for Marner.


Would there be a + from Columbus? he's a very unique player and has scored at a 30 goal pace over the past two seasons, and plays centre. I wouldn't be mad at that swap tbh.

I don't think Roslovic is all that good, but certainly wouldn't mind him.

Well it very clearly was NOT Guentzel for Marner straight up.

I like Roslovic. I'd love to have him on the wing or at 3C.

 

[squashmaple]

There would have to be a plus coming from CBJ. Not unlike Nashville adding Spaling - 3rd line player. Would love Roslovic but we'd have to add and I'm not sure what...

You’re a bit backwards there. Roslovic is on his way out of Columbus one way or another. Jarmo and JD have essentially said as much, that they’re moving out the toxic elements in the locker room. He could probably be had quite cheap.

Jenner, however, is going nowhere. Skillset 31 other teams would love to have, signed three more years to a sweetheart deal when he could’ve walked, team captain to a very young team. His value to Columbus far exceeds any trade that would be worth it for another team to bother.

 

[Guttersniped]

Weird contribution to the thread. So basically the Pens shouldn't do a single thing since it doesn't matter.

“Hey, what do think Guentzel could get back in a trade? With or without an extension?”

“Life is fundamentally meaningless.”

 

[66-30-33]

If Jake is traded hopefully Rust goes after. I want some new wingers!

 

[Gurglesons]

You’re a bit backwards there. Roslovic is on his way out of Columbus one way or another. Jarmo and JD have essentially said as much, that they’re moving out the toxic elements in the locker room. He could probably be had quite cheap.

Jenner, however, is going nowhere. Skillset 31 other teams would love to have, signed three more years to a sweetheart deal when he could’ve walked, team captain to a very young team. His value to Columbus far exceeds any trade that would be worth it for another team to bother.

But if you get Guentzel it means he can’t rob you guys of like 8 points a year.

 

[DearDiary]

Guentzel was 36th in even strength scoring amongst forwards this season. Noah Hanifin was 29th in even strength scoring amongst defenseman this season. Last year Guentzel was 11th, and Hanifin was 20th. Once you account for Guentzel spending the majority of that time with Crosby, they actually line up almost identically in positional rankings. Noah Hanifin is just one of the most slept on players in the league because he doesn’t have a flashy bone in his body.

Guentzel is the better player, but Hanifin is younger and plays the more important position. Think their values are actually pretty even.

Guentzal also had 8 goals in 7 playoff games last season

 

[Zbynek]

From Pens POV it is difficult to draft up a Guentzel proposal without the result being lateral at best. Consider the fact the Pens window is realistically 2 (maybe 3) more years. Guentzel at 6 million for another year is potentially a huge piece of the puzzle for a 2024 run. There are no bargains like that on the market.

The minute you ship out Jake you have to replace his 40 goal production and above all his incredible chemistry with Sid. My gut feeling is Crosby would nix any trade that involves him.

If you do trade him, you need an instant impact player. Offensive prospects make no sense for the Penguins right now. Marner could make sense on paper (to replace production) but at a cost of 5 million more cap per year. That money could be used to address real needs (depth scoring, potentially another top-6 winger if Zucker walks) and again, I just feel it'd be a lateral move at best when you still have Jake at 6 million for 1 more year. Though, I will say with Marner his contract term fits the Penguins window, so that idea isn't incredibly far off - I just don't love it from a cap perspective. It's also a chemistry gamble though sure, he could be a great piece for either Sid or Geno.

For me the deal that would make most sense is to get a proven goalie who can step in from day 1 (Saros/Hellebuyck). Such a goalie would instantly become the best Penguins goalie ever (analytically) and give them an impact goalie in net to give them a chance for these last 2 or 3 years. Penguins still have to replace Guentzel's production but it could be done with the right moves and cap allocation. Whereas with Marner, his 10.9 mil cap hit is a stranglehold on other moves.

 

[Zbynek]

Guentzel was 36th in even strength scoring amongst forwards this season. Noah Hanifin was 29th in even strength scoring amongst defenseman this season. Last year Guentzel was 11th, and Hanifin was 20th. Once you account for Guentzel spending the majority of that time with Crosby, they actually line up almost identically in positional rankings. Noah Hanifin is just one of the most slept on players in the league because he doesn’t have a flashy bone in his body.

Guentzel is the better player, but Hanifin is younger and plays the more important position. Think their values are actually pretty even.

This is a bizarre, cherry-picking manipulation of stats in an effort to inflate Hanifin's trade value. He's a fine defenseman, but he is nowhere near worth a Jake Guentzel.

It is so ridiculous to insinuate these guys values are "actually pretty even".

Guentzel is a top-15 player at his position and Hanifin is maybe top-50.

 

[CaliforniaBlues310]

Saad+Bolduc+TOR 1st

 

[Gurglesons]

Saad+Bolduc+TOR 1st

nah.