Value of: Jake Gardiner to Edmonton

[XXIV97]

Future value does not equal immediate value. Gardiner can play top minutes today. He is a point generating machine. He fills a roll. This whole line of discussion came from people disparaging gardiners value and generally all the leafs defense.

The Oilers aren't going to win in the next 2 years.

And the Leafs shouldn't trade Gardiner. They can keep him for the beginning of the season to slow bring in Dermott then maybe trade Gardiner at the deadline

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Buddy you should check your stats. Over the past 4-5 years jake is a 30+point defenceman, and every year his point totals have pretty much increased. He has his faults, but he is massively underrated. The guy also averages over 75 games a year.

We were talking about Brown....

 

[Notsince67]

The Oilers aren't going to win in the next 2 years.

And the Leafs shouldn't trade Gardiner. They can keep him for the beginning of the season to slow bring in Dermott then maybe trade Gardiner at the deadline

I agree. Only way the leafs trade Gardiner is if they have a need for Salary Cap space for a big new signing.

 

[BudBundy]

Future value does not equal immediate value. Gardiner can play top minutes today. He is a point generating machine. He fills a roll. This whole line of discussion came from people disparaging gardiners value and generally all the leafs defense.

His future value is less than today given his contractual status, and his present value isnt much to the Oilers given that he’d likely be their 3rd best LH shot D. Nurse played top line minutes most of this year, and Klefbom played top line minutes last year.
Gardiner fills a “roll” in Edmonton? Like, what, a sushi roll? A dinner roll? He wouldnt fill a role on a team that already has Klef, Nurse, Sekera and Russell. I’m not here to bash the Leafs lineup given how theyve turned things around much faster than our bag of mush has, but Gardiner is not something the Oilers would have any need for and I cant understand why you keep pushing it.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

His future value is less than today given his contractual status, and his present value isnt much to the Oilers given that he’d likely be their 3rd best LH shot D. Nurse played top line minutes most of this year, and Klefbom played top line minutes last year.
Gardiner fills a “roll” in Edmonton? Like, what, a sushi roll? A dinner roll? He wouldnt fill a role on a team that already has Klef, Nurse, Sekera and Russell. I’m not here to bash the Leafs lineup given how theyve turned things around much faster than our bag of mush has, but Gardiner is not something the Oilers would have any need for and I cant understand why you keep pushing it.

Just wondering why you think Gardiner plays behind both Nurse and Klefbom?

Gardiner had 5 more points than Klefbom and Nurse combined last year and I thought Edmonton were looking for more offense from the backend which Gardiner would provide.

 

[Notsince67]

His future value is less than today given his contractual status, and his present value isnt much to the Oilers given that he’d likely be their 3rd best LH shot D. Nurse played top line minutes most of this year, and Klefbom played top line minutes last year.
Gardiner fills a “roll” in Edmonton? Like, what, a sushi roll? A dinner roll? He wouldnt fill a role on a team that already has Klef, Nurse, Sekera and Russell. I’m not here to bash the Leafs lineup given how theyve turned things around much faster than our bag of mush has, but Gardiner is not something the Oilers would have any need for and I cant understand why you keep pushing it.

Gardiner has more points than all but 2 players on the oilers. Stop resisting and bow to his greatness already

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I agree. Only way the leafs trade Gardiner is if they have a need for Salary Cap space for a big new signing.

You don’t have space for a big new signing, with or without Gardiner - unless you’re planning on giving Tavares 14x1.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Just wondering why you think Gardiner plays behind both Nurse and Klefbom?

Gardiner had 5 more points than Klefbom and Nurse combined last year and I thought Edmonton were looking for more offense from the backend which Gardiner would provide.

Because points aren’t the only consideration and Gardiner should be playing as sheltered minutes as he could possibly be given.

Adding Gardiner actually causes a big problem - not enough icetime to go around for all the lefties and Klefbom and Nurse are better overall. What are we supposed to do, healthy scratch Sekera and his 5.5 mil contract?

Nah, we’ll just stick with our guys.

 

[Brobust]

You don’t have space for a big new signing, with or without Gardiner - unless you’re planning on giving Tavares 14x1.

I love how Oilers fans have more knowledge of Toronto's cap situation than leafs fans.

The leafs could give Tavares $11 million x 8 years and still not be in any serious cap trouble for the next 4-5 years.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I love how Oilers fans have more knowledge of Toronto's cap situation than leafs fans.

The leafs could give Tavares $11 million x 8 years and still not be in any serious cap trouble for the next 4-5 years.

Lol. Is this before or after your big three sign ridiculously team friendly deals because reasons?

 

[rent free]

I love how Oilers fans have more knowledge of Toronto's cap situation than leafs fans.

The leafs could give Tavares $11 million x 8 years and still not be in any serious cap trouble for the next 4-5 years.

And can still deploy the same weak defense that holds them back in games.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

And can still deploy the same weak defense that holds them back in games.

You mean the same defence that when healthy helped us to a 100+ point season and a better goals against...?

 

[BudBundy]

Just wondering why you think Gardiner plays behind both Nurse and Klefbom?

Gardiner had 5 more points than Klefbom and Nurse combined last year and I thought Edmonton were looking for more offense from the backend which Gardiner would provide.

Before his shoulder-plagued 2017-18, Klef played top pair minutes very effectively and makes a nice pairing with Larsson. His contract is friendly and long-term. Nurse is an emerging killer. He was our best D all year. He will be a shutdown “Marc-Edouard Vlasic” type in 6,4” punch your face off package, also on a friendly contract. Gardiner doesnt play ahead of either on the LH side. The Oilers problem is we have Russell forced into a 2nd pairing on the right side D.

 

[rent free]

You mean the same defence that when healthy helped us to a 100+ point season and a better goals against...?

I was talking about Toronto's defense.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

I was talking about Toronto's defense.

Ah.

Yeah, defence is the Leafs Achilles heel right now. If Andersson regresses at all or has a bad year like Talbot did you could be in trouble

 

[BudBundy]

Because he's clueless.

Thats the kind of value-added comment we’ve grown to expect from you. See my reasoning in other post.

 

[rent free]

Ah.

Yeah, defence is the Leafs Achilles heel right now. If Andersson regresses at all or has a bad year like Talbot did you could be in trouble

you mean we will be in trouble

 

[BudBundy]

Gardiner has more points than all but 2 players on the oilers. Stop resisting and bow to his greatness already

Honestly if he was a RH shot and we could afford him, I’d be all for it. Unfortunately he is neither.

 

[Brobust]

And can still deploy the same weak defense that holds them back in games.

You have such a simplistic take on everything.

I guess, in your world forwards have nothing to do with defence. Toronto's main issue last season was irresponsible forwards like JVR blowing the defensive zone too early or making lazy passes out of the zone.

And I know if the leafs defence improves without making any additions next season, then you'll conveniently ignore that and move onto something else to complain about.

 

[rent free]

You have such a simplistic take on everything.

I guess, in your world forwards have nothing to do with defence. Toronto's main issue last season was irresponsible forwards like JVR blowing the defensive zone too early or making lazy passes out of the zone.

And I know if the leafs defence improves without making any additions next season, then you'll conveniently ignore that and move onto something else to complain about.

you act like as if its only the forwards fault the defense is terrible. its just not them, its the blueline as well. thats the leafs biggest issue. they have guys playing too high up in the lineup than where they should be playing. the defense turns over the puck way too many times and they get hemmed in their own zone way too much because of their inability to properly clear the puck

 

[therealkoho]

what is all this "rental" talk

a rental is a guy going UFA that you acquire at the deadline that you really have no intention of keeping, just a guy who you hope will help you get really deep

if during the summer an NHL GM is going to trade for a guy with a year left on his contract, then you can be assured that they're looking at the player as a long term guy with an eye on extending him. You would have a long chat with the players agent and at least get a feel of whether he'll sign with your team, or if the salary demand is or isn't sympatico with the cap.

So no Gardiner would not be a rental, nor treated as one

 

[6ix]

Ah.

Yeah, defence is the Leafs Achilles heel right now. If Andersson regresses at all or has a bad year like Talbot did you could be in trouble

You love talking about past seasons when it benefits the oilers, but then love talking about the present when it debenefits other team and players.

Jake Gardiner was a beast in the shortened season playoffs against Boston, as well as against Washington before having a terrible game 7 this year, but you don’t talk about that.


Klefbom had one good year last year, that could of been an absolute fluke, as he was brutal for the WHOLE season not just a game here and there.

I’m not a big Jake Gardiner fan but your double standard is embarrassing when it comes to player and asset evaluation.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

You love talking about past seasons when it benefits the oilers, but then love talking about the present when it debenefits other team and players.

Jake Gardiner was a beast in the shortened season playoffs against Boston, as well as against Washington before having a terrible game 7 this year, but you don’t talk about that.


Klefbom had one good year last year, that could of been an absolute fluke, as he was brutal for the WHOLE season not just a game here and there.

I’m not a big Jake Gardiner fan but your double standard is embarrassing when it comes to player and asset evaluation.

Klefbom played with 22 bone chips in his shoulder all season long. That’s been cleaned up now.

If you look back at his advanced stats Klefbom has actually been damned good his entire career.

Gardiner has always been at best average in his own zone - not just this year, his entire career - and we are not in a position to give up 10th to rent him. He’s an offensively minded 3-4 defenceman. Great. Bully for you guys. Keep him or trade him, I don’t care. He’s not a fit here and on an overall basis he is not an upgrade over what we already have. We also can’t afford him either short or long term.

You guys have been given 1001 reasons why OP is a bad trade for us but you won’t let it f***ing go. Drop it already.

As for the post you replied to, your defence is much worse than your offense. Everyone knows that. Andersson also had a great year and if he doesn’t have a great year next year you’re in trouble. I’m not sure why that’s so inflammatory.

 

[Kelly]

You just cannot roll 3 pairs equally because there is such a massive drop off on the right side.

I guarantee you that you'll end up angry if they don't trade Gardiner, because I'm very confident that they're not extending him, especially because Dubas is a big Dermott believer.

No I won't. I'll end up angry if they end up trading Gardiner without getting a player back that doesn't improve our team, or atleast offset his loss.

Also I don't agree with your first point, that's what they've already been doing with Hainsey and Zaitzev, with Rielly and Gardiner being the better players on that pair.

Hopefully Dubas is a big believer in having a good team too, because trading Gardiner for what you've proposed significantly weakens us.

 

[BM14]

Lol. Is this before or after your big three sign ridiculously team friendly deals because reasons?

Unlike Edmonton, people actually want to play in an important NHL city.
They'll sign fair to slightly below market value.