Value of: Jake Evans

[Qwijibo]

Getting a first for taking on a cap dump is pretty normal. That wasn't some masterclass by Hughes, it was par the course. Getting a first from Winnipeg for a player like Monahan was a normal trade, again not some masterclass or fleecing.

Laine was another cap dump who clearly had no interest in playing for his team at the time and was damaged goods. Columbus didn't have many options given he's overpaid and they didn't want to retain.

If you say so

 

[Chose]

Will he be the first Hab to accept differed money to lower his AAV ?

Hugues was asked about it in his press conference today

 

[pth2]

In Canada the top federal income tax bracket which after the first quarter million was 33%

If you're going to correct me, at least give complete information and not incomplete info that gives the wrong impression.
In Quebec, combined federal and provincial income tax is 53.31%

TaxTips.ca - Quebec 2024 & 2025 Tax Rates & Tax Brackets

TaxTips.ca - Quebec tax rates for 2024 & 2025 for eligible and non-eligible dividends, capital gains, and other income.

www.taxtips.ca

 

[Mrfenn92]

Evans looking at a jt Compher type of contract?

 

[Wayfarer13]

If you're going to correct me, at least give complete information and not incomplete info that gives the wrong impression.
In Quebec, combined federal and provincial income tax is 53.31%

TaxTips.ca - Quebec 2024 & 2025 Tax Rates & Tax Brackets

TaxTips.ca - Quebec tax rates for 2024 & 2025 for eligible and non-eligible dividends, capital gains, and other income.

www.taxtips.ca

That would be bracket. What is the effective rate including what you pay if your accountant is decent for someone paid a million cause one not be paying $533,100? Does not happen in the real world.

 

[Captain Mountain]

I read somewhere this morning, I think it was Spector, that the league won't do anything about it. They approved it. And it kinda shuts down the long lasting idea that some teams have an edge because of taxes on player's revenues. At least it provides players & teams a way around it.

I think Montreal should really look into this...

The league hasn't done anything about it, doesn't mean they wont. Its likely going to be the same as the super long contracts to bring down the AAV - the NHL will keep warning teams until one crosses the murky line of what they deem clear cap circumvention and get hit with a punishment.

They are still paying 50% income tax on that 5M, and most tax-sheltered accounts (RRSP, RESP, and TFSA, in Canada) have limited contribution room. Evans' 7k TFSA contribution is a drop in the bucket, overall. (I'd take that drop anytime, though)

You're right that capital gains from investments should be pushed back, allowing them to realize those gains from another tax jurisdiction.

RRSP, RESP and TFSA are not the only ways individuals can shelter capital gains and/or defer tax.

 

[Bone Density]

The Devils are among the teams that have called the Canadiens about acquiring pending unrestricted free agent center Jake Evans ahead of the March 7 trade deadline, Pierre LeBrun of TSN said on “Early Trading” on Thursday.​

 

[Maitz]

The thing with Montreal is that we already have a bunch of picks and we need more quality than quantity right now, I wouldn't be against trading a 3rd or late 2nd with Evans to go up for a late first but trading him for a 3rd or AHL prospect doesn't change anything. I'd rather keep him at that point, very good veteran

 

[covfefe]

They are still paying 50% income tax on that 5M, and most tax-sheltered accounts (RRSP, RESP, and TFSA, in Canada) have limited contribution room. Evans' 7k TFSA contribution is a drop in the bucket, overall. (I'd take that drop anytime, though)

You're right that capital gains from investments should be pushed back, allowing them to realize those gains from another tax jurisdiction.

Sure, but they simply set up RCA's instead. There's a sizeable ecosystem built around this & avoiding the eventual outcome set you're thinking of is not that hard, it's just expensive.

In Canada the top federal income tax bracket which after the first quarter million was 33%

Factor in provincial tax rates and consumption taxes and you're getting much closer to 65 than you are 33. QC alone hits these guys at 25.75% for our 41 home games. O Canada!

 

[Wayfarer13]

Sure, but they simply set up RCA's instead. There's a sizeable ecosystem built around this & avoiding the eventual outcome set you're thinking of is not that hard, it's just expensive.



Factor in provincial tax rates and consumption taxes and you're getting much closer to 65 than you are 33. QC alone hits these guys at 25.75% for our 41 home games. O Canada!

Can you explain what happened with the Tavares tax scandal?

 

[Habs Halifax]

Evans looking at a jt Compher type of contract?

C Coyle comes to my mind. Evans's numbers are a little behind Coyle's from the Wild but you can see the same type of thing. Someone who is showing maturity and does the little things well.

Pretty sure Evans' agent will make the Coyle comparison and add inflation. Reaching a little but that's what agents do. It also depends on how Evans finishes the season as well.

I think the next 3-5 years will be good years for Evans.

 

[BLONG7]

Always interesting, most guys, who are on expiring contracts, seem to play better....
I hope we keep Evans, but only if his agent is going to be somewhat reasonable......I would go 4M X 4 years and as the cap rises and we rid ourselves of bad contracts ( Dvo,Gally, Andy ) that should be a decent deal for both sides.

 

[Vitto79]

Montreal should sell no matter what

 

[Habs Halifax]

Montreal should sell no matter what

7/8 years in the difference between Suzuki and Demidov. That's our core build up and we want to transition up. Then there is a gap after Suzuki. Dach is playing well lately, so lets say he stays at 2C. Then what without Evans? Just pencil in Beck and Kapanen next year? Who are not ready for full time center roles in the NHL?

It's one thing for one or both of Beck and Kapanen to crack the roster next year as wingers with a good center to shelter them but the other way around? We just went through that with Barron on our D. He was not ready and the ripple effects with our team D was massive.

We will consider selling but this is not some automatic yes or no answer. There will be a lot of circumstances that play out in the next 6 weeks.

 

[japhi27returns]

If they trade him they are gapped in the top 9 and need to insta replace him. Beck may be the guy, but thats a big jump from the AHL. So I can’t see a trade for picks, you need C depth coming back.

I think they figure out a way to sign him.

 

[CTHabsfan]

Montreal should sell no matter what

Armia and Savard are only ever going to bring back 3rd (or possibly a 2nd if the market is seller friendly as it is some years and not others). They just aren't good enough to fetch more.

But Evans... That guy is really good. Habs will be worse on the ice the moment he's not on the roster. He'd be like losing a Danault or Artturi Lehkonen. He's not as good as either of them, but he is cut from the same cloth type of player.

Easily the most value TDL asset the Habs have this season.

Don't be surprised when Jake Evans signs his next contract that looks like this.

6 years $29.4MM (AAV of $4.9MM/per).

If 6 years $29.4MM (AAV of $4.9MM/per) is what Jake Evans is looking for, I'd agree Montreal should sell no matter what. If Evans is agreeable to 50% of the term and 60% of the AAV, I'd keep him.

 

[Habs Halifax]

The Devils are among the teams that have called the Canadiens about acquiring pending unrestricted free agent center Jake Evans ahead of the March 7 trade deadline, Pierre LeBrun of TSN said on “Early Trading” on Thursday.​

One thing he said as added context is the Devils have Evans on their list but the list is just not 3 players. LeBrun knows how fans/media can spin things and the past talk about if players get a 1st rounder or not.

I have no doubt in my mind that several of the top 10 teams have circled Evans as a potential target but then you wonder... teams hate trading those 1st. Some teams will call and give the 2nd and B+ prospect knowing that Hughes might get the 1st from someone else. They tell Hughes to call me back if you don't. That type of thing.

However, I do think the late 1st is very possible. Supply/Demand for centers will be high and I just don't see too much options? Do you?

 

[Habs Halifax]

If 6 years $29.4MM (AAV of $4.9MM/per) is what Jake Evans is looking for, I'd agree Montreal should sell no matter what. If Evans is agreeable to 50% of the term and 60% of the AAV, I'd keep him.

3 years is the sweet spot for the Habs. It overlaps Demidov's ELC and also gives more time to properly develop Kapanen, Beck, Hage at center.

Monahan just got 5 years at $5.5M. Evans has been playing well and is a very effective center but no way Evans is getting 6 years at $4.9M from anybody. If teams offer the 6 year term, they will offer $4M or less.

Evans has earned his right and is playing well. But this is being overblown a bit. He's an effective 3C. This is not some Monahan or Danault situation.... Evans is good but not as good as them.

3x $4M from the Habs. I can see some teams offering 5x $4M.

 

[Maitz]

I don't get how he is worth 4M now?? He got a good streak but that's it, he is still a valuable 4th liner that can play 3rd line sometimes, very valuable in PO but if I am the I offer him 3x3M and that a steep price for a 4th liner. I would trade him for a 2nd if a team offer it

 

[Gaud]

Lehkonen is one of the best two-way wingers in the NHL and wasn’t even a pending UFA at the time. His underlying metrics before he got dealt while he was still with Montreal were outstanding.

It was a fine/fair return at the time (downright terrible now) - but that hardly fits conveniently in your broad “fleecing” bucket. The idea that nobody knew who Lehkonen was and that he didn’t show some pretty incredible metrics before being dealt is completely revisionist. There was absolutely sentiment on the Habs board at the time of “shit he’s gonna explode with a team that knows how to use him”.

Not a fleecing at all. Not even when it happened.

Kulak was for a 2nd and a 7th and Edmonton does that deal over again in a heartbeat. Kulak is a legitimate defender who is soaking in really effective top four minutes for a Cup finals team. Also not even remotely close to a “fleecing” then or now.

The idea that you feel somehow Hughes or Montreal “got one over” Colorado or Edmonton in these deals is rich. Hughes has been good IMO and has gotten some good deals done but he’s definitely not infallible.

I am not sure i agree with the term "fleecing" to describe those trades, but i do think they earned more than anyone other than habs fans believed. Also, most of all deadline trades by nature are overpayments.

Lekhonen was a model player off and on the ice, but he got 18 goals in his first season with the habs and never came close again before Colorado. We both agree that as a bottom 6 on D missions, his stats were amazing. However, habs fans were willing to let him go because he wasn't a unique player. Most folks didnt believe he would return a 2nd at the time, let alone a prospect on top of that. I dont think folks thought he would explode in colorado because the guy had chances to score every single game and somehow missed 90 percent of them (it was laughable lol )

Kulak was a bottom 6 - did some good stuff with Oilers, but even I didnt think he would get more than an 2nd. Your argument about him being soaking in top four minutes for a cup finals team only works after he was traded, and im not sure his evaluation ever had him on a top 4 SC finalist team beforehand.

Chiarot was another player that habs fans thought would get a first. I agreed just because D are always getting overpaid at tdl. Still, a fleecing is stretching it.

they are all solid returns and i thought the way KH handled Monahan was great! Monahan was happy and hte habs got 2 firsts.

 

[Smitty426]

One thing he said as added context is the Devils have Evans on their list but the list is just not 3 players. LeBrun knows how fans/media can spin things and the past talk about if players get a 1st rounder or not.

I have no doubt in my mind that several of the top 10 teams have circled Evans as a potential target but then you wonder... teams hate trading those 1st. Some teams will call and give the 2nd and B+ prospect knowing that Hughes might get the 1st from someone else. They tell Hughes to call me back if you don't. That type of thing.

However, I do think the late 1st is very possible. Supply/Demand for centers will be high and I just don't see too much options? Do you?

He may get a late 1st but I hope Fitz doesn't spend that kind of draft capital on him. We have 3- 2nds (as long as Allen does not get 40 games) and some other prospects. Our 1st this year goes to CGY. Devs probably need a top 6 depth guy and a bottom forward at a minimum to make any real noise.

 

[Habs Halifax]

He may get a late 1st but I hope Fitz doesn't spend that kind of draft capital on him. We have 3- 2nds (as long as Allen does not get 40 games) and some other prospects. Our 1st this year goes to CGY. Devs probably need a top 6 depth guy and a bottom forward at a minimum to make any real noise.

What is happening with the Evans situation is this...

1) Both the Habs and Evans want to stay in Montreal. However, he is likely after the 5 year term and we want 3 years. 3 years overlaps Demidov's ELC and sets up well to pay him. Then we also have 3 years to properly develop Beck, Kapanen, and Hage.

2) If Evans stands his ground and will go to UFA if he don't get his preferred AAV and term, Habs will consider moving him if the price is something we can't refuse. We are trying to chase the playoffs so if the offers are two 2nd rounders (lets say), Habs will consider keeping Evans for our run and see if we can extend him after July 1st when he talks to all teams.

Habs have two 2nd's, three 3rd's and two 4th's in this next draft and our pool is already loaded with grade B types. We also have two 1sts but would add another because we probably try to use those picks to either trade down or get in on a trade that brings a player on our roster now. Gives us more options.

As far as you not wanting to trade your 1st for a 3C. I totally understand. In the very near future, the Habs should be a playoff team and we will be on the opposite end looking for a guy like Evans at a TDL and prefer not to trade our 1st as well. Problem is that supply/demand and not just one team in on Evans. That will drive the price up

 

[Habs Halifax]

I am not sure i agree with the term "fleecing" to describe those trades, but i do think they earned more than anyone other than habs fans believed. Also, most of all deadline trades by nature are overpayments.

Lekhonen was a model player off and on the ice, but he got 18 goals in his first season with the habs and never came close again before Colorado. We both agree that as a bottom 6 on D missions, his stats were amazing. However, habs fans were willing to let him go because he wasn't a unique player. Most folks didnt believe he would return a 2nd at the time, let alone a prospect on top of that. I dont think folks thought he would explode in colorado because the guy had chances to score every single game and somehow missed 90 percent of them (it was laughable lol )

Kulak was a bottom 6 - did some good stuff with Oilers, but even I didnt think he would get more than an 2nd. Your argument about him being soaking in top four minutes for a cup finals team only works after he was traded, and im not sure his evaluation ever had him on a top 4 SC finalist team beforehand.

Chiarot was another player that habs fans thought would get a first. I agreed just because D are always getting overpaid at tdl. Still, a fleecing is stretching it.

they are all solid returns and i thought the way KH handled Monahan was great! Monahan was happy and hte habs got 2 firsts.

It's not fleecing. I agree with that. It's a typical TDL and supply/demand sets the price. Nobody likes to trade 1st rounders (even late ones) but what happens is when a guy like Evans is sought after by 3-5 teams, it drives the price up.

Any other team in our shoes would take the same approach. It's just business. There is a clear trend of contenders looking for a 3C and Evans has a very good cap hit to fit in as well as other adds a contender can make that fit their cap. Contenders are not just looking to make one move so when a guy like Evans can be added at a low cap hit, it allows them to chase other adds.

 

[Smitty426]

What is happening with the Evans situation is this...

1) Both the Habs and Evans want to stay in Montreal. However, he is likely after the 5 year term and we want 3 years. 3 years overlaps Demidov's ELC and sets up well to pay him. Then we also have 3 years to properly develop Beck, Kapanen, and Hage.

2) If Evans stands his ground and will go to UFA if he don't get his preferred AAV and term, Habs will consider moving him if the price is something we can't refuse. We are trying to chase the playoffs so if the offers are two 2nd rounders (lets say), Habs will consider keeping Evans for our run and see if we can extend him after July 1st when he talks to all teams.

Habs have two 2nd's, three 3rd's and two 4th's in this next draft and our pool is already loaded with grade B types. We also have two 1sts but would add another because we probably try to use those picks to either trade down or get in on a trade that brings a player on our roster now. Gives us more options.

As far as you not wanting to trade your 1st for a 3C. I totally understand. In the very near future, the Habs should be a playoff team and we will be on the opposite end looking for a guy like Evans at a TDL and prefer not to trade our 1st as well. Problem is that supply/demand and not just one team in on Evans. That will drive the price up

all great points

 

[Habs Halifax]

all great points

I do wish you luck in your search. Sometimes, it's best to chase the unattractive piece but still gets the job done. Evans is too much of a target by several teams IMO.

I'd be looking at guys with some term left instead. Getting a body that fills that spot for 2 years makes more sense if you were forced to give up the late 1st.

It will be interesting to see how the Habs manage Evans and Savard while we chase the playoffs.